L48 or L4610?

[Tags]

Re: L48 Loader Problems

I talked to the dealer again late this afternoon and he told me the valve was the loader spool valve off of an R520 loader NOT an R420,just wanted to correct what I had posted earlier.

 

[johnjc]

Re: L48 Loader Problems

Over the weekend I a chance to try the latest fixes to my L 48 loader. As my previous posts document The dealer had removed my hydraulic leveler valve and ran the hoes directly to the loader curl cylinders. With that configuration I was happy with the loader operation at first but after running for several hours the hydraulic oil got hot and the loader lost power both curl and lift.
There was some confusion on my part about what they were changing for the heat up problem. Service manager said it was the leveler valve but on my second trip to the dealer. I got to talk to the mechanic as he was finishing up the replacement and what he had replaced was the front distribution block. Told me that the pressure was falling of about 500 lb. when it got hot. He also adjusted the system relief on the new distribution block so that the pressure was on the high end of it range when measured at the backhoe connection point to offset pressure drop in the system. Some thing over 2900 lb.
He also reinstalled the hydraulic leveler valve, seems Kubota wanted it back on. Probably a liability issue.
Now the results.
The first thing I did was to drive the front wheels over the edge of a bank to sinuate getting stuck. I put the HST in neutral, set the loader bucket down vertical and tried to push myself backwards by curling the bucket. This had worked when the hydraulic leveler was removed but I couldn’t do it now. This is important for me as I plan to use the tractor to maintain skid trails and to skid logs and sometimes get stuck. I see an improvement in the ability to back drag with a vertical bucket. Probably do to setting the system pressure on the high side. But it is still marginal. When loading the loader with slate rock and dirt which is pretty heavy I find the curl to be a little weak, again it worked good with the hydraulic leveler removed.
Stopped in to talk with the dealer and he suggested that I call Kubota again. Called the regional center in Columbus Ohio and the person I had talked to was in class so I left a message and got called back by a John from W. NY . Talked about the problem and he is going to talk to the rep for my area and get back to me.
Incidentally he ask about the backhoe outriggers. (mine work great) and a meeting with Kubota Management that I see in other posts her.
From looking at how the hydraulic leveler works it looks like Kubota will have to replace the cylinders on the loader with larger ones or go to a mechanical system like the new John Deere 110 uses .
It might help if everyone who is seeing this problem would call Kubota and complain Loudly !

John

 

[toy1]

I have been following the problems related to the L48 bucket hydraulics. I have just sold my L2900 and will receive my new L48 on Friday.I have gone to the dealer and have tried to duplicate the problem on a L48 with 56 hours on it .I have seen were if the bucket is on the ground their is not enought pressure to uncurl the bucket the relief valve goes off. However if the bucket is in an uncurl position and you put down force from the lift cylinders and you start to back grade, the bucket holds steady. My Dealer stated that their is a service bulletin that deals with the problem of the relief valve, and a kit to make the change. I hope I am not making a mistake on the L48 purchase.

 

[JATO_RaT]

toy1, I have an L48, it is a fantastic machine. As you mentioned, it is quite easy to position the bucket the way you describe. I have confidence that Kubota is dealing with the lower pressure on bucket dump or extend and have no remorse whatsoever with my L48. To date I have around 65 hours and hundreds of yards of material removed. Great tractor, Rat...

 

[johnjc]

Re: L48 Loader Problems

Toy1
Still waiting for a call back from the Kubota service rep. His voice mail currently says he is still out of town. The fact that my loader worked fine when my dealer had my hydraulic leveler valve disconnected shows the L48 basic design I OK. They just need to come up with a leveling system that doesn't make the loader weak. Other than that the L48 is a great machine and I'm sure that you will be happy with it once the loader problem is straightened out. Once you take delivery be sure to let us know your impressions.

Question - Does anyone know if the loader valve off of the R520 uses mechanical leveling?

John

 

[johnjc]

Re: L48 Loader Problems

Not 20 min. after my last post I got a call back from Todd Bectel the area Kubota Service Rep. And the word is that if you have the new loader valve installed and pressure testing shows that pressures are within limits then the tractor is working as designed. He told me that there is nothing in the works in the way of changes. Ask about the R520 valve that is mentioned in some of the posts and according to him they aren't doing anything with it.
When I ask him how to go about asking for my money back He suggested that I talk to the dealer about trading my tractor in on something else. Don't know what they have that isn't smaller than the L48. Also told me that, although it not in writing,. If a change came out, even after the warranty has expired and you had a complaint on file they would probably give you the upgrade. Next Step ???
John

 

[Tags]

Re: L48 Loader Problems

Crap,crap,crap!!!!!!I just don't get it w/this company...they are HUMONGOUS,make thousands of machines that work CORRECTLY yet they say that not being able to "tilt" the bucket down w/pressure on it is "normal"! Wrong, try again dumbass!!! My L35 doesn't have this prob. a B21 doesn't, a JD 4600 doesn't, a Quickway loader mounted on a gravely 20 hp gardentractor doesn't !!! Imagine if you couldn't "tilt" the bucket on a full size tlb.....my point is that Kubota is marketing this machine as "construction grade" yet it doesn't perform like a construction grade machine . I know to some reading this post it doesn't seem like a big deal that you can't tilt the bucket with pressure on it but just imagine trying to hold a grade while backblading you go to tilt the bucket down and it curls up...why gee, thats efficient, how handy!! I know this little rant may seem a bit overbearing but it just really bugs me that they have a "well thats the way it is attitude" if you spend the $ for a good loader,then it should perform like a LOADER!!! As for me after hearing the reps response I am definetly holding off on buying an L48 .....I'm gonna wait to try the new DEERE 110!

 

[Tags]

Re: L48 Loader Problems

Crap,crap,crap!!!!!!I just don't get it w/this company...they are HUMONGOUS,make thousands of machines that work CORRECTLY yet they say that not being able to "tilt" the bucket down w/pressure on it is "normal"! Wrong, try again dumbass!!! My L35 doesn't have this prob. a B21 doesn't, a JD 4600 doesn't, a Quickway loader mounted on a gravely 20 hp gardentractor doesn't !!! Imagine if you couldn't "tilt" the bucket on a full size tlb.....my point is that Kubota is marketing this machine as "construction grade" yet it doesn't perform like a construction grade machine . I know to some reading this post it doesn't seem like a big deal that you can't tilt the bucket with pressure on it but just imagine trying to hold a grade while backblading you go to tilt the bucket down and it curls up...why gee, thats efficient, how handy!! I know this little rant may seem a bit overbearing but it just really bugs me that they have a "well thats the way it is attitude" if you spend the $ for a good loader,then it should perform like a LOADER!!! As for me after hearing the reps response I am definetly holding off on buying an L48 .....I'm gonna wait to try the new DEERE 110,maybe their loader will work like its supposed to!

 

[MarkV]

Re: L48 Loader Problems

John,

That is a rather disappointing response!/w3tcompact/icons/frown.gif Lets hope this guy was having a bad day. I believe I would start with a certified letter to Kubota and the dealer expressing my dissatisfaction with the response that the service rep gave. I would also start chasing down the regional service manager so that he knows how many times your tractor has been in the shop and still doesn’t work as it should. It is time to start a paper trail of your problems.

John, the rep says,<font color=blue> that if you have the new loader valve installed and pressure testing shows that pressures are within limits then the tractor is working as designed.</font color=blue> I reread the whole thread, did the loader system ever get pressure tested or were all the pressure test done at the backhoe connections. If I understand Kubmech’s post, testing at the backhoe is reading the main relief valve but does not address the individual loader circuits. I don’t understand how Kubota could say pressure was OK without taking readings at the loader cylinders.

It sounds like everyone with a L48 has some degree of problem with the self-leveling system and bucket dump circuit. It is time for all of you to write or call the regional office and make your voice heard. When Kubota does figure out what went wrong with the design, they are not going to call you and offer to retro fit your system unless you have. It sounds like they are going to keep the problem quiet so as not to hurt sales and slip a fix in when they figure it out.

Tags says it better than I, <font color=blue> Crap,crap,crap!!!!!!</font color=blue> I couldn’t agree more.

MarkV

 

[JATO_RaT]

Re: L48 Loader Problems

MarkV, I must first of all tell you that I am very satisfied with the performance of my L48. Believe it or not, the Bucket extend problem is not nearly as big of a deal as perhaps it is being demonstrated here. I can do everything I have ever been able to do that non self-leveling tractor even with a lack of bucket extend or dump pressure. The self leveler works very well. Out of the thousands sold, very few are actually being complained about. While I would like a little more extend power, it is quite tolerable for me. The L48 has so many great features like a loader system that is as close to industrial as you can get, a power steering that does not know whether it has a load on it or not, a HST, control layout, strength, etc, that will be hard to match for a compact. If John is really having a problem that he cannot deal with, my suggestion is to circumvent the hydraulic self loader and use it like any other compact that does not have this feature. Sure he paid for it, but it actually works quite well for most of us. I certainly hope that Kubota can provide John with a remedy in the near future. The L 48 despite having less power in bucket dump, is a very, very nice tractor. Rat....

 

[Tags]

Re: L48 Loader Problems

Rat,
By all means the L48 is a GREAT machine.I know my post is a bit harsh,and it is more directed at the fact that Kubota isn't really addressing the problem like I (and I would imagine others) feel they should.Could people live with the problem...sure.....there are worse things, but my point still is that it doesn't perform like a loader should and Kubota knows it ,yet their answer to John (who,if was using his machine to make a living would be about 2 weeks behind schedule because the dealer has had his machine soooo much)is to buy another machine. The answer:acknowledge the problem and fix it,if they did that I'd buy one tomorrow.

I absolutly,100% agree with Mark,any of you guys with this problem should send a certified letter to Kubota, the area rep,and probably the dealer, if they get enough ill response from owners they will have to address this problem. This whole thing has got me so torqued up, I'm gonna, and I don't even own one!

 

[ozarkhorses]

Re: L48 Loader Problems

My L48 is coming up for it's 50 hour service. I've informed my dealer of my FEL problem, as detailed in previous posts here, and they have been given a list of parts that are to be installed and modified, sight unseen. Not a whisper of dissention from Kubota. The work is probably going to be undertaken sometime next week and I'll report back.

 

[foz]

Re: L48 Loader Problems

I just met with the Kubota design guy (from Japan), a rep from Georgia factory (loaders) and a design tech from California at my local dealer on Monday. Info. as follows:

1. the first fix for lack of downpressure on the loader bucket was a new valve. Unfortunately that valve needs to put put to relief first & then curl the bucket down and you can scrape all day with downpressure. There is currently a TSB to fix teh problem & dealers will get info. as it becomes available.

2. If you purchased the quick coupler for the bucket, there is a TSB out to weld the spring retention washers as they are currently held by 2 pins which are inadequate.

3. If you have trouble with leak down at your backhoe stabilizers, there is a TSB to replace the o-rings in the valve assembly. The factory rings are a butyl rubber type & can NOt withstand the heat & pressure, the Tech Service Bulletin has a kit to replace the o-rings with new teflon rings.

4. Don't worry guys, Kubota is working on fixing any troubles with the L48, your dealer is most likely the one not up to date. Fortunately my dealer has his act together & orders parts for TSBs for my equipment without calling & then just calls & tells me he needs to fix my tractor. Great Service!

I'll forward any additional information as I get it from dealer & Kubota.

 

[ewoss3]

Re: L48 Loader Problems

foz, keep up the good post there are many of us considerig this machine as an upgrade, to all the other unsatisfied owners keep lots of pressure on them. I just went to my local dealer and test drove one and pointed out the problem to the owner and the service manager who have not heard of this issue yet. I left a number and told them to call me when they got it fixed, then I mentioned that I would hate to go <font color=green>greeeeeeeen</font color=green> being it would spoil my reputation as a loyal customer at their dealership(truth is the green guys won't give me a free hat).

 

[JATO_RaT]

Re: L48 Loader Problems

Thanks Foz, I must disagree with you in only one aspect and perhaps it is specific more to me and others who purchased from the same dealer as I, but my dealer is not only up to date, he is bending over backwards to see that all is right. He has been very supportive and knows that in the end, Kubota will have things as we expect. He is working with me now to try something relating to the bucket extend (dump) pressure. My faith in Kubota and its products is still very high, Rat....

 

[Tags]

Re: L48 Loader Problems

Thats great that Kubota is stepping up to the plate and addressing the problem...I just hope they are very thorough in their pursuit to fix it.

 

[toy1]

Re: L48 Loader Problems

I received my L48 last week and so far so good, they told me that they installed a kit for the bucket uncurl, I did try this feature, I set the blade angle and put the lift circuit in the float position and the bucket held it's position while I backgraded and I was also able to increase the angle as I was moving backward however very slowly.Next I took the lift circuit out of float and attempted the same, the curl angle held it's position as I moved backward even when I applied down force however I was not able to increase the uncurl angle it just held steady.
By the end of the first hour of use ,what I thought was going to be a problem; Is not a problem .
I do also think that the bucket dump/ curl circuit is under powered and should not perform as sluggish as it does. and I will be watching for what corrective action Kobota Takes to correct this situation.

 

[toy1]

Re: L48 Loader Problems

Good news, I put a call into Kabota on 3/08/2002 and explained the situation on uncurl power, the gentleman at the center stated he would call my dealer and I should here by monday. Within 4 hours I got the answer, the regional tech guy call my dealer, and stated Kobata is working on a new valve which has not been announced officially by kabota as soon as the valve is ready the valve will be shipped to my dealer and he will install. hope this helps. ps it sounded like only those that complain will get the fix.

 

[johnjc]

Re: L48 Loader Problems

Did you get the new valve? Did it fix the problem?

 

[toy1]

Re: L48 Loader Problems

My dealer has ordered the valve but has not received it yet ,I will keep everyone posted when the valve comes in.