L2800 Starting Issue

[garren]

My L2800 has recently gotten picky about cranking. I usually have to stomp the clutch pedal several times before it will start to turn over. I thought it might be the switch down at the pedal but that seems to be fine. Is there something else that needs adjusting? Has anyone else had this issue?

 

[scnebraska]

Hi Garren,

Had a similar problem today. Getting ready for winter, topping everything off with fuel. Filled the other Orange machines and my L2800 D was the last in line. Filled her up and climbed back on to put her back in the shed. Everything was "normal, normal", no PTO no nothing. Pushed the clutch peddle down, twisted the switch and the normal dash lights came on but when I went to the "start" position on the switch, nothing, not even a starter solonoid click. Tried this about a half dozen times then bang, she started right up and ran normally. Each time I did this I once again depressed the clutch, as is necessary to start this gal.

I'll dig into this problem in a few days and post what I find but for now I'm suspecting the ignition switch itself.

 

[LD1]

Is there a clutch safety on the HST models? IE: Do you normally have to press the clutch to start the HST?

It does sound like a sticking safety though?? Seat, PTO, Gear selector, etc. Maybe stomping the clutch made the seat safety free up and she started????

 

[john_bud]

What is the exact symptom? Is it dead silence when you turn the key? That would sound like an electrical interlock. HST peddle center has one, clutch has one and both pto switches have one. The seat may have one too.

Do the dash lights / head lights go out when you turn the key? That could indicate a bad battery wire or bad battery.

Luck with it!

 

[k0ua]

Is there a clutch safety on the HST models? IE: Do you normally have to press the clutch to start the HST?

It does sound like a sticking safety though?? Seat, PTO, Gear selector, etc. Maybe stomping the clutch made the seat safety free up and she started????

Yes the HST model must have the clutch pushed in to crank the tractor.. why not bypass the clutch switch for a while, since you seem to have an intermittent problem and see if the problem goes away. It could be that the clutch safety switch is not making contact intermittently, and this would prove or disprove that theory.

James K0UA

 

[LD1]

Sound like a clutch safety switch for sure then.

 

[scnebraska]

Hi LD1,

Well, as life happens, I didn't have a chance to look at it yet but maybe tomorrow. So far I am really suspecting the "ignition switch" if we can call it that, you know, the thing you put the key in.

At the end of the day I topped the fuel off and was going to move her back to the shed, climbed back on board, pushed the clutch peddle fully to the floor and twisted the switch and nothing, absolutely nothing other than the normal dash lights lighting, no starter click, no nothing! Double checked everything else just to make sure I hadn't moved the PTO switch or something stupid like that, checked the turn signals and lights and all appeared to act normally.

After twisting that darned ignition switch about two dozen times, it nudged the starter once and then about a dozen times later she finally came back to life as if nothing was wrong.

I'll try to put an indicator of some sort on the starter solonoid tomorrow and go from there. If that shows me nothing then I'll probably add a push botton switch on to bypass the starter (and all other safety switches) and see what happens. Understand, I'm not recommending or even suggesting that you try this but those are my own personal plans.

Will keep you posted but it may take a few days. Unfortunately that's not the highest priority on my list as I have other tractors if a serious need arises and the snow is going to be here sooner than I'll be ready for it.

Continued good luck with your fix and yes, I have the full set of "official" Kubota manuals for all of my machines but I must confess that I haven't read every page (yet).

 

[LD1]

I wouldnt start with bypassing everything at once.

It is unlikely to have more than one safety fail at the same time.

I'd just take a jumper wire, and jumper them ONE AT A TIME. Starting with the clutch , and then seat safety.

THat is the crude method of testing safety switches.

Oh, and you mention thinking that it is a key switch cause NOTHING happens. Well, I cant remember for sure, but I believe that if it is a safety switch, it kills everything. IE: turn the key and no lights come one. Except for the glow plugs if you turn the key backwards I think.

 

[ritschner]

The clutch switch can be jumped with a short piece of wire with a spade connector on both ends. On the HST the clutch is only needed for the PTO so mine is permanently jumped. The seat switch is a little more complex so I am including how to test it for the L2800. To jump it you will need to jump the black and orange wire. To check the seat switch you will need a continuity tester. Unplug the seat switch from the wiring harness (there is a tab on the bottom that is hard to see, you may have to release the zip tie). There are three wires on the switch (black blue orange) that terminate in male pins in the connector. With the seat only all the way down there should be continuity between the black and orange wire only. With the seat only up there should be continuity between the black and blue wire only. Anything else and the switch is bad. The other issue on an HST may be that the rocker peddle is not centering correctly due to the colder weather and old lubricant.

 

[scnebraska]

Hi LD1,

Well, as life happens, I didn't have a chance to look at it yet but maybe tomorrow. So far I am really suspecting the "ignition switch" if we can call it that, you know, the thing you put the key in.

At the end of the day I topped the fuel off and was going to move her back to the shed, climbed back on board, pushed the clutch peddle fully to the floor and twisted the switch and nothing, absolutely nothing other than the normal dash lights lighting, no starter click, no nothing! Double checked everything else just to make sure I hadn't moved the PTO switch or something stupid like that, checked the turn signals and lights and all appeared to act normally.

After twisting that darned ignition switch about two dozen times, it nudged the starter once and then about a dozen times later she finally came back to life as if nothing was wrong.

I'll try to put an indicator of some sort on the starter solonoid tomorrow and go from there. If that shows me nothing then I'll probably add a push bottom switch on to bypass the starter (and all other safety switches) and see what happens. Understand, I'm not recommending or even suggesting that you try this but those are my own personal plans.

Will keep you posted but it may take a few days. Unfortunately that's not the highest priority on my list as I have other tractors if a serious need arises and the snow is going to be here sooner than I'll be ready for it.

Continued good luck with your fix and yes, I have the full set of "official" Kubota manuals for all of my machines but I must confess that I haven't read every page (yet).

Update 12-02-12

Haven't had a chance to use the 2800 other than to move it to access something else. She started normally (in the daylight) on the move out but wouldn't you know it, when it was dark she just sat there when I hit start and showed the normal dash lights. I did find the quick and dirty work around though. Pull the small black single wire connector out of the starter, it's located a couple of inches forward of the battery cable and jump +12 volts into it. One of the later posts mentioned the direction peddle on the HST. My 2800 is the HST model and so that will be where I look next but it may be due to lack of lubrication and the cooler weather. That was one of the next things on my oh so long "to do" list.

If and when I find something useful I'll be sure to post it.

 

[allenjack]

Starting my Kubota L4400 2010 requires that all the listed safety precautions in effect(clutch, PTO, Seat, HST Rocker) plus the cruise control must be engaged and then disengaged to make it start. This has not always been the case and hopefully nothing else will come along to keep it from starting.

 

[ritschner]

Starting my Kubota L4400 2010 requires that all the listed safety precautions in effect(clutch, PTO, Seat, HST Rocker) plus the cruise control must be engaged and then disengaged to make it start. This has not always been the case and hopefully nothing else will come along to keep it from starting.

The cruise control is mechanical and only moves the HST pedal. When you disengage it, it returns the pedal to a preset center. It appears your HST pedal might not be centering correctly when used normally. The next time try to start it without using the cruise. If it does not crank continue to hold the key in the start position while rocking the pedal back and forth. You should find where the pedal center is.

 

[allenjack]

The cruise control is mechanical and only moves the HST pedal. When you disengage it, it returns the pedal to a preset center. It appears your HST pedal might not be centering correctly when used normally. The next time try to start it without using the cruise. If it does not crank continue to hold the key in the start position while rocking the pedal back and forth. You should find where the pedal center is.

Thanks for the tip. It worked just like you thought. This will ease my mind about the warranty expiring in a couple of months.

 

[garren]

So far, mine has quit acting up so I havent been able to try some of these tests. Heres what has changed though...I took the backhoe off and put on the box blade...which means I havent used the PTO in a while. Could it be that switch? I havent looked for it and its too cold to go out there right now... is it easy to find?
It was mentioned that it could be the ignition switch...I had thought about that too, but a few times I held the key in the start position while stomping the clutch pedal and eventually it cranked... of course that isnt very diagnostic since I was rocking back and forth in the seat and the vibration from stomping the pedal could have closed any faulty connections...I'm still at square one

 

[ritschner]

The PTO switch is right under the lever on the right fender and is easy to see and access from the back of the tractor. The clutch switch is below the pedal between the clutch lever and the floorboard. The clutch switch has a plug on connector that can easily be jumped with a 2 inch piece of wire with male spade connectors attached on each end. The HST pedal switch is under the instrument panel on the ignition switch side. If you look directly in front of the transmission tunnel, under the instrument panel, inside of the brake pedal you will see it. It is lever and rod activated and if you watch it while rocking the HST pedal you can see the way it operates and determine if it is adjusted correctly. The tractor will crank and start without being in the seat as long as the clutch switch is depressed or jumped and the PTO is disengaged, so the seat switch only becomes an issue while trying to move the tractor or use the PTO. Garren, the first thing you should consider is jumping the clutch switch.

 

[thavil]

garren - Check out this old thread http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/...40-b2400-starting-problem-finally-solved.html and see if it helps your situation.

 

[scnebraska]

Allenjack,

The HST peddle switch turned out to be my problem also. Ritschner's method is the same I used to find my problem. Hope this ends up fixing your problem.

 

[vtsnowedin]

My JD has got fussy when it is cold. Ran through the start the engine checklist in the manual and found that the throttle needs to be up off of slow idle for it to crank. Also tranny needs to be in park and the three point hitch needs to have both levers down. Manual says the clutch has to be pushed in but it doesn't seem to have told the tractor that. Fires right up with the clutch out but not a click if the throttle is all the way back. Funny that it never bothered this summer. Why the hitch needs to be down is a mystery. It might not always be convenient to set down whatever is on the hitch.
Good luck with your puzzle.

 

[garren]

After some time now without issues I believe my problem was the HST switch. It was one of the switches that I hadn't thought about until it was suggested above. When I checked it the first thing I noticed was the protective rubber boot had cracked and was falling apart. Its hard to explain, but it had a piece of the broken rubber rolled up in such a way that it may have been preventing the switch from returning far enough to allow the tractor to turn over. I broke off the pieces of rotted rubber and haven't had a problem since...

 

[BWSSR]

I have seen this on small cars..double check the battery cables at the battery...they get corroded, and loose the contact....they spark inside the cable end and battery, till they are making some contact...then they start...sounds silly, but this has happened to me on a Samurai and a Yota....don't hurt to check.