Killer Jackass

[redlevel]

I reported here last fall that I had purchased goats for brush control, and had taken possession of a couple of free donkeys for predator control.
http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/rural-living/224093-winter-care-feeding-goats-donkeys.html

The goats and donks have done well on the pasture and brush, consuming only two round bales of bermudagrass hay. They probably could have gotten by without the hay.

No problems until the goats started dropping kids this week. The Jack has killed four out of five kids, and the fifth one is in bad shape. This came as a rude surprise. I found three dead kids in one day. Had no clue what had happened. Then, yesterday, I saw the Jack with a kid in his mouth, shaking it like a dog would shake a cat. I got the mama in the shelter with her one remaining kid (twins) before the Jack killed it.

I hate to put the Jack down, but I can't have this. I can't in good conscience sell him or give him to someone else to put in a pasture with livestock. I have to assume he would try to harm newborn calves. I can't just run him through a sale barn without revealing his murderous habits.

I thought about having him cut. What are the chances this would stop this behavior? Anyone have any ideas? Don't suggest just isolating him from the other livestock. No one in the family is really "attached" to the donk. He, unlike the Jenny, has always been skittish, not allowing anyone to pet him, nor eating from our hands.

What to do?

 

[dusty3030]

Got a backhoe and a 30/30?

 

[Artisan]

I am no expert, AT ALL, all's I know is what you write and what I link to below.
Looks like it is somewhat common for an intact jack to kill small goats and lambs...looks liek there saying to cut him or loose him...

Farmer & Rancher Newspaper

Horses - Behavior Issues, Breaking and Training: donkey behavior, female donkey, male donkey

 

[whistlepig]

I don't know about donkeys but I have dealt with a few stallions. I would suggest having them cut first.

 

[dusty3030]

The man with the twitch has the hard part.
I'd scotch hobble the side the cutter approaches from.
Jack ain't got to see to aim a hoof.

 

[whistlepig]

I have almost been killed by a stallion. I have seen a couple of folks forever crippled by stallions. We board horses and they won't even insure us if we keep a stallion. Cut the darn thing.

 

[SandburRanch]

It isn't just stallions. Although probably not as common, we had a paint mare that would kill baby lambs.

 

[Depmandog]

The man with the twitch has the hard part.
I'd scotch hobble the side the cutter approaches from.
Jack ain't got to see to aim a hoof.

The "VET" and his "ASSISTANT" would have that chore if it was me!

When I was in HS, I worked for a vet. Never had to cut a stallion or jack, but we did have to cut about 50 260 pound boar hogs one day. I think we ended up with 7 or 8 five gallon buckets of future rocky mountain oysters. That was without a doubt the worst day of my life. I came out battered, bloody, bruised and bit. I had multiple bruises on the tops of both feet. I strained every muscle that I had, and some I didn't know I had. What a day, and I was not a small or weak guy back then.

Yep, I would tell the Vet, stop by the house on your way out, and I get you a check! Full grown males of any species have grown fond of their jewels, and won't give then up without a serious fight !!

 

[gengine]

call the vet out. The vet will tranquillize the Jack, chop his wee wee, and nobody has to get hurt (human). That should stop the problem. Out in the wild, a stallion or Jack will kill the offspring in the herd that are not his. I don't know how he knows if they are his, but that's what they do. Maybe that's why he feels he's gotta kill the kids.

 

[Bird]

I thought about having him cut. What are the chances this would stop this behavior? Anyone have any ideas? Don't suggest just isolating him from the other livestock. No one in the family is really "attached" to the donk. He, unlike the Jenny, has always been skittish, not allowing anyone to pet him, nor eating from our hands.

Several years ago, when I had some goats, I bought a young jack at an auction. He had already been gelded. But yep, he went berserk one day, broke a full grown nanny goat's neck and was running from me carrying a kid in his mouth. He went to the auction barn the next day.

The point is that gelding may not help your problem.

 

[blueriver]

Casteration may not fix it ... I own Donkeys and Mules, geldings and breeding Jacks ... they are very territorial and protective of "their" stock ... a new born is all of a sudden an intruder and they feel they must protect the rest of the stock.

My best Gray Mule gelding will take on any newborn ... Calf, foal, llama, goat, sheep and stomp it to death ... I keep them penned up during "birth season"

My Jack was out in the cow pasture last spring and I didn't get him out early enough ... I heard a cow bellowing ... down right mad ...when I got into the woods the Jack had a newborn calf by the neck carrying it off ... I picked up a good size stick and went yelling and knocking the shlt out of him ... he dropped it and the calf lived.

Molly mules have been known to do the same. Keep them seperated ... a Jack will actually reach over or threw a fence to nail a newborn.

 

[blueriver]

The "VET" and his "ASSISTANT" would have that chore if it was me!

When I was in HS, I worked for a vet. Never had to cut a stallion or jack, but we did have to cut about 50 260 pound boar hogs one day. I think we ended up with 7 or 8 five gallon buckets of future rocky mountain oysters. That was without a doubt the worst day of my life. I came out battered, bloody, bruised and bit. I had multiple bruises on the tops of both feet. I strained every muscle that I had, and some I didn't know I had. What a day, and I was not a small or weak guy back then.

Yep, I would tell the Vet, stop by the house on your way out, and I get you a check! Full grown males of any species have grown fond of their jewels, and won't give then up without a serious fight !!

Vets around here get upwards of $175 to cut one ... trip ropes, razor blade, iodine wash, a masculator and a tetnus shot ... (and my grandpa said) "the moon has to have the blood in their feet"

And if you ever need to cut a dog I can tell you how to do that.

 

[20 20]

The point is that gelding may not help your problem.

My thoughts exactly, you can take the ball away that doesn't mean the game is over.

 

[MMagis]

Keeping a donkey or two for predator protection is common with ranchers, but as I understand it, if males aren't cut this is what always happens. Even when cut, it could still happen. Females are usually used for that reason. He needs removed, one way or another.

 

[Bird]

Keeping a donkey or two for predator protection is common with ranchers, but as I understand it, if males aren't cut this is what always happens. Even when cut, it could still happen. Females are usually used for that reason. He needs removed, one way or another.

It doesn't always happen. As you said, many ranchers keep donkeys for predator protection, and they frequently are not gelded. We used to have a neighbor who ran about 125 head of beef cattle and 5 donkeys; one a big ungelded Jack. They were relatively gentle, though rarely handled, and never bothered the cattle. And he sold the donkey colts. However, he decided they ate too much and weren't needed, so he sold all 5. And within a year, he lost so many calves that he regretted getting rid of the donkeys. So he bought another pair of donkeys. And that new Jack didn't just chase calves, he'd even chase grown cows, biting and kicking for reasons unknown. So it wasn't long before that pair of donkeys also went to the auction barn.

 

[weldingisfun]

First the my main point: A jack should NEVER be used for predator control for goats.

You have to get rid of the jack, no choice in the matter. Once that is done, identify the most gentle jenny, gentle with your goats, not necessarily with people and keep her. Get rid of the rest.

The donkey is a herd animal, as are your goats, if you have more than one donkey they will hang together. With no other donkeys the lone donkey will adopt the goats as her herd and she will protect them.

Chalk this one up as a painful lesson learned. You are not the first to be taught this way.

Sorry about your goats and the experience you had to go through.

In case you are wondering, my credentials: We have been raising goats for nearly 15 years and have also learned about jacks and multiple jennies,,,,,,the hard way.

 

[jinman]

Bird, Weldingisfun, and Blueriver have given you excellent advice. Once a jack has matured, cutting him will stop him from breeding, but he will keep all his other bad habits. A very tame genny is the best way to go. You will either need to sell that jack, give him away, or dispose of him. Many people have llamas as guard animals. They say that llamas are very territorial and will not harm other livestock. I have no 1st hand knowledge, but I see them in with cattle from time-to-time.

My wife had a worthless gelded jack that she had to keep away from the goats. She left him when she sold the property, but gave the new owner full disclosure about his nature. The new owner didn't take her seriously until he killed two of his goats. I always thought he'd have to pay somebody to take the jack, but he actually found somebody who took the donkey for free.

 

[DennisArrow]

When we first got in the goat business perhaps 10 years ago, we used donkeys for predator control. Not only do they have the problem adressed in this thread; but they go after small children and of course if your dog goes in the pasture. In addition, they really do tear up a pasture with their wallows and eat as much as 5 goats in hay, feed, and grass.

We switched over years ago to pasture livestock guard dogs, lgd, and havent looked back. We use 2 per pasture. One bonus is our female dogs help the mamas clean up the kids. One dog typically will stay with the herd and the other patrols the perimeter. Would really love to see a pit bull stray take on 2 Anatolian shepherds. No coyote problems or anything in our pastures for years now...........God bless.......Dennis

 

[Bird]

I always thought he'd have to pay somebody to take the jack, but he actually found somebody who took the donkey for free.

I had always assumed you'd have to pay for any donkey; maybe not a lot, but certainly not free. However, I recently saw a couple of Dallas news stories that the animal control folks have a problem with donkeys simply turned out as strays and can't get anyone to take them.

 

[bigbull338]

yes a jack or a gelded donkey will kill calves an goats.an as said some will chase the cows.thats why its safer to put jenny donkeys with cattle goats or sheep.i dont think the jennys are to bad if any at all about killing calves or goats.