Box Scraper Is this SOP in the industry?

/ Is this SOP in the industry? #1  

ctgoldwing

Platinum Member
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
Messages
557
Location
Central Connecticut
Tractor
L3800HST
after doing my research on the forums on 8/24 I ordered a box blade from Everything Attachments. Delivery was quoted at 6 weeks. I am ok with the delivery but yesterday my credit card bill came in and the blade was charged to it on 8/24. . .
I buy pretty much everything online but I can't even remember the last time an item wasn't charged on the day it shipped, not the order date.
Is this a common thing here?
 
/ Is this SOP in the industry? #2  
Yes it's common with EA. Usually gets asked every other month or so and Travis will put up the reasoning for it.
 
/ Is this SOP in the industry? #3  
Yes it's common with EA. Usually gets asked every other month or so and Travis will put up the reasoning for it.

I don't think this is good business practice but if people put up with it then buyer beware. Generally when someone bills your card that far in advance, there are underlying factors to the business cash flow that necessitate it. To me its a red flag. My biggest concern would be with that kind of advance billing, you could get stuck with the charge if it didn't get delivered in time. I build custom cars as a hobby. I have seen this happen in a several similarly sized businesses that sold motors and other high end accessories for custom cars. Both times, the companies were around a number of years and had zero problems. They did a lot of business and provided high quality merchandise. Then for one reason or another, they got into a cash flow situation they couldn't get out of. They started using current sales money to pay for orders they had already taken becuase they were behind in their cash flow. In just a matter of weeks, a lot of people lost a lot of money becuase all of the sudden quit shipping anything, even though they continued to take orders. Basically overnight, they suddenly closed up and declared bankruptcy.

The one thing that made me think of it was that was that we had several Internet car forums that were larger than TractorbyNet.com and when it first started happening everyone was defending the vendors because there had been no serious issues in the past. I'd say for a good month or two, people were still defending them on the forum because the vendors were well liked. In fact, one of the vendors was a big financial supporter of the both Forums. They advertised heavily which helped pay the cost of operating both forums for a long time. Anyway, in both cases, the next thing we knew the businesses had shut down and quit returning calls and correspondence. Losses ranged from hundreds of dollars to tens of thousands.

The Fair Credit Billing Act allows you to file a dispute with your credit card company for undelivered merchandise, so long as you inform the credit card company within 60 days of the first bill that has the disputed charge on it.


So if the order drags on a couple of extra weeks you can find yourself in a situation where your time to dispute the charge has past and you are out of luck. No matter how great you think a company is doing, you really don't know. If they are charging you 30 days or more before they even ship, then you are taking all the financial risk for them and essentially financing the equipment build or acquisition for them. The one taking a risk in that situation is the consumer. If they decide one day to close up shop suddenly, you can lose your money. Been there, done that, have the T-Shirt.

If it were me, I'd dispute the charge on day 45 if it hasn't arrived and let the credit card company pull the money back until it was ready to ship. That way you have some protection. I imagine the business will fuss saying they have never ever missed a delivery which may or may not be true. You really don't know. And as I mentioned before, even if it is true, when the music suddenly stops in a financial deal like that, the last customers get left holding the bag. They may be great people but it's a risky practice for a consumer to pay that far in advance.
 
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/ Is this SOP in the industry? #4  
I can understand on a custom build item—limited market item—want commitment money from the purchaser, but that should never exceed 50% of total purchase price. I can even understand and accept that it be nonrefundable as long as the builder/seller meets his part if the contract.
But for a common item such as a box blade regardless of size, charging for the item before ship date is a practice that would have me shopping elsewhere. The poster that stated he would dispute on day 45 is kinder and shows more patience than me. If he had not shipped (not necessarily received but shipped) within 2 weeks of the charge to the CC, I would start the process if disputing the charge. I would also probably never deal with that company again. And yes I have done this very process, I always have started that process by contacting the seller. Stuff happens. So I try to give the seller the opportunity to explain and make it right.
 
/ Is this SOP in the industry? #5  
I have done business with companies that charge your CC in both manners. In all cases - I got what was ordered. Often wondered - why the difference.
 
/ Is this SOP in the industry? #6  
I have done business with companies that charge your CC in both manners. In all cases - I got what was ordered. Often wondered - why the difference.

One has used their own money to stock it and the other is using your money to order or build it or order it after they have your money in house. I understand a small business doesn't have lots of cash but I think maybe a 25% deposit would still be fair to the consumer if the business is small. That would more than cover their costs to resell the item. I don't see any good reason for requiring 100% upfront 6 weeks in advance. That's not good business practice from a consumer's side. Great for a business if they can get away with it, since they are taking essentially zero risk. They've made their profit before they even have to acquire or produce a product. Who wouldn't like that from a business side of things?
 
/ Is this SOP in the industry? #7  
I ran a business for years before retirement and I can understand charging card immediately. Company wants to be sure the person has the money when ordering. Each time a charge is made there's a fee which is why 25% down would cost more.
When you book a motel room or rent a car your card is charged immediately although you haven't had use of room or car. It's usually charged for much more than the amount as well, although you never see that charge. That's because is room or car gets damaged they need to be sure customer is financially able to pay for damages.
 
/ Is this SOP in the industry? #8  
When you book a motel room or rent a car your card is charged immediately although you haven't had use of room or car. It's usually charged for much more than the amount as well, although you never see that charge.

That's interesting. In nearly 60 years of booking cars and hotel rooms I've never had them charge my card except when it was explicitly stated that a deposit was required. I understand that when I actually check in some place a hold on the card, but not when booking.
 
/ Is this SOP in the industry? #9  
When I want something I want it now...I see lots of dealers with stacks of quality implements sitting in their yards...what makes one brand worth waiting over a month for?...please don't say "quality"...I'm not talking about cheapo blades and Chinese knock offs etc...
 
/ Is this SOP in the industry? #10  
Another sort of "rub" at least for me is the, "your order has shipped" e-mail..... But when you check tracking number you get " tracking number issued and carrier awaiting item".....

Dale
 
/ Is this SOP in the industry? #11  
When I want something I want it now...I see lots of dealers with stacks of quality implements sitting in their yards...what makes one brand worth waiting over a month for?...please don't say "quality"...I'm not talking about cheapo blades and Chinese knock offs etc...

My tendency with fair to large purchase is to go to a "dealer/retailer" lot see the item and purchase it right there......... I am sort of kick the tires person.... Really have a lot of reservations about online car buying like "VROOM" and "Car GURUS" and such....

Dale
 
/ Is this SOP in the industry? #12  
I think it's becoming more common. I don't like it and have complained about it twice. One vendor shipped the next day, overnight freight, on their nickel. The other vendor simply said that's how we do it.
 
/ Is this SOP in the industry? #13  
If a company lets the customer know upfront, during the ordering process, they will charge the customers CC for the full payment, then there isn't a problem because the customer knew before finalizing the order and it is safe to assume agreed to the upfront charge.

If the company doesn't let the customer know of the 100% CC charge on a product shipment that is out a few weeks, they are in the wrong and I would be suspect of them. Using current sales to finance future shipments suggests a cash flow problem, even if there is no cash flow problem.
 
/ Is this SOP in the industry? #14  
That's interesting. In nearly 60 years of booking cars and hotel rooms I've never had them charge my card except when it was explicitly stated that a deposit was required. I understand that when I actually check in some place a hold on the card, but not when booking.
We're talking semantics. I assume you and others get the gist of my reply, and I write fast avoiding minutia. My point is/was the motel, agency, retailer, etc. wants a valid card number. The actual amount may not be charged except upon completion. After all, a room when checking out may have to add room services, etc.
Just yesterday I ordered parts online and my card was charged right away. I paid, although haven't received anything...possibly will never receive it. I can and have done a chargeback on merchandise long after order was placed, merchandise not received.
It's not unusual for a cc charge to occur once order is placed.
Copied online:
"Expect to have at least the estimated amount of your rental and an extra $200 put on your card for incidentals. Companies almost always put a hold on a debit card, but they may not place one on your credit card depending on your available balance and their policies. A hold or block means you can't use the funds until the car is returned and paid for. If your estimated cost of renting the car is $100 for two days, the rental company may block your card for $300 or more. If you only have $300 of available credit, you can't use the card until the car is returned or you use another method to pay the bill."
 
/ Is this SOP in the industry? #15  
What you're talking about is an 'authorization'. It isn't a charge applied to your card, but it can affect your available credit for other charges. Gas stations used to do it (maybe still do) They'd 'authorize' $100 or so when you enter your card at the pump. You only pump $20 in gas and that's all that hits your card. BUT, if you have a card with a low limit, or you're near your limit, that $100 'authorization' might put you over the top and cause your next charge to be rejected.
 
/ Is this SOP in the industry? #16  
Some hotels charge in full to my card, and others for at least one day, at time of reservation even if done months in advance. Airlines? Yep, pay in full when you book your flight many months ahead of time. And with airlines, I've had my flights changed multiple times after booking and paying for them, between the time of booking and the actual departure date. Sometimes they add a layover, change departure and arrivals times, etc.
I've had local dealers charge me for attachments when I ordered them, but usually they charge when I pick it up. I think EA is a little unique since we're buying direct from the manufacturer. It might be easier to bill for all orders when they are placed, whether or not they have them in stock or need to build. Sometimes accounting practices dictate a process.
 
/ Is this SOP in the industry? #17  
As I mentioned earlier, it's great for the business, not so much for the customer. The customer is taking on all the business risk by paying 100 percent in advance for a company to build or acquire a product to send to them. It might be the "my way or the highway" business owner doesn't care because he has all the business he can stand. Good for him if that's the case. That doesn't make it smart for a customer to deal with them though.

Normally, this sort of requirement is because the business doesn't have sufficient cash flow and needs the customer to help finance acquiring the wholesale merchandise to transfer to the customer.
 
/ Is this SOP in the industry? #18  
Or it could also be because the the business is tired of getting burned by people ordering stuff and not following through with the sale.

Tons of wishy-washy people in the world... "Oh, I found something cheaper", or "different". Or my neighbor's ex dog groomer had an old one they weren't using, etc, etc.

Or they're ordering stuff they can't afford, and their card gets declined when they're ready to ship.

There's more than one side to a story.
 
/ Is this SOP in the industry? #19  
In those cases a partial payment would cover EA. And I don't think anyone would complain about a partial payment.
 
/ Is this SOP in the industry? #20  
Another sort of "rub" at least for me is the, "your order has shipped" e-mail..... But when you check tracking number you get " tracking number issued and carrier awaiting item".....

Dale
Thats usually the shipping department printing the shipping label, slapping it on & dropping it at their loading dock. They have shipped it. However UPS or whoever has yet to show up & load the item on the truck. So they haven't taken possession of the package to update it in their database. Just a difference between dropping it on the loading dock being counted as shipped & the actual shipper grabbing it.
 
 

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