Increasing Horsepower

[Tororider]

Have any of you used a dynamometer to increase the horsepower of your tractor? My uncle had it done and we are thinking about getting our JD 4310 upped a few horsepower.

 

[D7E]

Have any of you used a dynamometer to increase the horsepower of your tractor? My uncle had it done and we are thinking about getting our JD 4310 upped a few horsepower.

A dynamometer does not increase power ,It is a tool to measure power at pto shaft ? You do the dyno test ,Make adjustments,And Re-dyno ..see the difference ?
Easiest way to increase power is pump adjustment and is fine "In moderation" on most diesels 10-20% + extra is easy and adding a turbo can achieve 20-40% more power without harming anything .
Many stock 100 hp tractors are pumped up and turbo,d to 150-160 hp with no side affects (depending on many things) .The ford 7710's and 7610's are basically the good old 5000 ?

 

[Deerlope]

Kubota has the same engine bore and stroke right down the line in their L5040, L5240, L5740 all three are turboed but each has different fuel setting to get the HP they want without a different engine for each.

 

[Ductape]

There have been several members who have added turbochargers to their tractors (and just as many who have started, and then chickened out!). Something i have contemplated myself. I think a little time searching here will get you several threads devoted to this modification.

 

[Tororider]

D7E,
Sorry, I didn't explain myself very well, if at all. I know that a dynamometer is a tool used to measure. I believe you adjust the fuel pump to create the extra power. Like Deerlope said, many manufacturers use the same engine, minus the fuel pump in similar lines. I believe the JD 4310 and 4410 are that way. Just looking for anyone who has done it.

 

[Tororider]

I also know that in larger tractors, "industrial" tractors it is very common because you can gain tens of horsepower, whereas when you do it a compact tractor you only gain a few horsepower. For those of use who have the compact tractors, those few extra horsepower can really help.

 

[john_bud]

A good diesel shop should be able to tweak the pump to give more power. Don't expect the world, but 3-5hp should be possible with few drawbacks.

jb

 

[gemini5362]

When you add a turbo you up the combustion temperature. Some engines are designed for that some others I would assume are not. I would look into that aspect of it before spending the money.

 

[art]

There normally is a difference in the engines when turbo'd, the increased cylinder temps normally require oil jets to spray on the bottoms of the pistons to keep them cool.
When they come from the factory many of the turbo'd engines sport about a 20% increase but for after market many only offer up about 15% increase. The turbo is not the only thing done as they also need pump modifications to add the extra fuel.
Turboing often costs about four to five thousand dollars when done so why not just go buy the next larger tractor and get everything built for the extra horsepower.

 

[Soundguy]

A dynamometer does not increase power ,It is a tool to measure power at pto shaft ? You do the dyno test ,Make adjustments,And Re-dyno ..see the difference ?
Easiest way to increase power is pump adjustment and is fine "In moderation" on most diesels 10-20% + extra is easy and adding a turbo can achieve 20-40% more power without harming anything .
Many stock 100 hp tractors are pumped up and turbo,d to 150-160 hp with no side affects (depending on many things) .The ford 7710's and 7610's are basically the good old 5000 ?

One of the big differences in the 5000 and 7000 was a turbo.. and many people still drop in M&W kits.. etc.

A new crank might be nice too..

I know a guy that had a 5000 up to 105 hp and stock it was 70..

It lasted quite a while till the crank turned into a pretzle... of course.. he hitched it to big plows and used all of them wild ponies to their max.

within moderation.. i think you should be able to play with the smoke screw a bit without catastrophic issues..

soundguy

 

[Farmwithjunk]

Some engines have more tolerance to "turning up the smoke screw" than others. A couple examples. My Massey Ferguson 150 has the venerable Perkins AD3-152 for power. During the 50 some odd years it's been produced, it was available in different HP variants. From a low of 32 (pto) to 53 (pto). My 150 came out of the crate at 38.7 HP. 2 years after I bought it (in 1971) I decided it needed a little more "juice". A friend worked for REPUBLIC DIESEL. I hauled the MF to their shop one winters day and we gave it a little tweeking. 47 PTO hp. Still dyno's at 47 nearly 35 years later. And it didn't cause any significant increase in fuel use. I can still bush hog (in heavy weeds/grass) with a 6' cutter on approx. 3/4 gallon per hr. "Wide open" RPM's are still limited to what was stock. (2250)

I MIGHT be the guy SouNdguy was talking about with the 5000 Ford and M&W turbo kit. In 1976, I took my '74 5000, 67 PTO hp, and installed an M&W turbo kit. First year, I ran it at 80 HP. No harm done. Next season, I got "horsepoweritis". The 5000 hit the fields at 102 PTO hp, pulling a 5X14" semi-mounted plow that spring. It wasn't too long before I had a ventilated crankcase and a 2-piece crankshaft. (NOT a good thing ;() The flywheel flange snapped off in a hard pull. RPM's ran wild for about 2 seconds and then a big CLUNK. To get the 102 hp, the engine needed to run at almost 3000 rpm. That might have well been the death knell.

A lot of todays small displacement diesels rely on higher operating rpms than older engines. IMHO, that ISN'T a situation where I'd be jacking up the fuel screw and/or adding a turbo.

 

[jinman]

With my tractor, 10 extra hp would get me absolutely nothin'. It will already spin the tires, pop the HST relief valve, pop the hydraulic pressure relief valve, and snap shearbolts on PTO implements like they were toothpicks. If I increased my hp, all I'd gain is braggin' rights and a bigger fuel bill.

Remember, a 90 lb kid can snap a 6 lb test fishin' line just as easy as 200 lb man. It ain't so much the power as the finesse.

 

[D7E]

One of the big differences in the 5000 and 7000 was a turbo.. and many people still drop in M&W kits.. etc.

A new crank might be nice too..

I know a guy that had a 5000 up to 105 hp and stock it was 70..

It lasted quite a while till the crank turned into a pretzle... of course.. he hitched it to big plows and used all of them wild ponies to their max.

within moderation.. i think you should be able to play with the smoke screw a bit without catastrophic issues..

soundguy

The 7000 or 7600 (which are basically 5000's) is the success story for all turbo'd tractors (and JD 2140) and none run sweeter ,Don't you just love that note your 7610 makes when you load it down .We've played with fords since fordsons ,Changing motors and turbo'ing ,I had a 6610 that we bought new in "83" ran it for 1800 hours to break it in and then put a garret turbo and an 8 blade fan and a little fuel and was doing 110hp at the shaft ,Ran that way for 15 years (8000 hours)Take the TW series tractors ,105-197hp ,Same engine just turbo and intercooler differences, We've home turbo'd over 40 tractors (JD,Ford,MF Renault,Zetor,IH and so on)for ourselves and customers without any crank or shell changes with 2 or 3 disasters .
These tended to be inferior engines like belarus,Zetor,Universal,and surprizingly we had bad luck with fiats which are realy good motors, and you have to be very careful with old case/david browns with only 3 bearings on the crank and break them fine on their own without more grunt ,And a perkins don't like to be messed with too much ,I've worked as a fitter for 2 big colours (red and blue)and you would be amazed how many so called "turbo-engines"are just stock motors with a bolt on turbo and different exhaust ?
And in very hard work applications it is proven that just a turbo without extra fuel can in fact increase fuel economy and make them run a whole lot sweeter and quiten down a "Rattley" 4 cyl like a 6610 eliminating the need for a muffler Just a nice "whistle" no more $300 mufflers ,$30 straight pipe .

 

[art]

Just a short note on injection pumps. We have turned many up for are farmers for tractor pulling, making 130 horsepower tractors 230 has not been a problem for many of them. What we did find out was that if they went out and did their chores in the same gear as before and the same throttle settingthey did not burn anymore fuel then they did before!
With a carburator if you were to rejet the whole is bigger so more fuel is going through it tht is all there is to it.

 

[Soundguy]

I MIGHT be the guy SouNdguy was talking about with the 5000 Ford and M&W turbo kit. In 1976, I took my '74 5000, 67 PTO hp, and installed an M&W turbo kit. First year, I ran it at 80 HP. No harm done. Next season, I got "horsepoweritis". The 5000 hit the fields at 102 PTO hp, pulling a 5X14" semi-mounted plow that spring. It wasn't too long before I had a ventilated crankcase and a 2-piece crankshaft. (NOT a good thing ;() The flywheel flange snapped off in a hard pull. RPM's ran wild for about 2 seconds and then a big CLUNK. To get the 102 hp, the engine needed to run at almost 3000 rpm. That might have well been the death knell.

.

Yes, you ae deffinately 1 of the 2 guys i had in mind when writing that message. the other fellow is over on YT and has added turbo kits to some of the older iron.. As your experience relates.. you get away with it untill you get a little wild. his experience was almost the same... worked great till the pedal hit the metal ina field one day.

Soundguy

 

[Lil43]

When you add a turbo you up the combustion temperature. Some engines are designed for that some others I would assume are not. I would look into that aspect of it before spending the money.

Actually a properly sized turbocharged diesel engine lowers the combustion temperature,but raises precombustion pressure.That is why a lower hp version of the same cubic in motor (non-turbo) may have say around 20 to 1 compression ratio and a small injector pump and a substancly higher hp version of the same cubic inche motor (turbocharged) motor may have around 16 to 1 compession and a much larger injector pump.This is commonly found in larger farm tractors.There,s a little more to the equation than turbo or non turbo!

 

[EastTnFarmboy]

Kubota has the same engine bore and stroke right down the line in their L5040, L5240, L5740 all three are turboed but each has different fuel setting to get the HP they want without a different engine for each.

Does this mean that all you have to do is adjust your 5240 and you suddenly have a 5740 (as it relates to power)?

 

[BotaFreak]

Does this mean that all you have to do is adjust your 5240 and you suddenly have a 5740 (as it relates to power)?

Wish It was that easy.I thought the same thing about my 3240HSTC....turn the fuel up a little more for a bit more HP.Not that easy.The new Lxx40's have computer controlled injection systems.Mainly the computer controls the "rack" setting vs' engine load,or the case of the HSTC...travel pedal position, which also has an effect on the 'rack"setting.This is due to our friends at the EPA.On the injection pump,look for wires and sensors all over it.It will have one on the front of the pump and one on the top/side.The computer on a cab model is behind the left rear tire...tucked underneath the cab.Wish some one made a programmer for just a bit more PTO HP....but then again,should have bought the next size up.

 

[Soundguy]

Hmm.. now I know why i like mechanical injector pumps.. and not computers...

soundguy

 

[Tororider]

Mechanical is good, regular guys can work on them with regular tools.

But if I am correct I can adjust my JD 4310 and effectively get a JD 4410?