Impala head gasket blown

fishman · May 1, 2011

I need some advice.

My daughter has been using our 2000 Impala for the last three or four years while going to college. Friday she was heading out of town to meet some friends and got stuck in traffic on the interstate for two hours. Then the electric cooling fan failed and the car overheated to the point that it died. Thankfully she made it onto an outer road, and then to a gas station.

After incurring a hefty tow bill to get it back to my trusted mechanic, I got the bad news that the head gasket had blown. Cost estimate is $1,300 for replacement with valve job, assuming the head is good, which I don't know of course. The fan motor is $300. Add another $100 or so for new plugs and a new belt and we are in it for about $1700 assuming best case.

The car has 190k on it and ran great before the issue. The engine is a 3.4l. I've kept the car mechanically in good shape, and cosmetically it is ok, but teenage girls are hard on cars. Recent outlays included new front bearings, struts, and other suspension parts, new brakes and rotors, new ac compressor, and the tires only have about 5k on them, all told about $4k in the last two years. The car is super comfortable and everyone in the family likes it. The only other potential big ticket items on the car would be the transmission, which is working fine right now.

I do trust my mechanic, as I have done a lot of business with them and they have always been fair and honest.

So as I see it my choices are:

1) Dump the car with the head gasket problem and buy a new one. I'd get maybe $500 out of it, and reasonable cars could be had for $3k to $4k more.

2) Move forward with replacing the head gasket/valve job and hope that the head is ok. Cost would be about $1,700. The shop I trust does not rebuild whole engines.

3) Obtain a low mileage used engine and have the shop swap it out. Cost would be about $3k according the the mechanic, but it remains to be seen what the engine will cost.

4) Another option is rebuilt, but I don't know what that would cost, and the mechanic didn't mention it. Online sources for rebuilt engines show about $2k plus shipping.

I am thinking that the first option is the least desirable, since for the price I'm looking at, I could just be buying another problem. Budget dictates no more than about a $4k outlay, as I will not borrow money for a car. But if someone thinks differently, please educate me. It's just that I've replaced a lot of wear items in the car already, and it drives really nice.

I'm thinking that a used engine or a rebuilt would be better than doing essentially a top end refresh on an engine with 190k on it, since something else might go wrong. I'm really looking for some advice here, as I'm in a quandary as to what to do. I hate spending so much money on repairing an old car that is only worth maybe $2k when fixed. However, I'm not sure I buy into the concept that you don't ever spend more money to fix a car than it's worth. The worth of a car, in my opinion, is how reliably it gets you to your destination. I think that when repaired, this car would be more reliable than a car I could buy with the amount required to fix this one.

Advice please.

jinman · May 1, 2011

When have you EVER known me to not have an opinion?

Of course I have advice.

If you were buying another car today, that 2000 Impala would get you between $2k and $2.5k trade-in. Depending on physical condition, that could drop to $1500 in a hurry. My in-laws were going to trade-in their 2000 Mercury Marquis that has been garage kept its whole life and had a back seat that looked showroom in condition. It had a cracked windshield and needed front brakes, but everything else was perfect. It had a little over 200k miles. They were repeatedly offered $1000 from several dealers.

So, as you know, your cost to repair could easily end up costing 1/2 again what you were quoted. It could be $1700 to $2500. That means you are going to spend as much on that car as it would bring you in trade-in (on a good day). When you get it fixed, you will still be driving a car that can have another failure due to no fault of your daughter's, as this last one was. I think I'd hear the alarm bells going off. I don't think you will ever get what you have spent on the car. It made good sense to do the repairs you did before, but now you have to ask yourself if this might be throwing more money into a "hole." It might be time to list this car on craigslist and start looking for a newer replacement.

I don't know if you are like me or not, but I can take an old ragged car and drive it mile after mile and day after day because I am so in tune to the car and when it might need coolant or oil or some other thing that a young lady would not know. What I see as an impending problem, they don't even notice. Will your daughter be able to see the next problem? Will she be paranoid all the time when she is driving? Will she be stranded on the highway at night? What's all this worth? My vote is to cut your loses and move on.

Egon · May 1, 2011

The engine got run hot for what sounds like more time than one would like.

You know one head is gone. What is the other head and bottom end like?

New engine or new car in my mind.

tommu56 · May 1, 2011

Unfortunally for me I did my kids car work but they had to be my gofer and stay with me while I was working on it (if I couldn't play they couldn't either).
motors from the junk yard were around 500 to 1000 dollars my labor was cheep so you can tell how I did it.
They learn't to keep an eye on oil and water and ATF after that.

Call around to the junk yards and see what motors cost.

wsp617 · May 1, 2011

I looked at NADA.com and trade-in value for a 2000 Impala with that many miles is just $2,000. Retail is $3,900. If the motor was good and you sold the car you'd be lucky to get $3,200.

If it were me I'd "cut my losses" and sell the car and look for a replacement. You could put $1,800 into fixing the engine and then the tranny could crap out on ya. I've just never been a big fan of sticking BIG money into vehicles with a ton of miles on them.

Good luck with what ever you chose.

tcartwri · May 1, 2011

I bought my son in law a 2005 Impala for $4200 at the dealer 18 months ago...

They are basically worth next to nothing on resale. If you can do the work yourself, fix it, if not, get what you can for it.

fishman · May 2, 2011

Looks like the consensus so far is to sell it and get another car. Anybody out there want to present a differing viewpoint or support this one?

Thanks so much to all who replied so far. It has been most helpful.

fishman · May 2, 2011

tommu56 said:
Unfortunally for me I did my kids car work but they had to be my gofer and stay with me while I was working on it (if I couldn't play they couldn't either).
motors from the junk yard were around 500 to 1000 dollars my labor was cheep so you can tell how I did it.
They learn't to keep an eye on oil and water and ATF after that.

Call around to the junk yards and see what motors cost.

I like your thinking but I just don't think I'm up to the task of replacing an engine. While I am handy, it just sounds pretty intimidating. Anybody want to try and convince me otherwise?

aczlan · May 2, 2011

Buy another Impala, pull the new parts from the old car that can be used on the new car and sell the old car to a JY for $300

Aaron Z

richamor · May 2, 2011

I'd look into a rebuilt long block. Why buy someone else's problems? Fix yours and you know what you have. Sell/trade yours and maybe in bigger problems down the road. It sounds like you're pretty far into this one already.

Changing out the engine in a late model car is something best left for the pro.

MossRoad · May 2, 2011

fishman said:
I need some advice.

My daughter has been using our 2000 Impala for the last three or four years while going to college. Friday she was heading out of town to meet some friends and got stuck in traffic on the interstate for two hours. Then the electric cooling fan failed and the car overheated to the point that it died. Thankfully she made it onto an outer road, and then to a gas station.

After incurring a hefty tow bill to get it back to my trusted mechanic, I got the bad news that the head gasket had blown. Cost estimate is $1,300 for replacement with valve job, assuming the head is good, which I don't know of course. The fan motor is $300. Add another $100 or so for new plugs and a new belt and we are in it for about $1700 assuming best case.

The car has 190k on it and ran great before the issue. The engine is a 3.4l. I've kept the car mechanically in good shape, and cosmetically it is ok, but teenage girls are hard on cars. Recent outlays included new front bearings, struts, and other suspension parts, new brakes and rotors, new ac compressor, and the tires only have about 5k on them, all told about $4k in the last two years. The car is super comfortable and everyone in the family likes it. The only other potential big ticket items on the car would be the transmission, which is working fine right now.

I do trust my mechanic, as I have done a lot of business with them and they have always been fair and honest.

So as I see it my choices are:

1) Dump the car with the head gasket problem and buy a new one. I'd get maybe $500 out of it, and reasonable cars could be had for $3k to $4k more.

2) Move forward with replacing the head gasket/valve job and hope that the head is ok. Cost would be about $1,700. The shop I trust does not rebuild whole engines.

3) Obtain a low mileage used engine and have the shop swap it out. Cost would be about $3k according the the mechanic, but it remains to be seen what the engine will cost.

4) Another option is rebuilt, but I don't know what that would cost, and the mechanic didn't mention it. Online sources for rebuilt engines show about $2k plus shipping.

I am thinking that the first option is the least desirable, since for the price I'm looking at, I could just be buying another problem. Budget dictates no more than about a $4k outlay, as I will not borrow money for a car. But if someone thinks differently, please educate me. It's just that I've replaced a lot of wear items in the car already, and it drives really nice.

I'm thinking that a used engine or a rebuilt would be better than doing essentially a top end refresh on an engine with 190k on it, since something else might go wrong. I'm really looking for some advice here, as I'm in a quandary as to what to do. I hate spending so much money on repairing an old car that is only worth maybe $2k when fixed. However, I'm not sure I buy into the concept that you don't ever spend more money to fix a car than it's worth. The worth of a car, in my opinion, is how reliably it gets you to your destination. I think that when repaired, this car would be more reliable than a car I could buy with the amount required to fix this one.

Advice please.

I have a 2000 Impala with the 3.8. I can get a used engine for $500.00 and install it myself in 2 days. $3K seems excessive, to me. Tranny repairs on that year can run $2500 and that will fail soon, given the mileage on the car.

If I were in you shoes, I would find another used Impala with low miles, have your trusted mechanic give it his blessing before purchase, then, if all is well, swap the tires and be done with it.

Tig · May 2, 2011

I lost a head gasket on a trip one summer. Since I did not significantly overheat the car and I was the primary driver, I opted for the cheapest way out. I pulled the head, replaced the gasket and kept on driving it. If I couldn't have done that I think I would have dumped it and replaced it with something that had half as many miles on it.
I've changed engines on other cars, it's a big job. So, my vote is to replace this car with an 05.

fishman · May 2, 2011

An update from my mechanic:

Cost for tow (60 loaded miles) and electric fan module is $525.

Cost for gaskets and valve job is $1,350. Could be more if head is cracked

Cost for used engine installed with 85k on it is $2,300

Looking at area Craigslist cars yesterday evening was disappointing. $3k cars are pretty sketch and $2k cars are not suitable. Looks like $5 to $6k would be required for a decent replacement car, which is more than I have.

Of the two options above, I like the used engine route for $1k more than a head gasket/valve job. The ballpark estimate for rebuilding the transmission if it went was less than $1,500, and that is the biggest potential cost for the near future.

All of this would be easier if I had a car replacement fund set aside. My wife and I just finished paying off all our debts except the house using the Dave Ramsey plan. (highly recommend it) Unfortunately, our emergency fund isn't up to snuff yet.

The mechanic is going to look some more for a less expensive/lower mileage engine. I'm going to continue looking at Craigslist. There is more than one way to get things done

aczlan · May 2, 2011

fishman said:
The mechanic is going to look some more for a less expensive/lower mileage engine. I'm going to continue looking at Craigslist. There is more than one way to get things done

Might be able to pick up a Impala that got tboned or rear ended for $cheap and pull the engine from that...

Aaron Z

fishman · Sep 23, 2021

Warning! . . . Warning! Zombie thread alert!

I came across this old thread of mine from 10 years ago and saw that I didn't let everyone know what I did. Now of course, it's irrelevant in the context of that crisis, but the end result might be helpful to know for others who might find themselves considering a similar course of action.

I ultimately had the used engine installed and things went smoothly with that. My daughter drove it until she graduated, and kept it afterwards. She got married and they drove that car some more. They drove the tires off of it, then replaced them with some super cheap tires, which required replacing after about 25k more miles. All told they put approximately 75k more miles on it over about 5 years without a mechanical breakdown, including one very long cross-country trip which worried the heck out of me. In the end they traded it in for $1k or so on a slightly used little Honda SUV and I breathed a sigh of relief.

So the decision to put a used engine in it ended up just fine. I didn't incur any debt, and she had transportation. She also learned why its important to maintain your car and appreciated the newer car when she got it. My son, who was 9 at the time, also learned from her mistakes and he is very, very responsible with his car's maintenance. In fact, he loves working on his car.

There. I finished this thread. Better late than never.

dodge man · Sep 23, 2021

Wrong choice, you should have hauled it to the crusher, then spoiled her by buying her a brand new BMW. In all honesty I would have told you to bail on it.

Good to hear it worked out, of course I didn’t realize this thread was 10 years until I got to the end.

mark in portugal · Sep 24, 2021

Fun to read the end report of the story and know you had a good result.
I had a 1965 Impala...that was around 1990. I wonder where it is now?

ROUSTABOUT · Sep 24, 2021

I will swap in gas engines all day every day for 600 bucks. Just make the check out to Citizens Against Social Healing. You can abbreviate it CASH. I SWAPPED them all the time. In with some used car dealers. They'd buy things with bad engines or transmissions. Diesels are a little more. Some of them you have to pull the cab. Some gas trucks are that way too. I would fix the impala. If you dont buy her a new car you will just be buying another problem. Those cars last. Did she have several gallons of water since its an older car?I carry. Mine is in the 200,000 mile club. Heading to 500,000 if I dont wreck it. Sounds like you need to explain to her how things work. And how when she don't do her part it makes you work to pay for this stuff. That fan was making noise before it went out. She kept going till it rattled and quit. Put all new hoses on it too. I even buy a new radiator. Impala is an easy engine swap.