How much ballast for an MX6000?

[LD1]

No sir. Incorrect. Any weight centered on the rear axle regardless of source has zero effect on the load on the front axle/tires. Vertical weight added on the tractor chassis forward of the rear axle increases weight on the front tires. Vertical weight added on the chassis aft of the rear axle (like at the 3pt hitch) reduces the weight on the front axle/tires. That is the context of us discussing Ballast in the first place. Strength of Materials, Statics 101 problem -- levers and weights. Do the diagram.

LD1 , you said "it can only muster to lift 800# in the bucket before the rear wheels lift into the air." I cannot imagine where you got the idea it would (or could or might) lift the rear wheels off the ground (!!) Get serious.

No, I am not wrong. I am 100% correct in everything I said with exception to perhaps the exact weights. But the concept is accurate. There is no need for a pi$$ing match here.

FACT: A bare tractor with NO ballast cannot come anywhere close to lifting the full rated load capacity of the loader. (sure...some overly heavy tractors or large farm tractors maybe. But definitely not most smaller tractors and definitely not kubotas, which are light to begin with)

This naturally limits how much weight the front axle will see.....simply because you cannot lift max weight.

By adding ballast....you are INCREASING what you can lift up front. And that ALSO increases the weight transfer from rear to front. Double whammy.

Its not until you have ENOUGH counterweight to keep the rear down....and then significantly more....to actually start unloading the front axle.

And yes, a MX without any added ballast or counterweight.....800# is about all its gonna muster before the back of the tractor is no longer in the air. And even with loaded tires but nothing on the 3ph....the loader can still overpower the weight of the tractor.

There are plenty of MX owners on this forum that can likely verify exactly what I am saying

 

[LD1]

View attachment 861943
All heavy steel and concrete - set it up for carrying saws and towing the log splitter at the same time. (MX5100 in photo)

Thats nice. How much you reckon it weighs? Are them R4's loaded?

 

[jyoutz]

No, I am not wrong. I am 100% correct in everything I said with exception to perhaps the exact weights. But the concept is accurate. There is no need for a pi$$ing match here.

FACT: A bare tractor with NO ballast cannot come anywhere close to lifting the full rated load capacity of the loader. (sure...some overly heavy tractors or large farm tractors maybe. But definitely not most smaller tractors and definitely not kubotas, which are light to begin with)

This naturally limits how much weight the front axle will see.....simply because you cannot lift max weight.

By adding ballast....you are INCREASING what you can lift up front. And that ALSO increases the weight transfer from rear to front. Double whammy.

Its not until you have ENOUGH counterweight to keep the rear down....and then significantly more....to actually start unloading the front axle.

And yes, a MX without any added ballast or counterweight.....800# is about all its gonna muster before the back of the tractor is no longer in the air. And even with loaded tires but nothing on the 3ph....the loader can still overpower the weight of the tractor.

There are plenty of MX owners on this forum that can likely verify exactly what I am saying

I’ve never tried lifting maximum weight with my loader without ballast, always with my filled tires (1000#+) and a 1000# implement on back. With my 400# forks, a one ton pallet is maximum lift with a MX.

 

[LD1]

I’ve never tried lifting maximum weight with my loader without ballast, always with my filled tires (1000#+) and a 1000# implement on back. With my 400# forks, a one ton pallet is maximum lift with a MX.

And most people DONT try and lift max weight intentionally.

But it happens way more often than most think about.

Say you have a light implement on the back....landscape rake, land plane, post hole digger, etc.

And you go scoop into that pile of dirt or stone to try and snag a bucket load which is only ~1000lbs....but trying to "breakout" of the pile tractor gets a little light in the hind quarters.....THAT just put all that weight on the front axle. INCLUDING the weight that you added as liquid in the rears.

The simple notion that ballast added to the rear tires always stays on the rear and cannot be transferred to the front axle is dead wrong and just bad advise. That liquid ballast is no different than any other part of the machine...either forward or behind the rear axle. Some or all of that weight indeed transfers to the front axle when lifting a load.

 

[jyoutz]

And most people DONT try and lift max weight intentionally.

But it happens way more often than most think about.

Say you have a light implement on the back....landscape rake, land plane, post hole digger, etc.

And you go scoop into that pile of dirt or stone to try and snag a bucket load which is only ~1000lbs....but trying to "breakout" of the pile tractor gets a little light in the hind quarters.....THAT just put all that weight on the front axle. INCLUDING the weight that you added as liquid in the rears.

The simple notion that ballast added to the rear tires always stays on the rear and cannot be transferred to the front axle is dead wrong and just bad advise. That liquid ballast is no different than any other part of the machine...either forward or behind the rear axle. Some or all of that weight indeed transfers to the front axle when lifting a load.

That’s what the additional 1000#+ on the 3ph is for.

 

[jonsstihl]

I think we got this figured out but It is not a static problem, as soon as you start trying to lift the load it becomes a dynamic problem. the way I see it is you really should be using the 3pt almost to its full capacity if you are using max capacity on your loader.

I have a multi purpose counterweight with chain hooks and hitch and a log holder for cutting branches but my problem is I built it when I had my b7800 so it probably weighs 800 pounds which was plenty for the b7800 but it is a little light for my L4740.

 

[LD1]

the way I see it is you really should be using the 3pt almost to its full capacity if you are using max capacity on your loader.

BINGO

 

[JWR]

No, I am not wrong. I am 100% correct in everything I said with exception to perhaps the exact weights. But the concept is accurate. There is no need for a pi$$ing match here.

FACT: A bare tractor with NO ballast cannot come anywhere close to lifting the full rated load capacity of the loader. (sure...some overly heavy tractors or large farm tractors maybe. But definitely not most smaller tractors and definitely not kubotas, which are light to begin with)

This naturally limits how much weight the front axle will see.....simply because you cannot lift max weight.

By adding ballast....you are INCREASING what you can lift up front. And that ALSO increases the weight transfer from rear to front. Double whammy.

Its not until you have ENOUGH counterweight to keep the rear down....and then significantly more....to actually start unloading the front axle.

And yes, a MX without any added ballast or counterweight.....800# is about all its gonna muster before the back of the tractor is no longer in the air. And even with loaded tires but nothing on the 3ph....the loader can still overpower the weight of the tractor.

There are plenty of MX owners on this forum that can likely verify exactly what I am saying

I stated the relevant facts twice, I will have no further comment.

 

[LD1]

I stated the relevant facts twice, I will have no further comment.

No, you stated your incorrect opinion twice.

Sure, you are correct if everything is static, and the loader doesnt try and lift anything at all.

Tractor just sitting there and you add weight to the rear tires.....sure....no weight gets added to the front axle.

Now, get in the real world of actually using the tractor and lifting loads. Weight can (AND DOES) transfer to the front axle when the loader lifts something. And the weight that transfers doesnt care if its forward or aft or right on the rear axle. It dont care if its liquid ballast, cast weights, or the tiller hanging off the back.

The more the front loader lifts, the more weight is transferred to the front axle PERIOD. Adding ballast in the rear tires allows the loader to lift more weight....thus TRANSFERING more weight to the front axle. Not sure why this is such a hard concept to grasp. But fortunatally, I think everyone else understands.

 

[ning]

I'm investing in this thread at 3 pages, very bullish on this.
Considering identical threads have gone tens if not hundreds of pages, this one should be a beaut!