Global Warming?

[emcvay]

One thing I should note is that I don't have a problem with trying to clean up the environment nor with trying to stop pollution overall. I do however, have a problem with people who think that by taking away freedom/liberty they can somehow make the planet better or that by taking wealth from one class of people, or country and giving it to another they will somehow save the world.

How about common sense and logical solutions.

First, prove that man is causing the planet to actually get warmer -- no one has done this to date though the 'Global Warming - Sky is Falling' crowd have certainly decided that they have done so -- to do so, by the way, you would first have to rule out the sun since that flaming ball of fire in the sky appears to have some kind of impact on earths temperature (not that the Anthropogenic Global Warming Crowd -- AGWC for short -- would admit).

Then you'd have to come up with a real answer to solving the problem starting not with government taxes and redistribution of wealth and the implementation of socialist policies but rather, perhaps free market / private enterprise solutions that actually do work. Which also means that you'd have to stop looking for Uncle Sam and the UN to solve all your problems but rather to yourself to solve them.

I suggest reading 'The really Inconvenient Truths' by Ian Murray to get an idea of what I'm talking about.

Simply put, anyone who suggests I give up what little liberty I have left to save the planet is someone who I immediately discount and tune out. You're the real danger.

Same thing goes for those who think taking money from Americans and giving to other countries will help -- redistribution of wealth in a way that only Maynard Keynes would appreciate (and dreamed of).

Again, do we ban volcanoes?

 

[lilranch2001]

I like the Bush and Cheeny addage myself: "I got mine"

huh?
oh, just another unintelligible lib statement.....

 

[emcvay]

I might also add that the very same people who want to take your freedom / liberty in the name of saving the planet from oil (the original biofuel I might add) and take your wealth to give to others while they are at it -- again somehow in the name of saving the planet from man (though the plants would love it if they are right and produce more oxygen but I digress) are the very same people telling us that oil is running out and we're going to have to live without it soon....like in 1976....er....1989....ah....1999 well sometime in the near future.

If that is correct AGWC, then why is it you're worried at all? After all when oil runs out the cars and industry stops and all we are left with is coal and natural gas which will also run out leaving us with what? Nuclear energy?

So in the end either oil is running out and you might as well enjoy it and your freedom while it lasts, or it isn't and we might as well let the free market do it's thing and what is the worst case? That man dies off because there is too much CO2 in the air? The plants then produce massive amounts of oxygen and suddenly new life 'evolves' (you also believe in that right?) into a new species and all is good.

You see, the real question is not whether or not man is causing the planet to have a fever or not but rather if man deserves to be free or not.

Alinsky said something like "It's not the cause stupid, just the quest for power" (I ad libbed a bit there but you get the jist) and today guess what? The AGWC falls right into that trap either knowing or not that the end result isn't a saved planet but rather the total loss of liberty.

 

[Tollster]

Dead lakes?
Did the libs shoot all of them with guns they tried to take away from free men in PA?

Indiana's lakes are as healthy as I have ever seen them. Go figure...... wait oh yea Indiana is a red state, we prolly didn't let the libs take our guns

I recon if you knew what a dead lake was, you may have a clue what global warming was as well, Sorry, I was wrong on both accounts. oh by the way, we outnumber that red state of yours in firearm ownership since the revolution was fought.

 

[Tollster]

huh?
oh, just another unintelligible lib statement.....

Political control for self wealth, create a war under false pretences (WMA's) and line your own pockets.

Sorry pal, but I'm a registered indendent,as neither party represents me.

 

[lilranch2001]

Political control for self wealth, create a war under false pretences (WMA's) and line your own pockets.

Sorry pal, but I'm a registered indendent,as neither party represents me.

OHH I recon you is smarter n me, since you is a registered indendent, since I have never even hard of a registered indendent befoe.
Me, I am one of them thar guys who votes for the parson who best represents my simple minded thoughts

 

[Tollster]

OHH I recon you is smarter n me, since you is a registered indendent, since I have never even hard of a registered indendent befoe.
Me, I am one of them thar guys who votes for the parson who best represents my simple minded thoughts

Understandable, you could always return to school for your diploma,its never too late don'tchaknow.

 

[lilranch2001]

Understandable, you could always return to school for your diploma,its never too late don'tchaknow.

I will just as soon as you go back n larn how to speel

:laughing:

:cool2:

 

[houstonscott]

I don't know if you are very political but we have a two party system. All independents vote and caucus with the democrats. So while you may claim to vote independent you are really a democrat. There are no true independents in our government they are all democrats. Just so you know, you represent democrats if you vote independent.

Political control for self wealth, create a war under false pretences (WMA's) and line your own pockets.

Sorry pal, but I'm a registered indendent,as neither party represents me.

 

[Tollster]

I don't vote on party lines,therefore I vote for the lesser of two evils,either republican or democrat. I tried both parties at one time, and liked neither. typically the losing party blames us for their loss, so if Obama wins in November, I recon ya'll can say I'm a democrat..again. Howevevr,many of us are still waiting on the 3rd party...not to sway the vote...but for a winning vote.Perhaps one day.

 

[EE_Bota]

I recon if you knew what a dead lake was, you may have a clue what global warming was as well, Sorry, I was wrong on both accounts. oh by the way, we outnumber that red state of yours in firearm ownership since the revolution was fought.

Understandable, you could always return to school for your diploma,its never too late don'tchaknow.

You reckon?

 

[EE_Bota]

I don't know if you are very political but we have a two party system. All independents vote and caucus with the democrats. So while you may claim to vote independent you are really a democrat. There are no true independents in our government they are all democrats. Just so you know, you represent democrats if you vote independent.

Don't assume that folks like me, registered "unaffiliated" which is NC for "independent" actually vote for candidates running as (I). Those candidates and folks like me simply don't want to be affiliated with Democrats nor Republicans. Think about the number of independents in government vs the number of independent voters, and you will understand the reality of the issue.

 

[lilranch2001]

You reckon?

Bota, just in case you were not bright nuff to notice I was playing on each n every word of your buddy tollstie, I was, he is the one who cannot speel

:cool2:

:laughing:

 

[EE_Bota]

Bota, just in case you were not bright nuff to notice I was playing on each n every word of your buddy tollstie, I was, he is the one who cannot speel

:cool2:

:laughing:

I don't mind misspelling, but I hate to see them mixed in with insults about education or intellect. As for your comment about "in case your were not bright enough" well, thanks, I guess.

 

[lilranch2001]

Political control for self wealth, create a war under false pretences (WMA's) and line your own pockets.

Sorry pal, but I'm a registered indendent,as neither party represents me.

It is still mind boggling how many people wanna completely blame Bush for the WMA's when Democrats and Republicans, and at least 100 other countries believed that that there were WMA's
Actually I am still not convinced there were not any.
There is a huge desert out there that they still could be hiding under, or could have easily crossed into another Islamic state.
But I am sure you are so smart you have a logical excuse for that possibility

 

[toppop52]

There is a huge desert out there that they still could be hiding under, or could have easily crossed into another Islamic state.
But I am sure you are so smart you have a logical excuse for that possibility

I know, I know.... Bush did it!!!:laughing:

 

[Rainbody]

Here's the bottom line to the green movement.
No one believes you. End.
You chicken little experts have called the sky is falling since 79 and yet.....nothing.
Your "facts" are a mixed between doctored stats, models that don't include rainfall or atmospheric pressure, and ALL lack a control group.
Your high priests make crazy claims about population control, attempt to regulate citizens of other countries, claim to have invented the Internet, and even today claimed to invented the hybrid Lexus.
Maybe in a several years after you do some house cleaning and start to come to the table in what is reality. Until then your movement is filled with either crazies in foil hats under solar panel roofs or elitist douches who 87 c/kwh wouldn't effect.
Good luck with your movement. FIN

 

[Egon]

Here's the bottom line to the green movement.
No one believes you. End.

If no one believes in the Green Movement how can there be a Green Movement??

 

[Rob-D]

No matter what side you are on, greenie, warmer or denier, there are dozens of web sites to support your position.
None of them Prove anything - Just someones or groups opinion.

Hate to repeat myself but here goes.
If coal was as bad as the last post says, everyone close to Tucson or N. AZ would have cancer or already dead.

With All that acid rain nothing would be growing - Yet there are major farms all over the place around here. Strange????

A few more little facts or quotes.
I've got my solar panels and they are making me money. Very Good - They are guaranteed for 25 years. Maybe not so good.
They were made in the USA -- Maybe not so good. 17+ Solar mfg. given gov $$$ have gone out of business. That includes GE.
GE spokes man says when solar power proves practical and cost efficient they may start over.

Glass panels require huge amounts of Heat to mfg. To the best of my knowledge they all use fossil fuel.
Plastic panels are made out of crude oil.
Glass can be shattered by a hale storm. 5 Years in the sun at my place and the plastic panels will be toast.

Solar does not work to well covered with snow. Not a problem, go heaters to melt it off. Opp's Need a whole bunch of them Lead Acid batteries. How do you blow the clouds away when the whole sky turns gray.

Don't use lead acid batteries, got some of those lithium batteries. Good deal They are a little worse hazard than the lead acid. Bet they contain some of that nasty cadmium, mined in China.

Enough for 1 Rant.

I always find it interesting when the people who aren't doing something and aren't living a certain way know more about what's going on than the people actually doing it!

The WHO contributes lung disease and cancer to pollution. Talk to doctors and health care people about the alarming cancer rates today. I have.

I have previously posted the effects to our lakes and oceans with respect to their over acidity. Things don't stop growing but the acidic effects change growth.
We are seeing pine tree die offs in the Catskill attributed to acid rain. Crops suffer also.

Effects of Acid Rain - Forests | Acid Rain | US EPAOver the years, scientists, foresters, and others have noted a slowed growth of some forests. Leaves and needles turn brown and fall off when they should be green and healthy. In extreme cases, individual trees or entire areas of the forest simply die off without an obvious reason.

My PV modules are guaranteed to put out full power for 25 years with 10% diminished output after that, they will still be putting out power in 35 and 40 years. At that point they will be highly recycled.

According the Engineering Efficiency Times Sept/Oct 2011, the energy used to create a PV module is regained in about one year with 29 years of clean energy afterward.

Solar Companies went out of business because they were being undersold by unfair imports from China, we now have tariffs on Chinese panels. My panels are all made in the USA.

PV modules don't use plastic, they are glass, aluminum, etc. Due to the angle of the panels hale hits them at an angle with little or no damage. Are you concerned about the windows in your house and car from hale storms?

The angle of approach in northern climates where snow falls is steep. Here my winter angel is 28 degrees from vertical, snow immediately slides off panels. On my roof where the snow does have a chance of accumulation I have a long snow rake to remove it. I did this a few times last year. In order to drive a car that is not garaged in my area it is a common practice to clean of cars, driveways, etc. It is part of living in northern climates.

I have so many panels I produce enough energy even on overcast days. The average sun in our area, taken from long time surveys, is over 5 hours conservatively, more than enough to power our home and send excess to the grid. Batteries are only used when th grid fails, their life expectancy is over 20 years, 95% recycled.

It baffles me that the opponents of alternate energy are so ill informed yet so outspoken.

Rob

 

[toppop52]

I would love to see an honest, totally unbiased study of what it would cost to make a productive family of 4 with a garage, a/c, air compressor, electric range, dryer, TV's, back up heat if you use gas/oil/coal/wood for primary etc... self sufficient 100% of the time while still selling to the grid and see if the universe is going to live long enough to get back the investment assuming no subsidies from anywhere. I'd bet not.