Gear drive vs hydro

[Modn]

Still of topic (nice break IMHO) I have run our Case 580B for years until retirement a year ago thinking we wouldn't miss it (yeah right). I always left it in neutral and used the backhoe to keep moving forward after maxing out the length of the trench or picking the rear up and moving it sideways. My original question is more like: Will is HURT an HST if I leave it in neutral and do the same? The way I do/did it seems to be the best way (for me anyway) and when I do purchase the hoe I will be ready to go. My guess is it will be fine as it releases the HST totally from the axle when putting in neutral.....Correct?

 

[Chuck K.]

Quote:
Originally Posted by dfkrug
That is the way I do it, too. (Use a stick to operate HST pedal from hoe
seat.) With my previous gear tractors, I would use the hoe to move fwd
and rev, after lifting the FEL bkt. With the HST, you have the self-braking
action if you keep it in gear. I find that to be much safer when inching
fwd or back, esp on slopes. With the HST, you do not have to use the
FEL bkt as a anchor, either, but you still may want to.

Well, I suppose if I was THAT much off when backing to hook up an implement I would put the bucket to dump and get it's edge about vertical, then put a bit of weight on it and leave the tractor in (REAL)neutral, brakes off.
A little feathered curl/dump action would probably move it whatever fractions of an inch I needed.

Oh dear me NO ! Mary.
No WAY would I do that on the polished hardwood floor in the air conditioned garage.
Only in the dirt.

I believe dfkrug, was referring to my post about inching forward while trenching, not backing up to an implement..

 

[MossRoad]

Still of topic (nice break IMHO) I have run our Case 580B for years until retirement a year ago thinking we wouldn't miss it (yeah right). I always left it in neutral and used the backhoe to keep moving forward after maxing out the length of the trench or picking the rear up and moving it sideways. My original question is more like: Will is HURT an HST if I leave it in neutral and do the same? The way I do/did it seems to be the best way (for me anyway) and when I do purchase the hoe I will be ready to go. My guess is it will be fine as it releases the HST totally from the axle when putting in neutral.....Correct?

Not sure. My late 70s IH 2500b was hydro. It said to never tow it without doing many special things... like opening a valve, adding a couple gallons of hydro fluid, etc... before towing. But that is towing with the engine off, not inching a machine along a few feet at a time.

I would think as long as the range selector is in neutral and the engine is running to provide lubrication to the HST, it would not hurt it to nudge it along with the backhoe.

 

[N80]

I have to disagree with you here. While 0% financing sounds great, there is nothing in life that is free.

That is true, but does not impact the final math. You can often bargain the price down on new AND used, sometimes you can't. But the data I have when making the decision is:

1) Final purchase price of new tractor
2) Interest to be paid on new tractor (0%)

Add those two for the total price, 'A'.

Then I also know:

1) Final price on used tractor
2) Interest to be paid on loan for used tractor.

Add those two for the total price, 'B'.

If 'A' is less than 'B', then it is what it is regardless of any padding to make up for the 0%. In my case, as stated, it was often a wash. And when it is so close as to be trivial, then why on earth would anyone buy used?

So the fact that the sale price on the new tractor is 'padded' is of no consequence, because the final price is 'known' and taken into consideration.

See what I'm saying?

And P.S.: And like you, I got my L4400 for a steal and that's with the 0%. It was the lowest price, by a good bit, of any in the region.

 

[milkman]

I quit reading this nonsense about five pages back, I know to never wrestle with a pig....

 

[N80]

I quit reading this nonsense about five pages back, I know to never wrestle with a pig....

Than what are you doing in the pig stye??????

Kind of reminds me of the rich guy in the tuxedo storming into the room where Moe, Larry and Curly have instigated another epic pie fight and demanding "What is the meaning of this!"

Of course, he leaves with as much pie on him as anyone else. And yes, I know where that analogy places the rest of us.

I'm Moe by the way. Mossroad is Larry. Egon is Curly. Patrick is.......... Shemp.

 

[MossRoad]

Than what are you doing in the pig stye??????

Kind of reminds me of the rich guy in the tuxedo storming into the room where Moe, Larry and Curly have instigated another epic pie fight and demanding "What is the meaning of this!"

Of course, he leaves with as much pie on him as anyone else. And yes, I know where that analogy places the rest of us.

I'm Moe by the way. Mossroad is Larry. Egon is Curly. Patrick is.......... Shemp.

You forgot Joe.... wooowoowowwwoooooo

 

[Heywood Jannockitov]

You forgot Joe.... wooowoowowwwoooooo

Which Joe? Besser or DeRita?

Whyyyy-I-otta!

 

[dfkrug]

I believe dfkrug, was referring to my post about inching forward while trenching, not backing up to an implement..

Yes, that is correct. I did a bunch of trenching recently and I would do as
much as 40-50 linear feet without getting out of the hoe seat. If the ground
became a bit sloped, the HST in low range would creep by itself slowly down
hill. This was no problem. I found moving the tractor from the hoe seat
about 4 feet at a time using a stick and the HST pedal to be somewhat
better than putting tranny in neutral and pushing/pulling with the hoe. No
damage to the HST will occur if it is put into neutral and moved like you would
a gear tractor. The most inconvenient thing with trenching was adjusting
the engine speed from the hoe seat. I have just converted to a TLB-style
speed control: a lever next to the seat, rather than next to the steering
column.

 

[MossRoad]

Whyyyy-I-otta!

Funny thing is, your cat looks like its sayin' it!

Whyyyy-I-otta!
​

 

[DJMac]

It's a matter of personal preference and convenience. The eternal auto trans vs manual trans debate. Keep in mind, having enough power is rarely the problem, having enough traction is usually the problem!

 

[jake98]

Traction can get you in trouble. I remember once...

 

[SPYDERLK]

Traction can get you in trouble. I remember once...

??????Iceskating???????

 

[Egon]

??????Iceskating???????

But people only think they skate on ice!

 

[froggy]

This comment from Dargo caught my attention. I have never driven a tractor with HST and wonder if this is a problem with just rocker pedals or with all HST pedal systems?

 

[dfkrug]

This comment from Dargo caught my attention. I have never driven a tractor with HST and wonder if this is a problem with just rocker pedals or with all HST pedal systems?

I have not had any of these problems with a rocker pedal or the 2 pedal
HSTs, and I have many hours on both kinds. HSTs have a cruise control
to lock the pedal for constant speed driving. Two advantages I see of the
rocker pedal over the 2-pedal systems: it is easier to find where to
put your foot without looking, as you twist around in your seat maneuvering
fwd and rev. And you can operate the rocker pedal while standing up, as
when you are trying to precisely place your FEL bkt or FEL forks.

 

[froggy]

Thanks for the reply.

 

[MossRoad]

This comment from Dargo caught my attention. I have never driven a tractor with HST and wonder if this is a problem with just rocker pedals or with all HST pedal systems?

I have owned two different HST pedal configurations. My old IH had seperate forward and reverse pedals operated by the left foot. My current Power Trac has a treadle, with the right foot you go forward, with the left you go reverse. Pushing either pedal causes the other to rise. Several Kubotas that I operated had the treadle on the right foot, with toe push moving you forward and heel push moving in reverse.

None of the HST tractors that I operated had cruise control, so, yes, if you need to stay at a constant speed for a long time, you have to keep your foot on the direction pedal the entire time and it could cause exactly what he stated: shin starts to hurt.

I only found that problem with mowing large fields. For any operation that requires frequent speed or direction changes, like mowing around landscaping, trees, snow plowing, front end loader work, brush hogging, etc... I never noticed any shin pain when operating an HST.

Hope that helps.

 

[SPYDERLK]

I have owned two different HST pedal configurations. My old IH had seperate forward and reverse pedals operated by the left foot. My current Power Trac has a treadle, with the right foot you go forward, with the left you go reverse. Pushing either pedal causes the other to rise. Several Kubotas that I operated had the treadle on the right foot, with toe push moving you forward and heel push moving in reverse.

None of the HST tractors that I operated had cruise control, so, yes, if you need to stay at a constant speed for a long time, you have to keep your foot on the direction pedal the entire time and it could cause exactly what he stated: shin starts to hurt.

I only found that problem with mowing large fields. For any operation that requires frequent speed or direction changes, like mowing around landscaping, trees, snow plowing, front end loader work, brush hogging, etc... I never noticed any shin pain when operating an HST.

Hope that helps.

I added a 2# [approx] weight to the front section of my BX1500 treadle. Going forward requires little holding force. Backup ... more. A pleasant tradoff.
larry

 

[patrick_g]

This comment from Dargo caught my attention. I have never driven a tractor with HST and wonder if this is a problem with just rocker pedals or with all HST pedal systems?

I have HST with rocker pedal, the only type I have extensive experience with, and have NEVER had any discomfort operating the pedal. The way my pedal is shaped lets you place your heel on the floor and your toe on the forward part of the pedal (part you step on to go forward) and for backing up you can place your toes (and ball of your foot on the floor and your heel on the rear portion of the pedal which is for backing up.

You can put your entire foot on the pedal but I think it would be uncomfortable and was not the way the dealer staff showed me to use it. I can transition from forward to backwards positioning of my foot quickly enough to be driving the wheels the opposite direction the tractor is moving so the foot position I use is economical of your motion, effective, and non tiring. My pedal foot is one of the least stressed parts of my anatomy when I am really working the tractor hard, fast and furious.

Pat