Tires Front tires plowing the ground

[Spiveyman]

When I first got my tractor I noticed that I had to be careful not to cut the wheel too hard if I was going very fast at all or my front wheels would leave big ruts in the grass. Here's what kind of tires I have:


We were in a drought most of the summer, so the ground was like concrete. I could drive around slowly and not tear the grass up too bad. Then I got a FEL. Then is finally started to rain some. I was out there last night on the soft ground and even at a crawl I was leaving huge ruts in the grass every time I turned.

Is that a problem with this type of tire specifically? Are there better tred patterns that will lessen the problem? Or is that just something you deal with on a big tractor?

 

[vic4news]

I don't have any experience with this type of tractor, but I would check to make sure that the differential lock was not stuck on causing both rear wheels to turn at the same speed and therefore making it hard to turn.

Vic

 

[MrJimi]

Check the distance from a rib in the front of your tire and at the rear on same rib at axle height, they should be close, they call that toe in/toe out, and it can be adjusted real easy
Jim

 

[BillyP]

From my experience you have the worse front tire design possible for a lawn. You need a more flat (big footprint) tire so it will not sink in so much. I've even seen car tires used on older tractors. They're flat and don't leave much of a footprint.

Also, you didn't say, but if you leave the FEL on that will add to the problem.

 

[Dascro]

There is nothing wrong with your tractor based on your description. Growing up on a farm, those tires were called "Tri-Ribs". They are made specifically for agricultural use. They do cut when turned sharp. They should not be used on a lawn or anywhere you don't want to peel the turf back when turning.

You can minimize those effects by using the turning brakes.

They are great tires for field work though. I personally wouldn't have a farm tractor without Tri-Ribs on the front. Wouldn't drive them on a lawn though!

Dave

 

[AndyMA]

The otheres have it right. Those are basic ribbed farm tires, not designed to go on lawns. Since it is 2WD you can change to any tires you want. I suspect that Galaxy Turf Tires would tear it up the least,

Andy

 

[JerryG]

Those tri-ribs will tear the grass if they are cut sharp. To lessen the effect, make sure that the toe in is set correctly and put on front weights.

 

[sandman2234]

My JD tractor originally had those on it, but they removed them for lawn work. They put on 11L-15 and those worked fine, but when I bought the JD, they were pretty worn. I had a couple of flats, and decide to put a pair of 31x13.50-15's that came on a trailer axle from the same farm.(no cost to me!!) It used the same bolt pattern, so they just mounted right on. Having 13.5 inches of rubber in a semi slick pattern, does wonders for expanding the load over a wider surface.
My Ford similar to yours uses R-1 on the front, so it tears up the grass also! I can really get the wife riled up by driving that 6 tire monster across the front yard!!!
David from jax

 

[texasjohn]

Spiveyman, your TBM buddies have correctly given you your answer.

 

[SPYDERLK]

Check your front alignment as mentioned earlier. I have a JD tricycle - the 2 fronts set close. No problem. It has to be alignment. There just isnt much lateral force needed to turn the tractor. Your tires are fighting each other.
larry

 

[Spiveyman]

I read through the posts, thanks to everyone for chiming in. A couple of these are really making me think.

...I would check to make sure that the differential lock was not stuck on causing both rear wheels to turn at the same speed and therefore making it hard to turn.

There just isnt much lateral force needed to turn the tractor. Your tires are fighting each other.

To lock my diff I have to step on a peddal. I've had to use it a couple times, but I am pretty certain that it disengaged both times. Question though. When moving lots of dirt, i.e. digging in with my FEL or dozing with my BB I have seen both tires spinning for a moment before I hit the clutch. CAN both tires spin if the diff lock is NOT engaged? If it was locked in, that might explain the seemingly excessive digging in of the front tires, but It doesn't feel like it's bogging down like I'd think it would if they were locked. I'll put it through its paces next time I get the chance and see what I can come up with on that one.

Check the distance from a rib in the front of your tire and at the rear on same rib at axle height, they should be close, they call that toe in/toe out, and it can be adjusted real easy

I'm a NASCAR fan, so I'm familiar with toe in/out. It seems to track fine in a straight line. It's only when I turn, the outside front tire seems to lay over a bit and bare the brunt of the force to turn the tractor, but I'll measure that as well. Should be easy to check.

From my experience you have the worse front tire design possible for a lawn.

...They are made specifically for agricultural use. They do cut when turned sharp. They should not be used on a lawn or anywhere you don't want to peel the turf back when turning. They are great tires for field work though. I personally wouldn't have a farm tractor without Tri-Ribs on the front. Wouldn't drive them on a lawn though!

No worries, I'm not driving that thing across the lawn. It's only used out in the fields, however, as someone put once, I'm a grass farmer. I raise grass and sell it in the form of beef, so I don't want to go around tearing up the grass in the fields any more than I have to. Ruining the grass is what the cattle are for.

It sounds for the most part like this is pretty much typical for this type of tire. I'll check the things mentioned, and just try to take it easy. The FEL is definitely not coming off, so the load's not getting any lighter.

 

[dbdartman]

To check the read diff-lock, chock one rear tire front & rear, jack the other rear tire just off the ground, & with the trans in neutral you should be able to easily spin the rear tire that's off the ground. If that tire won't spin, the diff-lock is stuck on.

As for the alignment, caster could be causing the problem along with toe. Trouble is, caster (& camber) usually isn't adjustable, so what you get is all there is. The best you can do is check the toe, & maybe adjust it to toe-out a little more, but only if you don't drive it on pavement, or at high speed. Of course, swapping the tri-ribs for turfs would also help, a LOT!

 

[sandman2234]

What size are the tri ribs, and what bolt pattern? Might help someone to look thru their junk pile to see if a spare set of rims are available and then you could buy new tires to replace those worn out tires you already have! (LOL)
All kidding aside, somebody might be interested in a swap or something close, if your interested in tire changing experience.
David from jax

 

[Farmwithjunk]

Being a row crop utility tractor, your Ford has adjustable axles front and rear. Set the track one step wider front and rear and the steering axle will track with less "push" (NASCAR term ) You end up with a wider, more stable (read SAFER) tractor that'll turn with less destruction. The MF150 in my avatar is set wider than "normal" for a tractor it's size. I did that to get a stable platform for hillside mowing. As an added benefit, it tracks better in turns.

Also, learn to use te steering brake(s) with a light touch to help bring the front end around. A heavy tractor with good rear tires will tend to hold traction on BOTH rear wheels even without a differential lock being applied, just enough to make the front tires slide a bit.

 

[Reg]

Lawn, FEL, skinny front tires.
Pick any two.

 

[zzvyb6]

I am an engineer with a NASCAR backround. The axle width adjustment affects the Ackermann steer of the tractor (Wikipedia this term). If the steer angles of the two front tires don't match the turn radii at the speed you are going when, the scrub will make the tire cut the lawn. This particular tire tread is intended to dig into the field and hold its own on sidehill operations for seeders, balers, etc.

Different Ackermann settings (adjusted by changing the top view angle of the steer arms on the knuckles) make cars and tractors have a preferred race line as they negotiate a turn.

 

[SPYDERLK]

Being a row crop utility tractor, your Ford has adjustable axles front and rear. Set the track one step wider front and rear and the steering axle will track with less "push" (NASCAR term ) You end up with a wider, more stable (read SAFER) tractor that'll turn with less destruction. The MF150 in my avatar is set wider than "normal" for a tractor it's size. I did that to get a stable platform for hillside mowing. As an added benefit, it tracks better in turns.

Also, learn to use te steering brake(s) with a light touch to help bring the front end around. A heavy tractor with good rear tires will tend to hold traction on BOTH rear wheels even without a differential lock being applied, just enough to make the front tires slide a bit.

Huh? Since the inside front must turn sharper than the outside in order to avoid scrubbing, setting them wider would just make the steering issue worse because the inside would be further inside and would have to turn even sharper. I dont believe tractors have alignment adjustments to allow for this.

I agree that steering brakes may help. Im not sure tho, how holding traction on both wheels is in any way analogous to forcing them to rotate at the same speed, as a diff lock would do. Are you referring to the difficulty in pivoting the contact patches - particularly the inner rear? In my experience thats only enuf of an issue to notice when you are turning quite sharply.

larry​

 

[Spiveyman]

...Might help someone to look thru their junk pile to see if a spare set of rims are available and then you could buy new tires to replace those worn out tires you already have! (LOL)

Let me guess, I bet you'd be willing to take those old tires off my hands for free! Thanks man.

Farmwithjunk - I would like to set the fronts out wider if that would help. I'll have to check and see if I can figure out how to get 'er done. I actually had the rears set in about 6" to try to get them inside my 8' box blade.

Question for the masses: Is it a bad idea to lift the front end off the ground with the FEL to do something like widen them? I don't have a farm jack (yet), so that would be my only option right now if I was going to mess with the fronts.

As for the steering brakes, does that wear out the bakes? I've used them before, mostly while learning how to drive my tractor, but didn't figure I should use them all the time. Also, I like to leave the break peddals locked together to help with braking and especially when setting the parking break. The little pin that locks them isn't easy to engage and disengage (although a little WD-40 might fix that.)

Lawn, FEL, skinny front tires.
Pick any two.

Funny. I like that one.

I am an engineer with a NASCAR backround. The axle width adjustment affects the Ackermann steer of the tractor (Wikipedia this term). If the steer angles of the two front tires don't match the turn radii at the speed you are going when, the scrub will make the tire cut the lawn.

First of all, I like you already. Ackermann steer!!! Nice.

This particular tire tread is intended to dig into the field and hold its own on sidehill operations for seeders, balers, etc.

Translation: Count your blessings, you have the right tires for the job? My farm's not that hilly, but there are certainly places that the traction on those tires comes in handy out in a field.

Thanks all.

 

[sandman2234]

Actually, in this single case, your front tires don't interest me, dispite the fact that they probably have less than 25 miles on them. They just won't fit anything I have, so I will bow out and allow someone else that priviledge. I do have a friend over in the panhandle of Florida that could use them for rear wheels on his tractor, but we would have to cut some cross grooves in them to give him some traction.
Seriously, do measure the bolt pattern on your Ford, and give the tire/wheel size. I might know of something that will work. You could also run LTtruck tires on it, dispite the fact that I don't like them, they will work, and give you more rubber contact, more air capacity, etc. A heavier duty set might even hold up to that FEL that you really ought to call me about while I still have time to come take it off your hands. (LOL)
David from Jax

 

[Farmwithjunk]

Huh? Since the inside front must turn sharper than the outside in order to avoid scrubbing, setting them wider would just make the steering issue worse because the inside would be further inside and would have to turn even sharper. I dont believe tractors have alignment adjustments to allow for this.

I agree that steering brakes may help. Im not sure tho, how holding traction on both wheels is in any way analogous to forcing them to rotate at the same speed, as a diff lock would do. Are you referring to the difficulty in pivoting the contact patches - particularly the inner rear? In my experience thats only enuf of an issue to notice when you are turning quite sharply.

larry​

Interesting theory, but in real live use, a wider setting does in FACT steer with less disturbance of the ground you're riding on. (To a point anyway, the "best width" is directly related to length [wheelbase])

As far as the brake steering, again, an interesting theory you have, but thousands of hours in the hayfields tell me otherwise. a slight tap of the steering brake on the inside wheel will make for a cleaner turn, even on a gradual (read NOT SHARP) turn. BTDT a million times.

It's easy to over-anylize anything. Sometimes you just have to take a look at what works and go with that.