Foton 404 - Starter makes winding sound

[Diamondpilot]

Also, is it possible the ABT engines starter is what we need? I know there was some games played with importing these things to meet emissions. Perhaps it has a phony data plate on the motor?

Its a 3 cylinder for sure. No glow plugs. No grid heater. The model on the tractors data plate shows it as a "King" for the year, its shows "2003'. The engines data plate shows the model as a "SL3105BT" and the year as a "1998". Again, the games they played to import.

Chris

 

[rickyddriskill]

Chris,

Thanks again for all your help! Just let me know where, and what, to buy for the winch. I checked the parts manual and it lists three starters: QD13L, QD153 (this is number of old one), and QD1401.

Also, is there any other type of internal mechanical issue that would cause the flywheel to be further forward than normal but still allow it to move freely?

 

[EE_Bota]

I thought about physical problems like a worn ring gear, or pinion, but it never really occurred to me that the pinion would not really reach enough to engage. I have never encountered such a thing.

Chris, it was sure nice of you to look into it. I know the OP appreciates it, and I do too. Thank-you.

 

[greg_g]

Also, is it possible the ABT engines starter is what we need?
Chris

Nope. The BT and ABT both used the QD13L originally. In the Foton anyway. But that's an obsolete part now, having been replaced by the QD1401. Not positive, but I think the 1408 goes in the 45hp Jinma. It is one tractor I know uses the ABT version of the SL3105. And I'll speculate further that the difference in pinion throw is due the difference in flywheel placement (Jinma vs Foton).

I am pretty sure however, that your other supposition is accurate. Somebody stuck that 1408 in there because the bolt holes matched. When it still wouldn't start, he just said the **** with it and stuck it in the auction.

//greg//

 

[Diamondpilot]

Nope. The BT and ABT both used the QD13L originally. In the Foton anyway. But that's an obsolete part now, having been replaced by the QD1401. Not positive, but I think the 1408 goes in the 45hp Jinma. It is one tractor I know uses the ABT version of the SL3105. And I'll speculate further that the difference in pinion throw is due the difference in flywheel placement (Jinma vs Foton).

I am pretty sure however, that your other supposition is accurate. Somebody stuck that 1408 in there because the bolt holes matched. When it still wouldn't start, he just said the **** with it and stuck it in the auction.

//greg//

Yep, that's what I thought also. I am sure with everybodys help we can get the right starter from Tommy and get her going.

Chris

 

[Affordable]

We have been putting the QD1408 starters on that engine for several years as a replacement , not sure whats going on with this one.I have several different starters so I think we can come up with something.I will check to see if we stock the QD1401 starter and if we do see if there is any difference in the

Tommy
Affordable Tractor Sales
"Your Jinma Parts Superstore"
Home of compact Jinma, Foton, and Koyker Tractors and Parts, Wood Chippers, Backhoes - Affordable Tractor Sales Company

 

[Diamondpilot]

We have been putting the QD1408 starters on that engine for several years as a replacement , not sure whats going on with this one.I have several different starters so I think we can come up with something.I will check to see if we stock the QD1401 starter and if we do see if there is any difference in the

Tommy
Affordable Tractor Sales
"Your Jinma Parts Superstore"
Home of compact Jinma, Foton, and Koyker Tractors and Parts, Wood Chippers, Backhoes - Affordable Tractor Sales Company

Thanks Tommy.

The starter it needs has to have a total pinion throw of about 2 3/16" from the mounting flange of the starter. The one we have only has a pinion throw of about 1 3/4". If you need to call me about it just PM me or check your records, you have my info from previous orders. I live in Daleville Indiana and my full name is Chris Anderson

Chris

 

[greg_g]

The starter it needs has to have a total pinion throw of about 2 3/16" from the mounting flange of the starter. The one we have only has a pinion throw of about 1 3/4".

Just out of curiosity, did you get that 1.75" measurement when actually using 12 volts to throw the pinion out? Or just when screwing it out by hand? In my experience, the pinion gear doesn't always reach all the way to the back side of the ring gear. If the ring gear is wider than the pinion gear for example, some may mate only to the actual width of the pinion gear. I've even seen some where pinion gear engagement depth is only 50%, but the tractors start normally nonetheless.

//greg//

 

[Diamondpilot]

Just out of curiosity, did you get that 1.75" measurement when actually using 12 volts to throw the pinion out? Or just when screwing it out by hand? In my experience, the pinion gear doesn't always reach all the way to the back side of the ring gear. If the ring gear is wider than the pinion gear for example, some may mate only to the actual width of the pinion gear. I've even seen some where pinion gear engagement depth is only 50%, but the tractors start normally nonetheless.

//greg//

I got it by measuring the distance from the starter mount flange to the bushing that stops the pinion gear on the shaft. I then confirmed it by prying and spinning the pinion out with a screw driver. I have talked to Tommy twice today and also to the guys at his shop and they confirmed my measurements. They also took every starter they had off the shelf and confirmed the measurements. Its a head scratcher???

Here is a pic I took with my cell phone showing what I got. With this setup the starters pinion will only engage 1/8" into the flywheels ring gear which is just not enough.

Chris

 

[Affordable]

We have a new crated SL3105BT engine at the shop, we removed the starter and measured the distance to the ring gear from the outside of the flywheel housing.I will let Chris know what it is tommorro, I had a meeting that lasted a little long today and did not get back with the shop to get the info but I will have it in the morning

Tommy
Affordable Tractor Sales
"Your Jinma Parts Superstore"
Home of compact Jinma, Foton, and Koyker Tractors and Parts, Wood Chippers, Backhoes - Affordable Tractor Sales Company