Forum User's Group.

   / Forum User's Group. #1  

smartguyz

Gold Member
Joined
Mar 16, 2003
Messages
488
Location
Beaverton, Oregon
Tractor
JD318, Power-Trac PT425 with scuffed-up green paint.
Forum User\'s Group.

It seems to me that there is enough clout (especially with all the people who are buying equipment through advice on this forum, or even using the forum in lieu of service and advice from PT) for us to form a user's group. Perhaps one of the things we can do is to track the number of owners who have purchased due to this forum. (I count myself in this category)

If PT understands that this heavily influences purchase decisions, this may help to improve things in service, and even influence future products and features.

What do you guys think?

-Rob /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
   / Forum User's Group. #2  
Re: Forum User\'s Group.

<font color="blue"> If PT understands that this heavily influences purchase decisions, this may help to improve things in service, and even influence future products and features. </font>

I think its been tried before without much success, if memory serves correctly. I believe it was Charlie who presented a list of questions/concerns/product requests from forum members to PT. My recollection is that not much came from his efforts. As always, I welcome correction if I erred in this response.
 
   / Forum User's Group. #3  
Re: Forum User\'s Group.

I've never been involved in an official user's group. What is involved?
 
   / Forum User's Group. #4  
Re: Forum User\'s Group.

An official user group sponsored by PT sounds like a win-win for everybody.

Positives for PT:
1) The service department just increased by how ever many users sign up. Repair instructions could be posted, diagnostic procedures, etc. limiting the phone calls currently received.
2) Once a certain problem has been identified and fixed (gunk in the metal fuel tanks) the solution is now available for all users. This eliminates Terry having to expalin the same situation over and over again. Again it makes PT people more productive.
3) Things that work well and things that don't can be identified and PT can be aware to make changes or not. It becomes a built in free research and development lab for PT.
4) A major obstacle in the purchase decision of a PT is reduced. There is an official support mechanism available for owners. More sales are made.

Positives for Owners:
1) Items 1,2,3,4 above.
2) A controlled environment for the forum. TBN is fantastic but could change or stop at any point and there isn't anything you can do about it. Take yahoo groups as an example. They have decided to stop allowing the archiving of attachments to posts. No more pictures with posts. It has severly limited several groups I am involved in to the point that they are disbanding.
3) The ability to have the factory's ear. If the same problem keeps surfacing it can be dealt with quickly.
4) Kept abreast of upcoming improvements and/or new implements so you can spend more money. Oh wait, this should go up to positive for PT /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

The important point to stress to PT is that this would not be a gripe board but something very positive for them. It would be a tremendous marketing, research, and service tool for them. All for free. Which is essentially what the TBN board is, just without the manufacturers input. Bet you all didn't realize you should be receiving a paycheck from PT. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Just my 2c from a potential PT buyer
Jack
 
   / Forum User's Group. #5  
Re: Forum User\'s Group.

I think PT is very concerned about legal liability and that many of their actions are based on advice as to how to avoid it. As evidence I cite their warranty form/disclaimer that they require all purchasers to sign as well as the experience of John Coxon (Sedgewood)--refusing to deal with him when his insurance company sought recovery after paying for his fire loss.

I suspect that this concern may be one of the reasons that Terry Espey will not originate email or respond to email queries--it avoids a written record.
 
   / Forum User's Group. #6  
Re: Forum User\'s Group.

Bob:
Certainly Power Trac is overly concerned about litigation. I don't know if it's the result of legal advice or a bad experience, but if there's a hint of design criticism, even offered to try to suggest an improvement, the doors slam shut.
John Coxon's experience is beyond explanation. It cost PT the profit on a new machine, because John is fixing the old one himself. PT actually went the other way - they insisted that communications be in writing, but apparently were afraid that even selling a new machine somehow prejudiced their position. (Incidentally, other than "machines shouldn't catch fire", I don't think there's any indication that a design or manufacturing defect caused the fire. Right, Sedgewood?)
On the other hand, I and others have consistently gotten prompt answers regarding our repairs, good service on parts delivery, etc.
I'm not sure that Terry's e-mail aversion is company policy; I think it's just that Terry doesn't sit at a desk much and e-mail isn't his thing. (He promised that he'd have a computer in his new office, but last I heard, you still had to call to get someone to read his e-mail and get it to him. It's part of his image. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif)
 
   / Forum User's Group. #7  
Re: Forum User\'s Group.

<font color="red"> On the other hand, I and others have consistently gotten prompt answers regarding our repairs, good service on parts delivery, etc.
</font>

Charlie,

I agree. In fact I said something similar in another Thread

I will add that I got an email from Terry in response to my email inquiry---the email said to CALL HIM!
 
   / Forum User's Group. #8  
Re: Forum User\'s Group.

i will go one step further and far less diplomatic ...don't waste your time
 
   / Forum User's Group. #9  
Re: Forum User\'s Group.

<font color="blue"> i will go one step further and far less diplomatic ...don't waste your time </font>

Hans... what's your point?. /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
   / Forum User's Group. #10  
Re: Forum User\'s Group.

i spent a day out of three in Tazwell two visits back, discussing maintenance forums, joint newsletters and user groups, regional ralleys etc. two weeks later my Tazwell contact was no longer with the company.
 
   / Forum User's Group.
  • Thread Starter
#11  
Re: Forum User\'s Group.

Hi guys -

I am encouraged by this discussion. From a business angle - there must be value to all parties involved, and there must be sufficient leverage on the part of the User's Group in order to make changes possible. For example, if there are enough User Group members (let's call them PTUGs - Power-Trac User Group) to consummate a purchase (e.g. let's say we have 5000 members, and 40% of the membership decides they would commit to purchasing a 50" bagging finish mower if priced at $1000 - this would be $1000*2000 = $2M opportunity for PT), then we can definitely help drive what PT does. This would be good for us, good for PT.

As far as logistics are concerned, my experience with User Groups is that they are usually run by the members themselves (possibly with dues to help offset cost of a website, etc.) with heavy input from the corporation (i.e. PT). User Groups do the following:

* Share user experiences and help (much like this forum)
* Decide on group purchases - coordinate group buys
* Hold in-person (or in our case, perhaps virtual) conferences to discuss future product directions, give feedback to PT, etc.
* act in many of the ways that have been suggested (warrantee issues, bulletins, etc.)
* We would recruit from PT's customer list, and sign up new people as they become users - this requires coordination with PT, for sure.

I know that for the corporations I have worked with, they take user's groups very seriously, especially if the group communicates enough so that it affects PT's business (usually very positively - they know when they build something or design something - they have a free source of primary market research). My understanding of formal user's groups is that they have charters and act like a club - they may be incorporated as non-profits, and actually have bank accounts, and such. It takes a bit of work.

My experiences have been pretty positive, however.

I think the concept of simply talking to a few people at PT isn't going to cut it. We need to have enough organic size (i.e. enough members cobbled together to make it substantive for PT) and clout for it to be worth PT's time. There may need to be sufficient effort on our part to make this worthwhile, to where it represents a significant percentage of PT's user base.

I believe a first step is to quantify and count how many perspective members we can get together, and see what this means to PT. From talking to Kristie, they sell a few dozens of machines a year. We can probably take a stab at the installed user base in this way. The question is - how can we contact them, and then coalese them together. The internet is a good start.

I think it is worth thinking about a bit more. Keep those ideas coming.

Sincerely,

Rob

/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
   / Forum User's Group. #12  
Re: Forum User\'s Group.

Charlie: <font color="red"> (Incidentally, other than "machines shouldn't catch fire", I don't think there's any indication that a design or manufacturing defect caused the fire. Right, Sedgewood?)
</font>

Right.

Sorry about the delay with this rather brief response - I've been focussed on my PT rebuild and just now got round to catching up with the forum.

Coming round the bend (I hope),
Sedgewood
 
   / Forum User's Group. #13  
Re: Forum User\'s Group.

So if Power Tack cut off all contact with you, where are you getting your parts? Just curious as we may be in that same boat some day /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif
 
   / Forum User's Group. #14  
Re: Forum User\'s Group.

MossRoad: <font color="green"> So if Power Tack cut off all contact with you, where are you getting your parts? </font>

"Power Tack" - I like it /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif Locally ( Here's what I've spent so far ) . So far knock on wood I've not needed PT as a source. I won't know for sure until I fire this puppy up, but it looks like all of PT's home brewed parts survived. And even those are just fabricated using stock parts and with a bit of research could be duplicated locally.

<font color="green"> Just curious as we may be in that same boat some day</font>

Let's hope not but it sure is a fine way to get to know the machine. And a bit of hydraulics 101 and electrics 101 too. A cheap education. Ha! /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

I must say I'm more impressed with the basic design simplicity each day. There are some rough edges, as we've all discovered (and it looks like PT is dealing with many of them as their new models evolve), but the basics are there. And the lack of proprietary parts has been a real plus in my case!


Sedgewood
 
   / Forum User's Group. #15  
Re: Forum User\'s Group.

<font color="blue"> "Power Tack" </font>

That was a typo... or was it??? /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Lots of work, John. Thanks for sharing the details.
 

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