Ford 1700 injector pump timing

[53GMC]

Hi everyone!

I just purchased a 1 owner ford 1700 tractor with a front end loader. It had been sitting for about 2 years in a open barn.

The guy I bought it form said it had a burnt valve so he had the entire head reworked, while he was working on it he wanted to have the injector pump checked out because he was going to keep it long term.

After reassembley he could not get the bolts to tighten up on the injector pump, the result was the timing would not stay set. I believe I can get them to tighten up but I do not know where to set the timing.

Is there any way to tell when it is in time or where it is supposed to be set? It is close enough right now to start but it lacks power and won't idle.


One more thing I am having problems with is the loader is really slow going up and acts like it doesn't have any power. It will not lift the wheels off the ground, it also won't work unless the 3 point is all the way up

The tractor only has 1200 hours on it and has been kept inside most of it's life.

Thanks in advance!

 

[jones6780]

Hi, Do you have a manual? Here are links to my engine rebuild and includes photos. The pump has 2 separate adjustment locations. One is visible from the outside, it is the 3 mounting bolts. The original bolts had a screwdriver slots and nuts to tighten. On the inside, behind the timing cover, there are 3 bolts to adjust the gear on a shaft. Normally before dis-assembly you would put witness marks and reinstall to the marks.

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/new-holland-owning-operating/135179-first-post.html

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/new-holland-owning-operating/137188-1700-engine-rebuild.html

Russell

 

[jones6780]

For the slow FEL look at the Hydraulic screen.

Ford 1700 Hydraulic Filter Clogging-photo - TractorByNet.com

 

[JC-jetro]

53gmc,

IT manual for the 1700 does have a section on pump timing. I can post it later if you need but Russel's info should suffice. I never re-timed my pump but knew enough to right away put a witness Mark on the pump and timing gear cover to both make sure to easily time it and verify it did not move. On crankshaft pulley you do have a notch (same as ignition timing on gas engine) with the exception that is only for fuel pump timing. I can share the procedure later when i get home as I'm sitting here in DCA waiting to board.

JC,

 

[53GMC]

Thanks for the replies!

The previous owner did not put a mark on the pump before removal:confused2: But that is why I got a good deal on it

I am going to order a manual today, witch one would you recommend buying?

The three bolts that hold the injector pump on are the ones the previous owner could not tighten. They do not have a slot for a screw driver, but I was thinking about cutting a slot in them to hold them with a screw driver. Or welding something on the end of the bolts if nothing else. But I still don't know where it should be set.

I have been trying to identify the loader, tractordata.com shows a Ford 770 loader for it. Mine is a Ag-TECK at-720 loader, New Holland. It seams to fit good, and the owner said it came from the dealer like it is. Could this be a factory loader for this tractor with it being a 720 model?

Thanks for the help!

 

[53GMC]

Just a update.

I have adjusted the timing so it will start on it's own and idle at about 700 rpm. But it still lack a lot of power. I have not hooked an attachement up to it yet, but it struggles to pull itself in high range. Is there any way to know when it is in time other than trail and error?

Thanks!
Philip.

 

[Hooked_on_HP]

To set the timing properly you have to follow the steps in the manual. You could damage the engine if you try running it with the timing verry far off. I like the Ford manuals. You can pick them up for under $100 on ebay. It will more than pay for its self.
Bill

 

[53GMC]

To set the timing properly you have to follow the steps in the manual. You could damage the engine if you try running it with the timing verry far off. I like the Ford manuals. You can pick them up for under $100 on ebay. It will more than pay for its self.
Bill

I ordered a cheap manual today. If I do much more work on this tractor I will probably be buying a good manual. I just don't won't to get much money tied up in this tractor right now.

 

[53GMC]

I purchased a new fuel filter and fuel line today. I put them on and made sure to get all the air out of the filter and the hose before putting it together. While I was bleeding the system it took a long time to get any fluid out of one of the injector lines, finely I got some fluid and bubbles. I do not know where it is coming from, but air keeps coming out of the injector line, even after running it a few minutes I have a good flow of fuel if I take the fuel line off going into the injector pump. I have ran it and it is starting a lot easier but still lacks power.

Thanks,
Philip

 

[Hooked_on_HP]

On my 1900 if I run it out of fuel it is a PITA to get all the air out of the system. Even after bleeding the injectors and getting it running it will take some time for the air to clear out and run smooth.
Bill

 

[53GMC]

On my 1900 if I run it out of fuel it is a PITA to get all the air out of the system. Even after bleeding the injectors and getting it running it will take some time for the air to clear out and run smooth.
Bill

It will start up and run right now but it is lagging power and air is still coming out of the lines. I am thinking that maybe a small amount of air is entering the lines and creating a shock absorber when the fuel in being injected into the cylinder? Will yours run before ALL the air is out of the system?

Thanks,
Philip.

 

[mostly_gas]

My 1700 will run poorly if there was some air not bled out. It only take my tractor about 5 minutes or so one it starts to finish purging air if there is some left. Sound like you have an air leak, at filter as a guess.

 

[53GMC]

I am still trying to set the timing on the pump. It has some adjustment where it mounts to the engine. It doesn't seam to make much difference if the pump is moved all the way one way or the opposite way. It will start and idle fine but is lacking power, it will not even go up a slight grade in high range 1st gear. My 8n has a lot more power in 4th gear going up the same spot than this tractor does.

 

[53GMC]

I took the injectors and lines off today to try to check the timing. It seemed like it was pumping fuel when the piston is about halfway up on the compression stroke, which would be advanced way too much! Is there any way to check the timing without taking the head off? Are there any marks on the flywheel, engine pulleys, etc.?

I also noticed that air is in fact coming out of the injector pump. While turning the engine over by hand there were a few vary small bubbles that would come with the fuel. Has anyone ever seen this happen before? And if so what effects does it have on the running ability of the engine?

Thanks for the help.

 

[JC-jetro]

I took the injectors and lines off today to try to check the timing. It seemed like it was pumping fuel when the piston is about halfway up on the compression stroke, which would be advanced way too much! Is there any way to check the timing without taking the head off? Are there any marks on the flywheel, engine pulleys, etc.?

I also noticed that air is in fact coming out of the injector pump. While turning the engine over by hand there were a few vary small bubbles that would come with the fuel. Has anyone ever seen this happen before? And if so what effects does it have on the running ability of the engine?

Thanks for the help.

Here is what you are asking. Look at the pic below and the attached PDF file that has step by step direction.'
JC,

 

[53GMC]

Here is what you are asking. Look at the pic below and the attached PDF file that has step by step direction.'
JC,

Thanks! That helped a lot. I will check it tonight and let you know what I find out. My manual is still in the mail

 

[53GMC]

After locating marks on crankshaft pulley I found out they appear to be off. Neither cylinder is close to TDC when it is on ether one of the marks. The manual says to remove the valve springs to let the valve set on top of the piston if you are in doubt of the pulley accuracy. Can you remove the valve spring and reinstall it without removing the head?

Thanks.

 

[JC-jetro]

After locating marks on crankshaft pulley I found out they appear to be off. Neither cylinder is close to TDC when it is on ether one of the marks. The manual says to remove the valve springs to let the valve set on top of the piston if you are in doubt of the pulley accuracy. Can you remove the valve spring and reinstall it without removing the head?

Thanks.

I have never done the procedure myself as there never was a need for me. I was cognizant of the timing issue and that's why I put the witness mark barring any other changes. I would for sure take the battery off the tractor so there will be no chance of piston coming up and meeting the valve. Squeezing the spring to take the valve keeper is easy enough. The problem is how to put it back in as you have to be able to have a very tiny needle nose to hold the valve steam up before putting the keeper in. I suppose you can use a very fin fishing line and wrap it on the stem pull it up by someone's help and then put the keeper in. The plastic will melt off and go away without leaving any mark. I'm just thinking it out loud so a healthy pinch of salt is in order. You need to verify if crankshaft pulley is keyed to the crankshaft end and it can be 180 deg out. I can take measurement of the pointer in reference to something if that helps. Taking the head off is a big can of worm that should not be opened unnecessarily.

JC,

 

[Cecil Stults]

It is sometimes possible to see where the pump was sitting by looking at the paint closely. or look for wear marks or some evidence of a footprint of where it was.

Yes best bet is to set it according to a manual .

 

[53GMC]

It looks like I am going to be taking it apart to set the timing. It is off much more than you can set externally When I remove the hyd pump do I need to drain the fluid first?

Thanks!