Florescent Lighting Bans?

[ultrarunner]

The sale of Florescent lamps is banned in California for all intent.

I have a hospital full of 4’ T8 overhead lamps which can no longer be sold in California and a few other states.

Instead of paying $2 for GE Florescent Bulbs I’m now paying a little over $6 for replacement GE LED bulbs.

The LEDs marketed as direct replacement but I quickly learned they kill my older ballasts overnight.

Call to GE direct as we have a National GE lighting contract and learned GE has a list of several pages of compatible and non compatible ballasts which is constantly being updated…

The kicker is there appears to be a nationwide ballast shortage now…

The old standard T8 have been industry standard for 30 years… even got a lighting award in 1995 when I installed them new here…

So instead of a $2 lightbulb I am looking a $6 LED bulbs plus ballast replacement for each LED installed.

 

[ultrarunner]

After January 1, 2025, California will have effectively banned the final sale and distribution of all fluorescent lamps per CA AB 2208. Aside from specialty lamps primarily used for medical or industrial purposes, the ban applies to screw, bayonet, and pin base compact fluorescent lamps (CFLs) and linear fluorescent lamps (LFLs), commonly used in both commercial and residential buildings. So, what does this mean for business owners and property managers? Those currently using these lamps must start planning to transition to alternative lighting solutions. Although this may require some planning and investment, upgrading to LED lighting is safer and more efficient, contributing to huge operational savings.

Why Is CA Banning Fluorescents?

One of the biggest concerns with fluorescent lighting is safety; these lamps contain mercury, a toxic heavy metal that poses significant environmental and health risks. When disposed of in landfills, the mercury contaminates ecosystems through leaching into the soil and water. In addition to these environmental and public health threats, fluorescents are also incredibly inefficient compared to LEDs. They produce more heat bringing operational costs up across all systems and have a shorter life cycle.

Upgrading to LED lighting will save business owners money while protecting Californians’ health and safety.

Major Dates

On and after January 1, 2024, compact fluorescent lamps, including screw and bayonet base CFL’s are not to be offered for final sale, sold at final sale, or distributed in this state as a new manufactured product.

On and after January 1, 2025, linear fluorescent lamps shall not be offered for final sale, sold at final sale, or distributed in this state as a new manufactured product.

Read the Bill

 

[CalG]

I've got that BS here as well.

I went over the river and bought tubes there.

 

[bmaverick]

Switch to direct wire LED T8 and ditch the ballast. Run both bulbs in parallel.

You will have to change the ends in the fixture to math the bulb, but it's easy.

I run 4000k or less. There are 3700k and 3000k bulbs. I hate the higher ones over 3700k. I call them fake lights.

 

[CalG]

Switch to direct wire LED T8 and ditch the ballast. Run both bulbs in parallel.

You will have to change the ends in the fixture to math the bulb, but it's easy.

I run 4000k or less. There are 3700k and 3000k bulbs. I hate the higher ones over 3700k. I call them fake lights.

If you needed to convert 2000 fixtures, "EASY" would have new meaning.

 

[ultrarunner]

I've got that BS here as well.

I went over to the river and bought tubes there.

I could physically buy in another state on my own dime a couple hundred T8 bulbs providing inventory to last until I retire.

It’s the older Made in USA first generation electronic ballasts with the compatibility issue…

 

[ultrarunner]

I run SPX 3500 almost exclusively except lobby/waiting areas where the SPX 3000 provide a calming spectrum.

The lighting supplier said the direct wire are not made or included in our GE contract…

Changing out as needed would be the job that never ends… well… not never but could go for years…

I have some T8 at the loading dock and stairwells over 12 years and still good being on 24/7

The LED cost a little over $6 isn’t a bad price but if not compatible even being free would be too much…

I’m going to check my ballast stock tomorrow… was not aware of nationwide shortage.

 

[mikester]

I think the issue is cheap chinesium ballasts.

Personally I like the LED's better than T8's or any fluorescent bulbs. LED's tend to be quiet, no flicker, instant on, lower power consumption.

I switched all my high bay T8's to LED and haven't had any issues for years now. All the cheap T8 fixtures I have had issues eating T8 bulbs and ballast failures. You get what you pay for.

 

[BigGG]

Switch to direct wire LED T8 and ditch the ballast. Run both bulbs in parallel.

You will have to change the ends in the fixture to math the bulb, but it's easy.

I run 4000k or less. There are 3700k and 3000k bulbs. I hate the higher ones over 3700k. I call them fake lights.

That's what I did on my home fixtures. I didn't have to change sockets for the tubes I bought. It would be a big job for a whole hospital, but would greatly reduce long-term replacements. If they have 277v lighting, that could be a different story.

 

[thclimer]

So the CFL bulbs were a scam. They never lasted 1/10 of the projected lifetime and didn't work in the cold. Consumer spent more money on CFL bulbs than the cost of the electricity used if they would have just left their incandescent bulbs on 24/7/365. And now they are all toxic to the environment, how many were ever disposed of properly?

I have now experienced many LED replacements for incandescent bulbs fail prematurely.

Don't get me wrong I'm all for saving energy and getting a higher quality light source, but I hope some longevity has been built into the design of these new LED strip lights.

 

[ultrarunner]

I think the issue is cheap chinesium ballasts.

Personally I like the LED's better than T8's or any fluorescent bulbs. LED's tend to be quiet, no flicker, instant on, lower power consumption.

I switched all my high bay T8's to LED and haven't had any issues for years now. All the cheap T8 fixtures I have had issues eating T8 bulbs and ballast failures. You get what you pay for.

The ballast failing overnight with the new LED bulbs are made in USA

The made in China are newer and I have a few and those have been the only ones that have not died.

 

[ultrarunner]

Here is yesterday’s failed ballast 12 hours after LED installed…

 

[dodge man]

I never liked the cfl’s. I do like the LED’s though, bright and don’t use a lot of electricity. In my shop I also have a bunch of the 4 foot fluorescent lights that I’ve got a bunch of, maybe 16 total. I’ve gradually replaced them with LED 4 footers as they’ve burned out. The LED ones are a little pricey but to replace dozens and dozens would run into a lot of money. Another example of people over thinking our environment.

 

[MossRoad]

.... Another example of people over thinking our environment.

Think of it as cost savings. LEDs are a LOT less expensive to run.

So to be fair, someone has to run the numbers and do an ROI to see how long it will take to recoup your costs VS the electricity you save.

My employer has a program where they pick a building or several buildings every year that have the same type of fluorescent lighting fixtures, run the numbers, then do a capital project to replace some or all of them. Doing them as they fail is an awful way to go in a commercial setting. More expensive in the long run, too, regarding labor and materials.

 

[MossRoad]

The sale of Florescent lamps is banned in California for all intent.

I have a hospital full of 4’ T8 overhead lamps which can no longer be sold in California and a few other states.

Instead of paying $2 for GE Florescent Bulbs I’m now paying a little over $6 for replacement GE LED bulbs.

The LEDs marketed as direct replacement but I quickly learned they kill my older ballasts overnight.

Call to GE direct as we have a National GE lighting contract and learned GE has a list of several pages of compatible and non compatible ballasts which is constantly being updated…

The kicker is there appears to be a nationwide ballast shortage now…

The old standard T8 have been industry standard for 30 years… even got a lighting award in 1995 when I installed them new here…

So instead of a $2 lightbulb I am looking a $6 LED bulbs plus ballast replacement for each LED installed.

I have several buildings that have multiple types and wattages of fluorescent bulbs. 4', 2' T8 and T5, T8 U-tubes, 2 and 4-pin bulbs in 9, 13, 18, 26W, circline bulbs in T8 and T5... you name it. Plus a bunch of narrow bent tubes in various lengths and wattages. Some of the ballasts for the 2 and 4 pin in the can lights are no longer made. When those fail, we have the entire fixture changed to an LED fixture. This year, they finally asked for a count of all the can lights to do a capital project to replace all of them at once. We also have some dual power ballasts for emergency lighting that are no longer made.

Good luck. I'd suggest developing a capital project to replace them all at once, be it with new ballasts and bulbs or entire fixtures and be done with it. Or.... retire and let someone else deal with it.

 

[caver]

We had T-12 mostly and metal halide on the boiler side of the plant. We still had to deal with PCB ballast disposal in the old stuff. 10-15 years ago they contracted to have most of the plant side unit fixtures replaced. Some of our LED flying saucer looking high bay lights could not handle the boiler heat.

 

[cj7]

I would suggest looking for your local energy esco. These energy conservation companies are able to develope projects that save energy all across the a building such as a hospital. They know how to source rebate programs, tax incentives, special finance rates and more to assist companies upgrade equipment not only the lighting but other building mechanicals.

 

[MossRoad]

We had T-12 mostly and metal halide on the boiler side of the plant. We still had to deal with PCB ballast disposal in the old stuff. 10-15 years ago they contracted to have most of the plant side unit fixtures replaced. Some of our LED flying saucer looking high bay lights could not handle the boiler heat.

At my last job, back in the late 80's they gave me a standing order that if I had free time, there's the ladder, there's the skid of ballasts, here's a map and a marker, go change out the old ballasts with the PCBs in them. Man, it was a rickety old 16' aluminum step ladder, the fixtures were filthy, and it was HOT up there at the ceiling..... the good old days!

 

[caver]

That's what it was for us. If you worked the back shift and no emergencies, work on lighting.

 

[Panik]

The sale of Florescent lamps is banned in California for all intent.

I have a hospital full of 4’ T8 overhead lamps which can no longer be sold in California and a few other states.

Instead of paying $2 for GE Florescent Bulbs I’m now paying a little over $6 for replacement GE LED bulbs.

The LEDs marketed as direct replacement but I quickly learned they kill my older ballasts overnight.

Call to GE direct as we have a National GE lighting contract and learned GE has a list of several pages of compatible and non compatible ballasts which is constantly being updated…

The kicker is there appears to be a nationwide ballast shortage now…

The old standard T8 have been industry standard for 30 years… even got a lighting award in 1995 when I installed them new here…

So instead of a $2 lightbulb I am looking a $6 LED bulbs plus ballast replacement for each LED installed.

Been going through this, thankfully on a much smaller scale at work. I manage an animal collection for a municipal environmental education center that is primarily comprised of native reptiles. With our natural climate and the HVAC controls for the building heating and lighting the enclosures has been largely covered by the use of 100w incandescent/halogen A-19 bulbs, with a couple exceptions for LED aquarium lights and BR style "cafeteria" heat lamps.

When the national phaseout happened I waited until Home Depot put their remaining stock of A-19 halogens on sale and negotiated a deal with the store manager to buy all of their remaining stock in one go at an even deeper discount. I suspect I still have enough stock to last the remainder of the year... after which point I'll probably be forced to switch to LED's in 3700K spectrum and 50w or 75w ceramic heat emitters for basking.

Point being I share a very infinitesimal amount of your frustration. I can't imagine switching over an entire hospital AND dealing with ballast issues. I tried ballast compatible LED's in my house a couple of times and finally switched over to removing all of the ballasts in my T8 fixtures. Seems simple, but when you're talking about an entire hospital (switching to ballast less, or replacing ballasts) that's sounds like an intractable issue unless you've got a surplus of both time and money.