Fireplace Mortar ?

[rswyan]

My home has two built-in fireplaces - one in the living room and one in the basement. The living room fireplace had an woodburning insert in it. But due to to the problems getting wood into that room easily I decided that I wanted to move the insert into the basement fireplace. (Heat rises right ? /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Will probably use the upstairs fireplace occassionally - more just for the looks and enjoyment of it rather than actual heating.

The basement is a walkout with a sliding glass door in the room the insert will be in- so I can easily bring mass quantiies of wood right to the door with our tractor - can even stack it there on a (covered) concrete patio.

I pulled the insert today and moved it downstairs and swept both chimneys. Inspecting the downstairs fireplace I notice that some of the mortar is missing inbetween a couple of bricks, fairly low down on the back wall of the fireplace. I'd like to fix this before putting the insert in.

Is any special type of mortar required - or will just plain old mortar do ?

 

[bczoom]

Sorry, not a mason, but I have a thought for you (I have a similar setup as yourself).

For bringing wood into the house, I use the rubbermaid tubs. Forgot the exact dimensions, but they're about 20" long by 12" wide and 16" deep. Probably a pretty standard size at most stores.

Load them with wood outside the door and bring in 1 to load the stove. With the lid back on, even if you leave some wood in the tub for awhile in the house, bugs can't get out.

If you do consider this, use the tubs that are softer plastic (e.g. you can push pretty hard on the sides and they bend). The harder ones get too brittle for your cold weather.

 

[Bird]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Is any special type of mortar required )</font>

Yes, or at least there used to be 30 years ago. We bought a new house with a fireplace in '72 and a year or so later, I burned a lot of mesquite in it. Mesquite makes a very hot fire and I probably had some fires too big, too, and it literally cooked the mortar out from between the bricks. So I learned that there was a special heat resistant mortar and I repaired the damage myself and had no more problems. Of course, a few things have changed in the last 30 years /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif, so it might be different now.

 

[texbaylea]

You will be looking for refractory mortar. It is a special mix to take the heat. You will probably have to call around to find it. The idiots at Lowes or Home Depot won't know what you are looking for.

 

[rswyan]

Brian,

Thanks - that's an excellent idea on the tubs. Plus they are a multi-purpose device /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

One of the biggest difficulties I've had using the upstairs fireplace is getting wood in to fuel it - there isn't any easy path to the exsisting wood pile - which is about 60' from the house.

 

[rswyan]

Bird & texbaylea:

That's the data I needed - thanks guys !

I'll call the local fireplace/stove shop which is about 10 mins away - if they don't have it they may know where to get it around here.

 

[bczoom]

Randall,

You're welcome.
Works great for me. I load from a trailer parked behind the house. I fill 6 or 7 at a time and stack 2 high. Just reach out the door and grab one when you need it.
A hand truck works well if you want/need to move a few at a time (e.g. coming in from 60' away).

Brian

 

[Egon]

As mentioned - refactory mortar - but be sitting down when you get the price for the premixed version which is probably what you should be using.

Should also check flue size required for the fireplace. If the existing chimney is too large the flue gas velocity is reduced and proper draft is hard to maintain.

Egon

 

[turnkey4099]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Randall,

You're welcome.
Works great for me. I load from a trailer parked behind the house. I fill 6 or 7 at a time and stack 2 high. Just reach out the door and grab one when you need it.
A hand truck works well if you want/need to move a few at a time (e.g. coming in from 60' away).

Brian )</font>

I'm going to try that. Not for the ease of carrying but for the reduction in dirt around the stove. My supply is 3 cord packed into a 3 season porch. don't have much problem with bugs (not in termite territory), only an occasional spider or stink bug. The constant chips, dirt etc laying around the stove does cause a problem and your idea should control that.

Harry K

 

[bczoom]

Harry,

Forgot to mention that benefit, but you are correct. Chips, bark, dirt... all remain in the tub.

Brian

 

[Gomez]

As others have mentioned, try to get refractory cement to make the repair.

I found this link for some stuff in a tube. Should make repair easy if you can find something like this. Check your local fireplace shop. Fireplace Mortar

If you can't find the refractory mortar, since you are placing a stove in the fireplace, you may not need to use refractory cement. Just plain mortar mix may work fine.

 

[Chuck52]

Ace hardware stores carry premixed furnace and fireplace cement in pint containers for just a few bucks. That may be all you need if you have just a few spaces to fill. I even found that stuff in a store in Jacksonville, Florida back when I was driving my son's Jeep back home while he vacationed in the Persian Gulf. It's good for temporary fixes of cracks in exhaust manifolds, which is what I've used it for.

Chuck

 

[rswyan]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( but be sitting down when you get the price for the premixed version which is probably what you should be using. )</font>

/forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif Great ..... I'll actually have to look up in the shed - my wife picked up some sealant for stove pipe that I used for the furnance chimney up in the shed - it came in a small tub, was slightly moist, and about the consistancy of a stiff clay. Maybe that's the stuff.

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Should also check flue size required for the fireplace. If the existing chimney is too large the flue gas velocity is reduced and proper draft is hard to maintain. )</font>

Probably not alot I'm going to be able to do about the flue size at this point. The flue for the chimney in the basement is the same as the one upstairs (the one that the insert was in previously) - about 10.5" x 10.5" I.D. - the opening out of the insert is much smaller than that - 5.5" x 7.5".

 

[rswyan]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( A hand truck works well if you want/need to move a few at a time (e.g. coming in from 60' away). )</font>

Yeah ........ the difficulty is that the wood pile is across the lawn - there isn't really any path to it .... I'd have to shovel a path over to it once the snow flies (highly unlikely) - that's why I'm probably going to move the entire pile onto the patio under the deck. It will be right outside the entrance to the basement room where the fireplace insert will be and it will be easy to just take a container outside a couple of feet, load it, and walk back in - although I may well load a couple there and bring in with the hand truck.

 

[rswyan]

Egon,

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( If the existing chimney is too large the flue gas velocity is reduced and proper draft is hard to maintain. )</font>

Could you elaborate a bit on this ? I would say the flue is obviously too large for the fireplace insert .... but I don't ever recall having a problem with getting enough draft when it was in the upper fireplace - and I would think it would be even less of a problem in the lower one (another 10' of height.) The chimney itself is in the middle of the house so it stays warm - and contains three flues - the two for the fireplaces and one for central forced air gas furnace (no longer used) & gas hot water heater.

 

[rswyan]

Gomez & Chuck,

Thanks guys - yeah I think I'm good to go - pretty sure the stuff the wife picked up that I used on the stove pipe in the shed will work. As far as I can tell I only have a few small cracks to fill, down around the bottom of the fireplace. But I think I am going to have a chimney sweep that does repairs come out and do an inspection of the of all three flues - just to be safe.

 

[Egon]

Most airtight stoves and inserts will specify the diameter of chimney for their unit. This is the size at which it will burn most efficiently.

Up here we have to use a metal insert inside the flue for wood burning stoves. Our chimney is tile flue with brick around it. The wood stove needs the steel liner also to comply with codes.

Egon