extend PTO shaft

[jimmysisson]

Anyone welded on an extension to the 1" square male portion of a PTO shaft? I have a new-to-me implement and I need to add about 4" to the overlap. I think I have an old piece somewhere. The rest of the shaft and yokes and crosses are good. As long as it's straight when complete, should be fine, right?
Thanks, Jim

 

[MikeInEburg]

If you have internal support and make very pretty welds, you should be fine. I prefer a sure thing, so I'd simply replace the shaft with appropriate length. If you plan to use that same shaft with other implements, be sure that your mod doesn't make it too long for those other devices.

 

[BHD]

for 4 inches I do not see a problem is the welding is good, (most likely if 4 inches is all you need) you will not even be using the section that is welded. it is more for keeping the shaft together,

 

[zzvyb6]

TSC has PTO extenders that fit onto the tractor's PTO stub. Looks like they come up to about 10" even. If the implement has a PTO type spline on the gearbox, you can place it there.

I'd recommend an extender over a welded section to preserve the shaft's usefulness and prevent all likelyhood of it binding up.

 

[RoyJackson]

Agri-Supply also has what they call a PTO adapter, but it's actually an extender. Cost is about 20 bucks.
Pto Adapter 1-3/8 X6 Spline Male X 1-3/8X6 Spline Female Pto Adapter

The ones I've seen in TSC didn't have the spring pin lock. They did have a .25" hole drilled through. Those types are for old Ford tractors.

 

[Agent Blue]

This is the reason god made MIG welders. Taper the sides. If you have a lathe drill a hole for a pin to line it up perfectly. I have done this before and never gave it a thought. Unless your talking in excess of 100 hp its as good as new.

 

[Baby Grand]

Unless you are a highly skilled, certified welder, with a good working knowledge of the steel you'll be joining and it's heat treatment, i would go with the store bought extenders, as suggested by Roy. No sense risking complete shaft damage to save $20.

 

[Agent Blue]

Yes... Were building space ships here. Break out the titanium. Sounds like the college professors approach to buying a candy bar. One inch of steel encased in another half inch of steel. Whats the calamity if should fail in twenty years ? It is great there are consumers that wear a million dollars of life insurance and check their computers for rain before stepping outside ... but for the most of us " dare devils " live for expanding our knowledge and learning abilities. Why would I buy a six thousand dump trailer when I can build one for much less, and use my choice of updates ? There will always be buyers and builders. I built five homes by myself...... my mistake. I should have hired a professional and shouldering a huge debt .
Something as simple as a small square shaft, take a chance in life. Do something with satisfaction. Stir the creativity that rests in the back of your brain and most of all have fun. The best therapy in the world awaits the person standing over a pile of scrap metal.

 

[jimmysisson]

Thanks for all comments. I will mig the extension tubing and keep an eye on it.

 

[Baby Grand]

Yes... Were building space ships here. Break out the titanium. Sounds like the college professors approach to buying a candy bar. One inch of steel encased in another half inch of steel. Whats the calamity if should fail in twenty years ? It is great there are consumers that wear a million dollars of life insurance and check their computers for rain before stepping outside ... but for the most of us " dare devils " live for expanding our knowledge and learning abilities. Why would I buy a six thousand dump trailer when I can build one for much less, and use my choice of updates ? There will always be buyers and builders. I built five homes by myself...... my mistake. I should have hired a professional and shouldering a huge debt .
Something as simple as a small square shaft, take a chance in life. Do something with satisfaction. Stir the creativity that rests in the back of your brain and most of all have fun. The best therapy in the world awaits the person standing over a pile of scrap metal.

Nice. Glad you feel comfortable telling the OP to just do it when you know nothing about the circumstances. But then, you've got no skin in the game.

 

[Agent Blue]

Let me be the first to say I am proud of you Jimmy. Step out there where no man has travelled and make your mark. Be adventurous and stack some iron together. It is therapy plus !!!

 

[Agent Blue]

Nice. Glad you feel comfortable telling the OP to just do it when you know nothing about the circumstances. But then, you've got no skin in the game.

I see you never walked til age 7. Check the alarm clock twice before proceeding with the day. Close your eyes and let the grown ups worry about the crisis. Yes... grind, fit, and weld...... certainly tasks not to be tried by someone not experienced in life. You work in a parts department by chance ? Have a great day and I promise not to dispense information above my head.

 

[Baby Grand]

I see you never walked til age 7. Check the alarm clock twice before proceeding with the day. Close your eyes and let the grown ups worry about the crisis. Yes... grind, fit, and weld...... certainly tasks not to be tried by someone not experienced in life. You work in a parts department by chance ? Have a great day and I promise not to dispense information above my head.

Actually, I have worked in rotating power transmission design for 25 years. Worked as a welder in industry for 5 years before that to make money for engineering school. Have seen people hurt/maimed by boneheaded, poorly thought out decisions. How about you?

 

[jimmysisson]

Easy, fellas. I did post the question since I was thinking about the whole thing coming apart and spinning around behind my back. The existing inner shaft penetrates the outer portion by about 2-3/4", not enough.
I think I can weld it straight and strong. If the weld fails the piece will still be contained by the outer portion. I'm not certified, but I believe I can make it stick.
Just to make this more complicated, suppose I use a piece of 1" square bar stock for the add-on, since I have some handy. I was thinking of grinding an air-relief notch at the weld end(in the solid) so I wouldn't build up pressure inside the hollow, then filling that in after the piece had cooled some.
Thanks again, Jim

 

[RoyJackson]

Easy, fellas. I did post the question since I was thinking about the whole thing coming apart and spinning around behind my back. The existing inner shaft penetrates the outer portion by about 2-3/4", not enough.
I think I can weld it straight and strong. If the weld fails the piece will still be contained by the outer portion. I'm not certified, but I believe I can make it stick.
Just to make this more complicated, suppose I use a piece of 1" square bar stock for the add-on, since I have some handy. I was thinking of grinding an air-relief notch at the weld end(in the solid) so I wouldn't build up pressure inside the hollow, then filling that in after the piece had cooled some.
Thanks again, Jim

Like any welding, it really does depend on one's assessment and confidence in their welding skills. A poor weld (lack of fusion or penetration) could result in a catastrophic failure of a rotating component....and even 540 RPM is fast enough.

 

[Baby Grand]

Easy, fellas. I did post the question since I was thinking about the whole thing coming apart and spinning around behind my back. The existing inner shaft penetrates the outer portion by about 2-3/4", not enough.
I think I can weld it straight and strong. If the weld fails the piece will still be contained by the outer portion. I'm not certified, but I believe I can make it stick.
Just to make this more complicated, suppose I use a piece of 1" square bar stock for the add-on, since I have some handy. I was thinking of grinding an air-relief notch at the weld end(in the solid) so I wouldn't build up pressure inside the hollow, then filling that in after the piece had cooled some.
Thanks again, Jim

So it sounds like the weld won't be transmitting the full torque as it will never be outside of the outer shaft. As long the weld will stay a couple of inches inside the outer shaft that sounds reasonable to me. Using the solid bar will create a shaft with two torsional stiffnesses, which would cause a stress riser right at the weld, but since the solid side of the weld won't be transmittinging much of the torque it should be okay. Thinking about venting the weld, and containment should it fail, gives me confidence that you know what you're doing. Good luck, and let us know how it goes.

 

[Bob77064]

Agri-Supply also has what they call a PTO adapter, but it's actually an extender. Cost is about 20 bucks.
Pto Adapter 1-3/8 X6 Spline Male X 1-3/8X6 Spline Female Pto Adapter

The ones I've seen in TSC didn't have the spring pin lock. They did have a .25" hole drilled through. Those types are for old Ford tractors.

Roy, I have thought about getting one of those to make it easier to hook up PTO implements. Do you think that would be a good idea or would it put too much leverage on the PTO shaft?

 

[RoyJackson]

Roy, I have thought about getting one of those to make it easier to hook up PTO implements. Do you think that would be a good idea or would it put too much leverage on the PTO shaft?

Two things to consider:
1) Will adding the extender result in excessive U-joint angles?
2) Will the extender be left on permanently?

I use my extender on one implement, a chipper/shredder. This implement gets used for a few hours 3-4 times a year. I've used it on two tractors so far with no adverse results...although I have read (but no personal experience) that an extender can put more load on the tractor's PTO stubshaft.
So, my opinion...I wouldn't want to use it continuously...only if you need it for a particular implement or implements.

 

[Bob77064]

Two things to consider:
1) Will adding the extender result in excessive U-joint angles?
2) Will the extender be left on permanently?

I use my extender on one implement, a chipper/shredder. This implement gets used for a few hours 3-4 times a year. I've used it on two tractors so far with no adverse results...although I have read (but no personal experience) that an extender can put more load on the tractor's PTO stubshaft.
So, my opinion...I wouldn't want to use it continuously...only if you need it for a particular implement or implements.

Thank you for your help sir.

 

[sixdogs]

While we are talking about pto extenders commonly sold, I have had mixed results with them. There are different kinds and the thinner ones tend to crack if used on heavy impact items like a rototiller or bush hog. Every one I used on those applications failed fairly quickly. I did not buy the newer ones that are really heavily built out on the slip-on connectors, don't expect a lot out of them.