Easement question

[Richard]

Setup: Farm is surrounded on 3 sides by water. The farm USED to be double in size before TVA confiscated many acres (decades ago) for the lakes. Point of that is... the "farm" would go to the waters edge but for the fact that TVA owns all the beachfront and in our area, interestingly enough, all the land up the hill that would become prime building for lakeview homes (as has been done across the lake from me)

Now... on the far point of this land peninsula, TVA has some high power electrical lines that cross the lake and traverse over the land to their dam. This tract of land is now on their land (prior land of farm) BUT...this tract of land is essentially blocked from easy access since the farm is here.

They COULD in fact, build a road or simply use the walking trails to walk out to this place but they need to get a tractor/mower out there every now & then as well as some repair trucks that are used for maintainence of the high powered lines.


My understanding from a conversation I had probably ten years ago with my father in law is...

TVA has an easement to get from the road, across the farm, back to their area. This easement however (and this is where I might be mistaken) is an old access road on a specific part of the farm.

Now... if that last presumption is correct then here are some facts:

1. The old access road is at minimum overgrown with weeds but more likely, has saplings and trees growing in it since TVA only comes out every blue moon.
2. The access road is on the backside of the farm and was at one time, probably their "easy" way to get to the towers since the farm was cut and had roads instead of their woods (which used to be the woods on the farm) having no roads.


Yesterday, I "caught" two groups of guys on 4-wheelers driving off the farm. As it turns out, they were contracted by TVA to do some maintainence.

Here's my basic questions:

1. If indeed, there is an easement/right of way on the farm somewhere, should it be listed somehow in the farm deed? If so, would it give specific allowances to their ingress or absent any verbaige to that, could they come "willy nilly"?

2. If in fact, the deed DOES stipulate that "the old access road" is their easement then unless they are using their "old access road" they would be treaspassing?

3. If in fact, the deed stipulates they use the old access road and in fact, it's over grown... just who is responsible for keeping it passable?


Frankly, if I were my father in law, I would have told them back when.... "if you are going to take 250 acres of my land then you can make your own #$(#& road to your towers... I'm not going to let you take half of my property AND then force me to allow you to use my remaining property to get to yours, when you have access to yours simply by bulldozing your own access road from the paved road."


Be it as it may... they come in the main entrance to the farm and according to a 10 year old memory of a discussion I had with my FIL, their access point is actually on the opposite side of the farm BUT, if true, they don't have 'easy' access through it since it's over grown.


I want to find out what the facts are and if they are supposed to use this old access road and THEM maintain it, I might look into applying pressure to that end.

I will of course, need to think that through and balance that logic with the reality of others using that same access road and thereby becoming trespassers.

sigh.... why can't they just ride a boat to their towers... I hear electrical towers and lake water make an interesting combonation


I've attached a picture that shows the basic outline of the farm and how its surrounded by water. The arrow is where the entrance to the farm/houses is and their path to the towers.

On the 'north east' side of this picture, you can see another line where they COULD travel on their OWN land to said towers. Since they own all the land next to the water, they have unencumbered access to this direction except crossing the farm is their "easy button". You can even see the line where the power lines cross the earth.

 

[CurlyDave]

I really don't think you want them to maintain their easement. This opens it up to all sorts of undesirables using it and being a constant thorn in your side.

As much as it stings, I think your best course is to just let their contractors access the TVA land across yours, since this way cuts down on the total number of trespassers you have to deal with, and their contractors are relatively benign. I.e., professionals, and not prone to deliberate vandalism, and the like.

If they cut a passable road, you are going to get lots of 4 wheelers, out there drinking, littering, plinking, and just generally being rowdy.

And, if the TVA drags their feet on cutting the road, you are going to have legal fees on top of a bad nuisance.

 

[tallyho8]

If you look up EASEMENT on wiki.com, you will see how complicated easements are and that the regulations vary tremendously in different areas of the country and by types of easements. You would have to find out what the specific regulations are in your town or county since they vary so much.

Recorded easements are easy to find at your local courthouse but many easements are not recorded and are still legal.

 

[Kfbeal]

If they indeed have an easement, I would require them to show proof of the easement. Easements will vary, especially when maintenance is concerned. The easement might state who is to take care of the easement road-way, etc. You don't have to improve it, and you can probably do what you want to it but not prevent them access.

I would check your county courthouse. We file all easements there so there is a permanent record.

 

[Richard]

I really don't think you want them to maintain their easement. This opens it up to all sorts of undesirables using it and being a constant thorn in your side.

As much as it stings, I think your best course is to just let their contractors access the TVA land across yours, since this way cuts down on the total number of trespassers you have to deal with, and their contractors are relatively benign. I.e., professionals, and not prone to deliberate vandalism, and the like.

If they cut a passable road, you are going to get lots of 4 wheelers, out there drinking, littering, plinking, and just generally being rowdy.

And, if the TVA drags their feet on cutting the road, you are going to have legal fees on top of a bad nuisance.

Thanks everyone and Dave. I think you specifically hit one of my deeper thoughts on this... a passable accessroad will only be an invitation to a bunch of yahoos and probably create a larger problem than the one at hand. Not that it's really a problem, I was just annoyed that they didn't announce themselves when they came out. I 'caught' them coming down the dirt road FROM the farm to the exit and immediately had a bit of an attitude well up inside of me. They were wearing hardhats so I knew something different was going on with them so I didn't turn into the idiot my wife sometimes tells me I am

My primary angst was that they didn't announce themselves... whoa... then I found out they DID stop and talk to my wife who promptly told them her father was 2 doors down. They went to his place and talked to him, telling them to go ahead across the farm to their destination.

I looked at my wife, after I walked in from having a visit with them and asked her why she neglected to tell me there were two 4-wheelers on the farm with TVA contractors? I was glad I approached them firmly, but respectfully.

I don't mind being an idiot when being an idiot is required but I don't much care to be an idiot to someone who has permission to be where they are and simply prove to them what an idiot I can be.

 

[schmism]

generally easement means they have the right to be there "willi nilli"

in a nut shell, consider easement and ROW the same except (for easement) you still own the land (ie pay taxes on it)

They should be confined to there easement for access. Anything else would technically be trespass

Many places around hear will fence off there property less any easement. so the pasture fence stops 40' short of the highway and about 7-8' behind the power poles as the power company has there 15' easement next to the road ROW.

many opt to mow what is in front of the fence.

if you were concerned about it long term id put up 3 stand barb wire on your side of the easement and dont maintain on the other side of the fence.

 

[MarkV]

I think Dave is correct, if you insist they use whatever was the agreed easement it will only open the door for more problems when they come in and tear things up with a dozer. If the original agreement called for you to keep the easement open they could make you bring in a dozer at your cost. If they cut a road near the water front on their property it would seem that that will only provide easier access to your property for trespassers. At least with the power easement on my property they have no obligation to notify you that they are doing maintenance or emergency repairs. What if you were not home and the line was down? Sounds to me like the contractors were trying to be polite by stopping and letting you know they were there. If you want to know what the easement agreement was request a copy from the power company if your father-in-law does not have records.

MarkV

 

[schmism]

If the original agreement called for you to keep the easement open they could make you bring in a dozer at your cost.
MarkV

It is HIGHLY unlikely that any easement would call for the land owner to maintain it period.

 

[LBrown59]

2. If in fact, the deed DOES stipulate that "the old access road" is their easement then unless they are using their "old access road" they would be treaspassing? Rite

3. If in fact, the deed stipulates they use the old access road and in fact, it's over grown... just who is responsible for keeping it passable?
Not you

..........

 

[studor]

I am sure the laws on easements vary from jurisdiction to jurisdiction and probably can vary in structure within a jurisdiction. When I bought my place the ownership of the power line and access rights by the power company were not clear -- but I do want power so I called them and asked. Turns out like in just about every organization I found someone to work with and for the past five years or so I have had no issues. They ask before they use any chemicals to control vegetation, tell me when they expect to be in the neighborhood and most times when they have planned outages. Some things they have to do by law, others they do to keep customers happy.
In many cases they can only deal with the registered landowner on issues related to easements and maintenance, so if you are not the deed holder they probably can and should ignore you.

 

[2manyrocks]

TVA is the govt. and the govt. runs on paper. There is probably a recorded easement back in the chain of title in the day when TVA first acquired the land or developed this project or put up the towers. It may be 30, 40, 50 years back in the title, but it's probably there if you go look for it .

 

[ray66v]

I had several easements on my old property, and they are not such a great thing.

My property was dug up several times, down as far as 22 feet, with almost no notice to me.

Basically, for very little initial compensation, they have a right to do just about anything they desire, on that easement, forever.

My parents have a petroleum pipeline running through their property. It gets flown over twice a day. The minute you do anything, like plant a tree, or bring in a piece of digging equipment out, they show up.

For a one time payment to the previous owner, of a buck an acre in 1930 or 40, they have total control of 20 feet on either side of that pipe, and they are not at all reasonable about it.

The first thing I wanted to know before I bought this property, was if there were any easements.

Yep, the gas co. had contracted to store natural gas under mine, and all the neighboring properties for like $200/year, per property. So I accepted that, and they paid it for a few years. One day they sold to another company who said: "We will not abide by any contracts that the old co. signed".

They still store the gas under me, I just don't get paid now. If I ever decide to drill a well, I have to prove to them, that I am not tapping into the gas, that they are not paying to store under me. ARG....

 

[riptides]

Here's my basic questions:

1. If indeed, there is an easement/right of way on the farm somewhere, should it be listed somehow in the farm deed? If so, would it give specific allowances to their ingress or absent any verbaige to that, could they come "willy nilly"?

2. If in fact, the deed DOES stipulate that "the old access road" is their easement then unless they are using their "old access road" they would be treaspassing?

3. If in fact, the deed stipulates they use the old access road and in fact, it's over grown... just who is responsible for keeping it passable?

1. An easement must be recorded on your deeds. They usually go with the land.
Recorded, it should also give the description.

2. Yes.

3. Who ever has rights to the easement. Notice (who) can be multiple parties.

 

[ultrarunner]

Like Dave mentioned... I let the city crew come down my drive instead of the overgrown easement they have...

I know the guy by sight and they have been very friendly...

At first I was going to insist they only use the easement until the previous owner told me it was a problem with people wandering through all the time before it became overgrown... I don't clear it and it's covered in poison oak, unlike the rest of my land...

For now, anyway, it seems to be a win/win if there is such a thing?

 

[Cat_Driver]

You have to be careful and pick your battles carefully.

Being that they are the Government they can if they want do Eminent domain on what ever they want to and it would be up to you to spend a million dollars on attorneys to fight what they do.

Eminent domain refers to the power possessed by the state over all property within the state, specifically its power to appropriate property for a public use.

Best to be as cordial as possible and keep under their radar.

If you all get in a spitting contest you will lose. So calm down and take a breath and welcome them with open arms.

I won't go into my story here, but trust me if I had it to do over again......

 

[LBrown59]

I won't go into my story here, but trust me if I had it to do over again......

Aw; GO ahead that's what we're here for.

 

[biggerten]

CurlyDave seems sagacious and wise. Henceforth he's unqualified to be elected to higher office.

 

[forgeblast]

in our deed it is listed where the power company has an easement/access. They maintain it, spray and cutting. Anytime they do work we get letters in writing and the dates they will be there. My thinking would be if its not listed its not an easmen...then again.

 

[schmism]

Eminent domain refers to the power possessed by the state over all property within the state, specifically its power to appropriate property for a public use.

ya but 9 times out of 10 they the utility companies seeking the easements are private and therefore can not eminent domain your property.

 

[riptides]

Suggested reading on what power companies are adding to their kitty.

National Interest Electric Transmission Corridors and Congestion Study