Dyson Vacuum cleaners

[dooleysm]

A $549 vacuum cleaner? Sorry, that's just nuts. I can have the carpet professionally steam cleaned every other month for a year for that much.

Birthday or no birthday my wife aint getting a $549 vacuum even if it was designed by a handsome fellow with a British accent....

You gotta spend that tax rebate check on something...

 

[N80]

You gotta spend that tax rebate check on something...

I don't think the government is sending me a rebate check, well, not the US government anyway....

 

[Bird]

I'd never paid any attention to the fine print on the Bed Bath & Beyond 20% off coupons, but I happen to have a couple of them laying here. Mine don't say anything about Dyson, but to quote what it does say:

"Not valid for the purchase of gift cards, All-Clad, Nautica, Tempur-Pedic, Wusthol, Margaritaville, DKNY, Tommy Bahama, Wedgwood, Lenox, Waterford, Vera Wang, Nambe, Riedel, Orrefors Kosta Boda, Oreck, Capresso, Miele, kate spade, Monique Lhuillier, Versace, Alessi, Richard Ginori, and iJoy (where available)."

One of these coupons also excludes "Frette Home Products (where available)".

 

[Sigarms]

A $549 vacuum cleaner? Sorry, that's just nuts. I can have the carpet professionally steam cleaned every other month for a year for that much.

Nuts is relative when it comes to spending money.

You could spend a lot more on a vacuum. You could spend a lot less.

The question is what the value of the product is to you, and how that product performs.

As far as consumer reports goes, I know a little bit about the HVAC industry. I can assure you, when consumer reports rates the "heating and air" equipment lines, they sincerely do have their heads up their butts due to numerous reasons. I know this for a fact. Since they have their head up their butts when it comes to something I know a little about, I have to doubt what they (Consumer Reports) say when it comes to other products that I no nothing about.

 

[N80]

Nuts is relative when it comes to spending money.

Very true. There is a fine line between paying for quality and paying for marketing fluff. Knowing where that line is is the hard part. I've learned a few lessons in my life as a consumer and one of them is that is that neither of these statements is always true:

1) You get what you pay for
2) The more it costs the better it is

You could spend a lot more on a vacuum. You could spend a lot less.

You are correct there too. I just did a little browsing and it turns out that the Dysons are not any more expensive than any of the other name brand's high end stuff and a lot less than even a Kirby refurb.

The problem with buying vacuum cleaners is that there are very few objective features that you can go by. And phrases like 'patented technology' usually mean nothing. And fancy names and phrases to describe sucking something up a tube make me suspicious as well. And Dyson seems to lead the way in this sort of hype, but are no means the only ones.

But again, given that they are actually priced in the middle of the field and that almost everyone who has one here at TBN has liked it, I'd say its still up near the top of my list.

Since they {CR} have their head up their butts when it comes to something I do know, I have to doubt what they (Consumer Reports) say when it comes to other products as well that I no nothing about.

The thing about Consumer Reports is that they explain their methods. I don't always agree with or like their methods and these methods sometimes lead them to a conclusions I disagree with. But the key is that they are transparent, you know how they do the test, this allows you to use what you know to temper the results that they arrive at.

Its the transparency that makes CR so valuable; well, that along with the fact that they don't accept advertising. None. This gives them far more credibility than Consumer Digest or JD Power (i.e. let us create a category for your product and design a made up award for it since its the only one in the category). Bottom line is, other than Consumer Reports, you can't really get a decent objective evaluation of stuff. Reviews and such at places like Amazon are full of three categories of reviews:

1) I'm so proud that I spent a bunch of money on this product that I'm going to tell everyone how great it is
2) Reviewers who have no idea what they are talking about
3) The same people in #2 who are bitter about their purchase because they didn't do enough research and can't say enough bad things about the product.

You have to read dozens and dozens of such reviews to come close to any objective truth. So thats why I frequently use CR for my larger purchases. I don't always agree with them and I don't always buy their recommended product but so far, using their info, they have never led me wrong...in 25 years.

P.S.: And Sig, I've hunted with (but not owned) a $26,000 shotgun. It was gorgeous, exquisitely made and all that....but I'd have to say that about $20,000 of that 'exquisitness' was lost on me.

 

[Sigarms]

The problem with buying vacuum cleaners is that there are very few objective features that you can go by. And phrases like 'patented technology' usually mean nothing. And fancy names and phrases to describe sucking something up a tube make me suspicious as well. And Dyson seems to lead the way in this sort of hype, but are no means the only ones.

You're absolutely correct George, that's why I asked people here on this forum how they liked the Dyson vacuum cleaner if they owned one.

Seems that most of the "reviews" here on this forum from personal experience were outstanding. Ironic that is not what Consumer Reports reported.

If you ever find out how CR rates their A/C or furnaces (when they do), please let me know how they do them. I called one year out of curiosity (CR), and when I asked questions as to their meathod of ratings, they gave me the run around, or I was talking to a guy who didn't know what a liquid or suction line was or didn't know how to determine the BTU rating of a gas or oil furnace without looking at the sticker. Bottom line, at least when it comes to heat and A/C, consumer reports does have their butts up their heads.

 

[Dargo]

A $549 vacuum cleaner? Sorry, that's just nuts. I can have the carpet professionally steam cleaned every other month for a year for that much.

Birthday or no birthday my wife aint getting a $549 vacuum even if it was designed by a handsome fellow with a British accent....

We have a rather large place so we have several vacuums. That way you don't have to carry one up two floors to use it or take one all the way out to the guest house. One that is rather heavy but does a good job is a couple year old Kirby. The way I figure it, I couldn't go wrong buying a basically new one at a pawn shop for $225. You see, when a kid goes to work for Kirby they make them buy their own vacuum for demo use. When the kid figures out after a couple of weeks that they most definitely don't want to go door to door selling $1800 vacuums, they just go dump them at pawn shops for whatever they can get out of them.

As I mentioned far earlier, Consumer Reports only rate the Dyson mid pack or so. I too have found the advice by CR pretty well accurate in the last 30 years or so. In general, most people I've met who have an extreme dislike of CR are people who had something they either 1) just paid a lot for or 2) are really proud of and CR rated it poorly. Over the years I can say that I've used CR as part of the buying decision on hundreds of thousands of dollars of items. I'm yet to completely disagree with their assessment. Granted, sometimes I intend to use something for a use they didn't think was important and their view had no basis on my purchase. For example, I needed a four wheel drive that would perform extremely well off road. CR's recommendations were strongly weighted on how the vehicles perform on the road and for comfort. I simply didn't use their recommendation because it didn't apply for my use. However, for electronics, appliances and vacuums, I find it extremely difficult to doubt their results that are lab tested and can be repeated over and over.

But, on the same token, if I bought something and was completely unaware that there was a superior performing item for less money, I'd likely still be satisfied with what I bought. I've been in that situation as well and see it frequently. In the sales business, the bottom line is that 'if the customer's happy, it's a great deal and a great product regardless'. I suppose that is all that really matters.

 

[Sigarms]

I simply didn't use their recommendation because it didn't apply for my use. However, for electronics, appliances and vacuums, I find it extremely difficult to doubt their results that are lab tested and can be repeated over and over.

Could you explain how one year they (CR) rated a Rheem heat pump number one, and a Rhuud heat pump number 10 (last place), when both units are made in the exact same factory?

Better yet, the other year, they (CR) rated a Lennox oil furnace over an Armstrong oil furnace, yet Armstrong makes Lennox's oil funaces?

Or, how about one year when they rated a Bryant gas furnace over a Carrier gas furnace? (yet again, made in the same factory).

You missed one Dargo on those who may disagree with Consumer Reports, that is of the person who knows the product inside and out.

 

[alchemysa]

(( Dargo said..."I find it extremely difficult to doubt their results that are lab tested and can be repeated over and over."))


I was recently in IKEA for the first and only time. They had a machine in a big plastic display case that was 'testing' a chair. It was continually applying a heavy weight to a chair supposedly simulating someone sitting down on the chair. The purpose of course was to show how durable the chair was. Problem was, it was doing it so smoothly and slowly that there was no way it simulated real life. I reckon one heavy exhausted bloke dropping like a stone onto that chair would have wrecked it in about 1 second.

Anyway. As we are looking for a new vacuum I've followed this thread with interest and looked at numerous consumer reports and other reviews. Overall, the Dysons seem to rate OK. Their main problem seems to be brittle plastic bits that break - the type of fault that is often not revealed by these professional testing machines or by supervised trials.

 

[Dargo]

Could you explain how one year they (CR) rated a Rheem heat pump number one, and a Rhuud heat pump number 10 (last place), when both units are made in the exact same factory?

Better yet, the other year, they (CR) rated a Lennox oil furnace over an Armstrong oil furnace, yet Armstrong makes Lennox's oil funaces?

Or, how about one year when they rated a Bryant gas furnace over a Carrier gas furnace? (yet again, made in the same factory).

You missed one Dargo on those who may disagree with Consumer Reports, that is of the person who knows the product inside and out.

I'm not going to argue with you. I had a Dodge Durango that gave me 10 years and 150k miles of trouble free service when they are generally known to be trouble. Not all models are the same and not all units are the same. For your HVAC, one size may be highly rated when another size may not be. BTW it's spelled Ruud; I walked outside to compare one unit I have. Again, not to be picky, but my best friend owns a huge HVAC company. Nothing personal, but I've seen the ratings, how they are rated and have more than a passive knowledge of HVAC. The only ratings I've seen by CR that vary like you say are the ones that are based on comsumer's ratings on CR's surveys sent out. Otherwise, they are based on actual lab tested results; which I don't recall offhand seeing for HVAC.

Either way, I'm not going to argue the issue. As I said, if the person who owns an item and is happy with the item, what more is there? Nothing anyone else says nor any rating should matter. By no means am I comparing a Dyson to a Yugo, but I'm sure there's someone out there who is thrilled with their Yugo. Who would I be to tell them that it is junk?

 

[alchemysa]

I'm not going to argue with you. I had a Dodge Durango that gave me 10 years and 150k miles of trouble free service when they are generally known to be trouble.

About 20 years ago, over here in Australia, the Holden (GMH) Camira won a 'Wheels' Car of the Year Award. They sold heaps. Since then it has achieved legendary status us one of the most unreliable, poorly engineered, flimsy, pieces of junk ever put on the road. Illustrating yet again that 'professional' reviews hardly ever really nail the question of 'durability' - something that is of utmost importance in the real world.

 

[Sigarms]

For your HVAC, one size may be highly rated when another size may not be. BTW it's spelled Ruud;

I'm impressed with your knowledge.

By the same token, you're correct, I'm happy with my purchase, which is all that matters.

 

[N80]

For example, I needed a four wheel drive that would perform extremely well off road. CR's recommendations were strongly weighted on how the vehicles perform on the road and for comfort. I simply didn't use their recommendation because it didn't apply for my use.

Exactly my experience. It was in 1990 and I was looking for an SUV that would work well off road and be reliable. And trust me, I knew off road vehicles at that time inside and out. CR rated the Nissan Pathfinder lower than some others because of its on road ride and luxury amenities. And they stated clearly that they were not evaluating its off-road abilities. I was not looking for those things so I dismissed that part. That is the key to using CR. You have to pay attention to details. They tell you what they are testing, they tell you what their bias is (on road driveability, etc). So you have to be aware of that and use their review accordingly. In that same review that rated the Pathfinder tops for other things that mattered to me like fit and finish, reliability, ergonomics, etc.

It got good reviews in the off-road magazines in terms of its off-road ability.

I put nearly 200,000 miles on it and only gave it up after a tennybopper ran a red light and totalled it. No problems, none, and it was the best stock off-road vehicle I've ever owned. Best truck I've ever owned...best vehicle I've ever owned.

Likewise, I bought my Nissan Murano based on CR reviews and they did not even rate its safety because the power steering loses boost in very low speed turns. They criticized its somewhat chintzy interior appointments but raved about the engine and reliability. They got it all right.

Now, in regard to one company making products for another company, well, that hardly means they are the same. Products are often made to the specs and standards that the labeling company requires. Those can vary quite a bit.

Also, CR makes it clear that they rate a product based on the one the bought (they do not accept products from manufacturers). If they get a dud, it gets a dud's review.

 

[N80]

By the same token, you're correct, I'm happy with my purchase, which is all that matters.

That's the bottom line.

 

[Sigarms]

Now, in regard to one company making products for another company, well, that hardly means they are the same.

Actually, they are in more cases than you would think when it comes to HVAC.

 

[kenmac]

Guess CR should have tested the payne or weatherking unit. Probably would have tested better

 

[Dargo]

Actually, they are in more cases than you would think when it comes to HVAC.

And, I'm still amazed at the markup. Wow! I'm not trying to give away an industry secret, but I know for a fact that owners of HVAC companies would scream bloody murder if the distributors began selling directly to the public.

I have American Standard for the first floor of my guest house and Trane for the 2nd floor. Hmm, think they might be a bit similar? I like the Ruud unit on the 2nd floor of my house just fine. Some turn their nose up at Ruud but I'm happy with it's performance as well as what it cost me. That some people don't like them means nothing to me. I like it just the same. Like we agree, that's all that matters anyway; right?

 

[Sigarms]

And, I'm still amazed at the markup. Wow! I'm not trying to give away an industry secret, but I know for a fact that owners of HVAC companies would scream bloody murder if the distributors began selling directly to the public.

Some distributors already do.

Air Conditioning with Heat Pumps - Goodman & Ruud AC Systems with Built-In Heat Pump

Contrary to some beliefs that you need a CFC card to buy refrigerant bearing HVAC equipment, that is not the case (you do however need it to buy "freon").

Personally, one reason per the link I posted above is one reason I do not like Goodman.

That said, if a homeowner wants to go out and buy an additional $2000 dollars worth of tools to do a proper instal, knock yourself out. Or the homeowner finds a decent service tech who will do a "side job" and cut the major HVAC business out of the loop, because when the service tech is making $500-$1000 for a days work (simple retrofit) he's (service tech) is jumping for joy because he made some fast money. That service tech also doesn't have insurnace to pay for the vehicles, health insuranace for the employees, rent...

By the way, as I've mentioned before, LOVE the Dyson

 

[dmccarty]

Talked to the wifey about the Dyson again last night.

My guess before I talked to her was that we bought it in 2003ish. That is the date she pegged.

The Dyson is very light and the lightness is due to the plastic and I think aluminum pipe. It does feel flemsy but it has not been a problem at all. Nothing has broken so far. Since we have concrete floors and the "wand" does get dropped from time to time its has held up pretty well.

Now you may or may not like the lightness. For me its a who cares and I would rather have more substantial parts even though nothing has broke. But its mainly the woman running the vacuum and lightness is a big factor for them. The wifey mentioned last night how easy it was to use the Dyson compared to the old vacuum. So lightness is a priority design point.

I think we paid $400. She thinks it listed for $500. Given we got 20% off I think we are both right.

Later,
Dan

 

[Bird]

And I thought our Hoover was expensive when I gave $270 for it on 1/25/1998. I may have to replace it someday, but hopefully not too soon.