Dump trailer

GeneD14 · Mar 2, 2006

Nat,

This is a great project. I'll be watching your progress. You have got some guts taking on a big one like this! Looks good so far. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Renze · Mar 2, 2006

Nat, how are you going to power the dumpwagon's hydraulics ? With an electric driven hydro pump ?

About 10 years ago there was a manufacturer here in Holland, that tried to sell small dumpwagons and even container bin carriers in the 1200 kg class to be pulled by a midsized passenger car, or 2000 kg class to be pulled by a Van or jeep...
It used a belt driven oil pump under the hood with ISO quick couplers to the trailer. I've seen the leaflets and heard my brother talking about building one himself. I've never heard from the manufacturer again... /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Todays they do sell 2000 kg three side tippers with battery powered electrical oil pump drive, a local guy has one.
For electrical power it relys on a battery charger every night, and to access the batteries you need to tip first... So you have a problem if you find your batteries dead with the tipper being down... /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
First thing this guy did was making a charger extension cord.

By the way, your work looks very solid !! Too bad my European Volvo 440 1.9 turbo diesel isnt allowed to pull any more than 1200 kg.... /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

jimmysisson · Mar 2, 2006

On our dump trailers the hardest thing is the first inch or two of lift, due to the cylinder geometry. That strains the batteries pretty hard, even though they're hooked into the pickup charging systems through the 7-way connector. Your setup looks better than the Cam Line we have now, as you have a bit of angle on the task right when you start to lift. Keep up the pix, please.
Thanks, Jim

drmiller100 · Mar 3, 2006

to figure out lift capacity:
half the diameter of the ram is the radius.

3.14 x R x R x PSI of hydraulics.

so, 3.14x2x2x1500 equals 18,000 IF the ram was vertical, and rigth in teh center.

getting the ram as vertical as possible at the start of the lift is important.

Axles are the most expensive part. 500 bucks a piece, without tires and wheels?

Nat · Mar 4, 2006

Ist I bought a hydralic pump/valve/motor/resivoir combination to power it with, cost 399.00 at Northern
2nd. I have a 4" diameter cyl so radius of 2 squred=4X pi-3.14=12.56 time 1600psi=20096 of push at the ram end.
I don't know how to tell excatly how much it will dump because the cyl isn't perpendictular to the trailer bed. The anchor end is 11 " lower than the live end and the live end is 6'0'' from the hinge, someone smarter than I may be able to tell me, but I know it will work, just can't prove it on paper.
As far as the axles and tires, I'm buying Mobile home axles and cutting them down to length. The place I buy them from sells the brake axle for 75.00 and a non brake:IE tag axle for 60.00 The wheels and tires are 25.00 each and when they wear out in another 1500 miles I always buy Lowboy Tires to replace them. They sell for 96.00 here and will weather crack before they wear out.
I will have steel floor and tailgate, the front and sides will be treated wood.
HTH, later, Nat

rswyan · Mar 4, 2006

( I don't know how to tell excatly how much it will dump because the cyl isn't perpendictular to the trailer bed. The anchor end is 11 " lower than the live end and the live end is 6'0'' from the hinge, someone smarter than I may be able to tell me, but I know it will work, just can't prove it on paper. )
Try using this handy calculator from Baum Hydraulics - it figures the amount of vertical push for a cylinder mounted at an angle. You will need some idea of what angle it is at in the initial position.

Angled Hydraulic Cylinder Calculator

Nat · Mar 4, 2006

rswyan, thanks for the link. That is a neat one. From that site it looks like I will have a lift capicity at the "live end " of the cyl of about 6877 lbs. That should dump more than I'll ever need to haul behind a pickup. Thanks, Later, Nat

Nat · Mar 6, 2006

Well, it's do-over time. I gave it a dry run today, by hooking up the hyd. hose and running jumper cables from my truck. My cyl. is to big. I run out of the 2 1/2 gal resavior before it is half way up. I had just measured the ram on my 2 stage cyl, and it was 4". That was fine , except the piston is actually 5". So I don't have enough volume of fluid to use that big of a cyl. It is cheaper to get another cyl, so I ordered it from Northern today. I'll also have to re do the mounts because the cyl I have has a welded end and the cyl. I'm getting is clevis mount. Not a big problem, but stil would rather it worked right the first time., Later, Nat

GeneD14 · Mar 7, 2006

Do the mobile home axles come with leaf springs? They seem like a good deal.

rswyan · Mar 7, 2006

Nat,

Glad to help.

( From that site it looks like I will have a lift capicity at the "live end " of the cyl of about 6877 lbs. That should dump more than I'll ever need to haul behind a pickup. )

Dunno what you are planning on hauling and dumping in the trailer but the weight can add up pretty quick. I have what I would call a light-duty 2 ton 4' x 8' dump trailer made by Country Mfg. .... it's strictly off-road use. I used it this past summer to haul about 100,000 lbs of wet sheep manure from my neighbors. I heaped it on each load and if I had to guess it was over 4000 lbs every load.

Based on how you are constructing your trailer (and how mine is constructed) I'd imagine that your trailer could probably haul double what mine does. Whether you have a tow vehical to haul it is another matter .... my Ram will pull 12K lbs. Having plenty of lift capacity would not be a bad thing. If you can increase the angle on the cylinder at it's initial position you can always gain some lift capacity.

George2615 · Mar 7, 2006

Mobile home axles come with leaf springs. I built a 16' beavertail double axle trailer using them back in 98. The axles I picked up were rated at 6000 lb. each and were cheap. Mobile home axles are designed for limited use for moving mobile homes. The tires are even embossed with "for mobile home use only". In NY you can get a ticket if you use these tires on a homemade trailer. (Don't ask how I know this). The only problem came when I needed to replace the brakes since everything within the drums are either welded or riveted and not user friendly to change. I contacted The company who made them, they would sell me complete brake packages for my axles at a cost of between $500-600 (drum or disc) for 4. Then the old backing plates would have to be cut off at the axles and the new backing plates welded on. I could have done the job but chose not to and bought a new 20' tiltbed. I'm sure there are thousands of homemade trailers on the road using these axles. For a light duty trailer that doesn't need brakes they are probably the cheapest axles you can find. If you are interested in a set make sure the brakes are replaceable. If I was to build another trailer today I'd go to TSC or Northern and buy axles from them that have brakes you can change. Just my 2 cents.

George

Nat · Mar 7, 2006

I picked up my axles this afternoon. I have them cut down to the correct width and the spring hanger kit installed and the frame is sitting on it's own wheel now.
Yes the axles come with springs and the equalizer. I don't like using the old spring hanger bolts that may have been over streched so I always but a spring hanger kit. It contains 6 spring hangers,14 new bolts and locking nuts and 8 shackles. The kit cost 39.95
Tommorow I'll get the hangers welded in place and maybe get the steel floor on. I'll take some pics then.Later, Nat

Nat · Mar 7, 2006

rswyan, I have a Dodge 3500 Cummins 4x4 so I don't think pulling it will be a problem, I regularly pull a 33' 5th wheel that weighs 11,000. I am sure I made the frame heavier than needed but that will never hurt. Later, Nat

rswyan · Mar 8, 2006

I was mainly trying to point out that you might be a little light in the amount of lift that the cylinder produces, given what the trailer is capable of hauling.

BTW, excellent taste in your choice of tow vehicle. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

TOMDUALLY · Mar 9, 2006

PICTURES, NAT, PICTURES /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

Nat · Mar 14, 2006

Tom, I have been sick for a few days so nothing got done.
Well, I mounted the pump temp. and hooked the jumper cables to my truck battery. It takes 27 secs to go from all the way down to all the way up. The dump angle is 50 degrees so stuff should slide out pretty well. This pic shows it in the dumped position with it sitting on it's own wheels. I worked on it 3 hrs today and have the pump permantly mounted and the rest of the cross members in. Only a few of the X-members are in on this pic, because it made it easier to mount the pump and battery box without them being in the way.
I should get 3-4 hours on it tommorow and except for the sideboards it should be nearly finished. I'll post some pics tommorow. Later, Nat

RonR · Mar 14, 2006

Nat, did you use some 'rithmetic on where to place the lift cylinder or just mount it where it looked good?

To me, that seems a critical placement.

ron

Renze · Mar 15, 2006

Nat, it still looks good so far, but i have one remark.. i dont know how thick the steel is you used, but i think the C beam is going to wrap at the cylinder mounting point, and the strip of metal and the angle iron it is mounted to, will just be pulled towards the hinge point.. just my opinion.. /forums/images/graemlins/ooo.gif

Nat · Mar 15, 2006

Well, I used some "higher mathmatical functions", but I also lifted the bed to the correct angle and made sure the cyl.placement would work . I used some imfo from several people to get my cyl placement and I also looked at a factory trailer. Mine is in pretty much the same place as a foctory one, except I stood the cyl up a little more and used a larger dia. cyl. A guy down the road has one that I took some ideas from, and his is a 7000 lb trailer and uses a 2 1/2" dia. cyl.
I used a 4" dia. and had to get a pump with a larger capacity volume, so mine should be stronger. Later, Nat

Nat · Mar 15, 2006

Renze, sorry for the confusion, but it was just tacked together enough to make sure nothjing was binding or hitting together in the pic. The welding is being done and the bracing so the way the chanel is sitting in the pic surely isn't all I am going to do. I have since welded the chanel in place with brackets on each end and diagonal bracing, That was just a hurry up and snap it pic to show how it will dump. Later, Nat