Corona Virus #7

[California]

More on Chloroquine/Azithromycin. And On Dr. Raoult. | In the Pipeline

Interesting. My takeaway: Sounds like it might work but the data presented is too random to support that claim.

As usual reading the replies broadens understanding:

"Bergamo hospital at the epicentre of the Italian outbreak has tentatively concluded that the terrible ICU demand is a result of immune reaction rather than the virus itself. As a result, they have dropped anti-viral medication and are treating patients with massive doses of CQ and steroids (enough to immuno-suppress them like transplant patients). The hypothetical prophylactic role of CQ in preventing viral entry may also be doing some good but it is seemingly not the primary goal in their new treatment regime"

Ok if that didn't go over my head: its the body's over-reaction that is causing stress and death. So treatment has now shifted to suppressing the immune system which is improving outcomes.

Other replies to the article say friends who work for Raoult, report such a severe authoritarian atmosphere that often real research is overwhelmed by Raoult's preconceived opinions.

Conclusion - The author of this critique is unable to come to a conclusion on the validity of Raoult's Youtube show.


Another observation by me: I thought that Slate photo of a doctor showed the guy who declared Trump positive on all his tests. Before I read that the photo is Raoult.

 

[RandyT]

Interesting. My takeaway: Sounds like it might work but the data presented is too random to support that claim.

As usual reading the replies broadens understanding:

Ok if that didn't go over my head: its the body's over-reaction that is causing stress and death. So treatment has now shifted to suppressing the immune system which is improving outcomes.

Other replies to the article say friends who work for Raoult, report such a severe authoritarian atmosphere that often real research is overwhelmed by Raoult's preconceived opinions.

Conclusion - The author of this critique is unable to come to a conclusion on the validity of Raoult's Youtube show.


Another observation by me: I thought that Slate photo of a doctor showed the guy who declared Trump positive on all his tests. Before I read that the photo is Raoult.

Correct, the bodies immune system throws everything but the kitchen sink at the damage in the lungs all at one, called a cytokine storm, and the immune system does more damage to the lungs than the virus does leading to death.

 

[pennwalk]

Our senator is supporting masks4all and the governor said it might help. This would be the cloth masks you can make at home. Might be useful if everyone would do it but what's the chance of that?

Chris

 

[pennwalk]

The radio said Lancaster county is up to 97 diagnosed cases. Isn't 100 where they start counting?

Chris

 

[riptides]

I am in VA, "stay at home" State. By orders of our Gov.

My county is internet challenged. To include voice and data services. Schools closed, businesses shuttered, you get the picture. It's a state wide shutdown.

So yesterday, I get word that the county is setting up hot spot areas for internet connectivity. Commuter parking lots and whatnot.

It's funny and sad at the same time. You see internet has a long history of debate over whether it is a service or not, and who is best to provide it.

Under the Governors orders, driving to these hotspots can now be classified as "essential social services" or getting "services"

The only issue I see is gathering of more than ten people in the car at the parking lot where the hotspot is located.

The virus has people thinking in new ways trying to maintain the semblance of life before the virus.

 

[JamesHW]

I remember before we got internet in the country or figured out how to use cellular connection for the laptop via our cellphones we would drive and park in the McDonald’s, Panera Bread or the local coffee shop to use the free WiFi to get essential online stuff done.

 

[/pine]

...it's not a good idea because it's not my idea...

LoL...The TBN creed...!

 

[houstonscott]

Chinese Biological Experiments To Infect Humans With Coronavirus Exposed In 215 By Italian State Media | Zero Hedge

 

[k0ua]

Does anyone know if the guy that was washing his hands and face with Methanol as a safeguard against the virus is OK? I haven't seen him post since I warned him about the dangers of methanol poisoning. Has anyone seen him post? I cannot exactly remember his user name but would recognize it if I saw it. Something like zzzz yyyyy or something like that.

 

[Industrial Toys]

That was over 1800 years ago! lol Not everyone working in a lab is out to do good. But I guess that's a matter of political perspective.

 

[dragoneggs]

Does anyone know if the guy that was washing his hands and face with Methanol as a safeguard against the virus is OK? I haven't seen him post since I warned him about the dangers of methanol poisoning. Has anyone seen him post? I cannot exactly remember his user name but would recognize it if I saw it. Something like zzzz yyyyy or something like that.

This guy?

https://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/members/zzvyb6/

 

[k0ua]

This guy?

https://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/members/zzvyb6/

Yep, thats him.. sorry for the double post.. He appears to be all good and posting. so that answers that.

 

[k0ua]

That was over 1800 years ago! lol Not everyone working in a lab is out to do good. But I guess that's a matter of political perspective.

As you may have notices zero's are often deleted in HTML URL's. so 215 is actually 2015

 

[hawkeye08]

Regarding the malaria drug being used for coronavirus, it is not a vaccine, but rather an existing drug with known side effects that helps some folks get over the CV-19 quicker. I wouldn't call the use of it for this virus a study, but rather an attempt to help folks that otherwise might have difficulty recovering. As time goes on, they might do a study to better determine which patients it can help, but right now, the focus is on trying to get past this (flatten the curve so as to lessen the impact to resources and reduce the deaths).

My daughter works for health insurance company in customer service, she got an email indicating the malaria/lupus drug shortage in their system was caused by folks trying to get 6months supply so they didn't run out.. now limited to 30 day supply until mfg catches up.

 

[shooterdon]

Regarding the malaria drug being used for coronavirus, it is not a vaccine, but rather an existing drug with known side effects that helps some folks get over the CV-19 quicker. I wouldn't call the use of it for this virus a study, but rather an attempt to help folks that otherwise might have difficulty recovering. As time goes on, they might do a study to better determine which patients it can help, but right now, the focus is on trying to get past this (flatten the curve so as to lessen the impact to resources and reduce the deaths).

My daughter works for health insurance company in customer service, she got an email indicating the malaria/lupus drug shortage in their system was caused by folks trying to get 6months supply so they didn't run out.. now limited to 30 day supply until mfg catches up.

Thanks for posting that. Looks like "hoarders" are the problem but so are the doctors. What is the rationale for a 6 month of this stuff? You can bet some of these people intend to sell it on the black market...and the doctor enabled it.

Track down the "doctors", tell them to report to their local hospitals to start "activity duty" to care for Covid-19 patients or they will lose their license to practice.

 

[shooterdon]

It痴 helpful to look at how cancer treatment has evolved in the past fifty years. We learned, in pediatrics at least, that running rigidly controlled trials allowed steady progress and improved survival, step by step. We went from less than 10% survival in pediatric acute lymphocytic leukemia to over 90% survival. It wasn稚 because cowboys physicians just treated any way they thought reasonable in a life threatening situation. It was because solid data allowed truly effective approaches to be identified and then improved upon with additional strictly controlled trials.

It may be hard to accept that carefully designed and executed studies take more time than a shotgun approach but in the long run it is the way to go. Whining about ç*¥nethical randomized trials is BS. What is unethical is failing to do appropriate reliable trials so that the next 100 million patients actually benefit from the experience gained treating the first million.

Good post sir.

The issue we face is we do not have 50 years to "solve" this. Currently our peak is estimated to be in a few weeks.

I have no idea how to structure a "good" test. I presume the design is different for a disease like cancer, where a patient rarely recovers without some type of treatment, and this virus that can be survived without intervention, and that varies in impact from a mild flu to death.

In a previous post, I said I would take my chances if I was dying and "roll the dice". If there is more than one treatment option, I will trust men like you to advise me of the best course of treatment. If there are no options, and I need to be a guinea pig for testing, I am OK with that. The "hope" that the current "fad" gives us is that it may work...and it will not kill us. In the worst case, Covid-19 or the defense reaction (cytokine storm} will kill many of those with severe cases within days. Most of us are ignorant...maybe we are being fooled...but we are not aware of any other options.

 

[rswyan]

CDC head: Up to 25 percent of those with coronavirus never show symptoms | TheHill

 

[rswyan]

Topol: US Betrays Healthcare Workers in Coronavirus Disaster