Compact Tractor Diesel Particulate Filters (DPF) Version 2.0

[MossRoad]

Certainly both are Tier IV compliant.
Tier IV exempts tractors <25.4794 horsepower from Tier IV standards.
The L2501 is dirty.

No, it does not exempt it from Tier IV standards. It meets Tier IV standards for that size of engine.

 

[DieselBound]

Still wrong no matter how many times it gets posted.

I suppose one could stretch it, but, no, in my mind "same" is not the same as "different" (or, if you will, "different" is not the same as "same"):

From Definition of SAME

Definition of same​

(Entry 1 of 3)

1a : resembling in every relevant respect

b : conforming in every respect —used with as

2a : being one without addition, change, or discontinuance : identical

b : being the one under discussion or already referred to

3 : corresponding so closely as to be indistinguishable

4 : equal in size, shape, value, or importance —usually used with the or a demonstrative (such as that, those) in all senses


And from Definition of DIFFERENT

Full Definition of different​

(Entry 1 of 2)

1 : partly or totally unlike in nature, form, or quality : dissimilar could hardly be more different —often followed by from, than, or chiefly British to small, neat hand, very different from the captain's tottery characters— R. L. Stevensonvastly different in size than it was twenty-five years ago— N. M. Puseya very different situation to the … one under which we live— Sir Winston Churchill

2 : not the same: such as

a : distinct different age groups

b : various different members of the class

c : another switched to a different TV program

3 : unusual, special she was different and superior

 

[5030]

Little dirt never hurt....lol

 

[jeff9366]

My anticipated use is 50-100 hours a year.

This is the operating hour range when emission control equipment may be cranky. If you can find a good 2012 or older used tractor with 35-50 horsepower it will predate emission control requirements. (DPF = diesel particulate filter + paraphernalia.)


Using a <26-horsepower tractor you might have to occasionally cut a partial swathe, say 50", in tall, dry grass with a five foot rotary cutter but not very burdensome on ten acres, mostly occupied by trees.

A 5' Roto-Tiller will be within the capacity of an <26-horsepower tractor to power tilling MOIST soil. Consider a Middlebuster or a Bucket Spade in lieu of other attachments for tree planting. A Middlebuster is also a good tool for breaking very hard ground when a breaking plow is not wanted.

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=tractor+middlebuster

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=tractor+bucket+spade

Normally I preach BUY ENOUGH TRACTOR, but as your ten (10) acres are flat and mostly occupied by Christmas trees, stability will not be a major issue. Consider the simplicity of a HST tractor without Tier IV emissions paraphernalia.

 

[jeff9366]

Thank You Jeff
I have reviewed the specs on Kioti's site for both tractors, same frame, same lift capacity, just not sure on the dragging capacity / real world between the 2 tractors. Hoping someone can chime in and let me know if the 2620 turned up HP will be equivalent or close to the 3520 which has slightly more Cu In motor.
Or someone with a 2620 could provide their experience doing dragging work.

Tractors with Tier IV emission controls emit only 1% of the soot relative to equal weight tractors not requiring Diesel Particulate Filters + paraphernalia. Knowing this, I still recommend <26-horsepower tractors from time to time because they are legal at present in the USA.

The idea of turning up a small displacement diesel engine to higher revolutions, thereby spewing enormous amount of particulates, which YOU will be breathing in concentrated form, is a bad idea. I speculate those same particulates settled the hunting land you wish to improve will send a warning signal to wildlife.

For dragging, tractor weight is the first essential, for traction. Tractor horsepower is second.

fishbones' reply:
Something to consider for sure. Thought about it this weekend. Have to back out of barn quickly when firing up the LK3054.

 

[Paystar]

I've gone back to using 1950's to 1980 technology tractors and couldn't be happier.

It was only hard to adjust to not having a built in cup holder and a plastic interior. LOL

 

[groundcover]

So could you run two 25 HP diesels and avoid the emission requirements??
No use letting the boaters have all the fun with multiple engines !

 

[MapleLeafFarmer]

I remember the transition from carb's to throttle bodies to fuel injection.
Some screamed the world as we knew it was going to end.
We survived.

 

[Paystar]

So could you run two 25 HP diesels and avoid the emission requirements??
No use letting the boaters have all the fun with multiple engines !

I'll buy one! make it look like the old International 2+2 with the big long hood!

Now I'm drooling Mmmmmm IH 2+2 with DT466 power!!!!

 

[jeff9366]

What makes/models are in that bigger/heavier/more capabable then a sub compact, and still in the cheap, small range?

I assume the 25hp emissions stuff is the reason for a significant price jump right at that border line.

Bare tractor weight is a tractor specification easily found in sales brochures and web sites, readily comparable across tractor brands and tractor models, new and used.

Every tractor brand includes Compact tractor models weighing from 2,700 to 2,900 pounds bare weight with a less than 26 horsepower engine.


I assume the 25hp emissions stuff is the reason for a significant price jump right at that border line.

Yes.


Stricter Tier IV off-road diesel engine emission reduction standards phased in dealer tractor inventory during 2009 - 2012, impacting tractor prices.

Tier IV emission standards require tractor manufacturers to add or revise pollution reduction technology on new tractors generating over 19 kW power = 25.4794 horsepower.

DPF is used by the majority of tractor manufactures for emissions control on OVER 25.4794 horsepower tractors.

Tier IV technology complicates the engine and exhaust package and is a significant cost factor. However, the pollutants emitted by a Tier IV technology tractor are about 1% of the pollutants emitted by a non Tier IV tractor.

Diesel Particulate Filter (DPF) captures exhaust particulates (soot) in a ceramic matrix. When tractor engine runs sufficiently hot, accumulated particulates burn off periodically without operator intervention. If engine is not run continuously hot long enough to burn off particulates, diesel soot accumulates in the matrix. Once heavy soot accumulates in DPF the tractor forces soot clearance with the tractor parked and throttle open to about 2,200 rpm for about sixteen minutes, which makes the DPF REALLY HOT to burn off all accumulated soot. Burning off accumulated soot, either during operation or parked is called REGENERATION.

If there is no DPF there is an alternative incendiary technology to burn off very fine particulates (soot). Sometimes exhaust heat is elevated all the time, sometimes periodically.
Diesel particulates must be burned. THERE IS NO FREE LUNCH.

 

[5030]

f there is no DPF there is an alternative incendiary technology to burn off very fine particulates (soot). Sometimes exhaust heat is elevated all the time, sometimes periodically.
Diesel particulates must be burned. THERE IS NO FREE LUNCH.

Do keep in mind always that the incinerated ash stays in the cannister and and the cannister element has to be cleaned or renewed at some point. Kubota says 3500 regens, not sure about other brands but I will say that is a dealer service because the ECM also has to be reset.

Actually, there is a FREE LUNCH. Don't buy one (T4 final tractor). I don't have any and don't want any either.

 

[jeff9366]

1) Do keep in mind always that the incinerated ash stays in the cannister and and the cannister element has to be cleaned or renewed at some point. 2) Kubota says 3500 regens, not sure about other brands but I will say that is a dealer service because the ECM also has to be reset.

1) Yes. Everything on a tractor needs to be repaired, renewed or adjusted at some point, including the DPF.

2) My L3560 regenerates every 60 engine hours.
60 X 3,500 = 210,000 engine hours.

The average Kubota tractor owner with Tier IV exhaust paraphernalia, who carefully reads the Owner's Manual section on regeneration and follows the directions, will have more worry and expense over tire type/wear/punctures/traction than DPF function.

 

[5030]

My L3560 regenerates every 60 hours.
60 X 3,500 = 210,000 engine hours.

Interestingly, the bulk of repairs at my dealer seem to involve emissions issues and not mechanical ones. Most of the issues seem to arise when owners don't follow the recommended regen and try to circumvent it. Not an issue with me as neither of my M9's have any emissions junk on them. Your engine won't last that many hours without a major rebuild anyway and Kubota has adopted a policy of not rebuilding any engines but installing a reman engine instead.

I believe Kubota is banking on the second or third owner having to deal with cannister replacement, not the original owner. I also suspect that very few of the posters on here have the meter hours I have on my tractors anyway, if any actually. My 2002 has over 6K hours on it and my 2004 has over 4K hours on it. Both run like tops and both have not had any major mechanical issue either, other than replacement of worn parts.

 

[jeff9366]

Emission controls on internal combustion engines are inevitable considering the increase in world population and the desire of those entering the middle class to own an automobile.

Tier V emission controls will be here soon, unlikely to exempt <26 horsepower engines from DPF, probably requiring blue diesel exhaust fluid at 50+ horsepower.

Tier V has been a fact of life in the European Union, population 451 million, for several years. Tractors are still selling.

North America is fortunate to have Europe trialing Tier V for us.

 

[5030]

Last new chainsaw I purchased (Echo) came with a CAT in the muffler which I immediately put in the trash can. I had to buy a non cat muffler for it and interestingly Echo sells them for their saws. Runs a lot better without it.

I foresee even lawnmowers coming with emissions controls in the near future as in cat's.

 

[5030]

The inherent issue with T4 engines is not the emissions hardware but the electronic controls as in ECM's and the proprietary software and the inability to diagnose issues using the now standard OBD scanners. Not even my high buck Autel scanner can access anything on a Kubota because of the proprietary plug in's.

The tractor builders really need to adopt an industry wide standard and stick to it. Sure, I can borrow my dealer's scanner if I wanted to but not everyone can do that. Not that I need it actually because both mine are strictly mechanically injected.

 

[deserteagle71]

I foresee even lawnmowers coming with emissions controls in the near future as in cat's.

Several states have already outlawed ICE lawnmowers (and other small engine powered equipment) and the way things are going I see the Federal government doing the same thing shortly.

Your new electric lawnmower won't need emissions equipment.

Several states consider gas-powered equipment ban

CBS News reports New York and Illinois are weighing bans on gas-powered lawn equipment.

lawnandlandscape.com

 

[jeff9366]

I can tell you from experience with my L2501 HST, going from 25 HP stock, to 44.1 HP with the Turbo Kit, was a significant improvement in operating performance. Luckily, no regen or DPF for me.


DPF equipped tractors produce only ~ 1% ~ of the cancer and smog producing diesel particulates which are produces by ~ 25-horsepower ~ diesel tractors without DPFs.

Turbocharging an L2501 so it produces 200 times as much pollution as a 33-39 horsepower, DPF equipped Kubota tractor should be a crime.

If you need > 25-horsepower buy a DPF equipped, legal machine.

 

[LouNY]

Time to twist the wick a bit

 

[K5lwq]

Time to twist the wick a bit
View attachment 813623

That’s just good clean fun right there!