Comparison Choices, Choices, Too Many Choices

[4570Man]

This is true but IF you have a total loss, like your house burns to the ground and you have no insurance your in big trouble.. As far as people putting the money aside that they would have paid an insurance company, that doesn't happen very often..

If I put away all the money I have paid insurance company's over the years, I could build a new house, but I haven't and neither has 99.9% of anyone else.. The percentage of people that put the money aside was higher years ago but not anymore..

0% down, 84 month financing, adding implements etc, says something about this day and age.. Not many people save money anymore..

Not only has 99.9 percent of people not put away that money what if your house doesn’t wait 30 years to burn?

 

[majorwager]

Take post 100 a step further.

Insurance cost is relative to coverage value. Use a round number of $1000./annual premium. If you remitted this premium for 50 or 60 years, Does that equal your home and contents values ??

NOT hardly, but you invested this money as time elapsed. Fine, but there have been at least 2 recent major market corrections that may well have reduced your investment substantially.

Bottom line, agree w/ post 100 above, if you require 100% financing, you are NOT likely in a position to forego insurance coverage. Independent solvency and a preferred credit score are NOT synonymous. Folks w/ true liquidity, pay cash and take the upfront cash discount. The advertised cash discount is NOT always the actual discount when the dealer realizes the buyer has other options.

I have some rather wealthy friends and associates. Over the years insurance discussions have surfaced in general conversation. NONE of those folks are self-insured. Maybe that indicates how they became wealthy in the first place. Minimize foolish and impulsive decisions.

 

[prof fate]

Well...you need to do ALL the math...

Using my girl friend's farm as an example. before me she hired out EVERYTHING. That meant snow plowing, brush hogging 20 acres of horse pasture, and some other odd jobs as needed.

So I bought a tractor for $22,500. It need oil/filters and of course, fuel. Figure that it's $4/hour for fuel/oil/filters.

Now my time has value..if I'm not doing this I could be making what? $18/hour, perhaps more. So the 30 hours it takes to hog all the fields $120 in consumables and 450ish in my time. She'd pay $700 ish for this, 3-4 times a year.
Plowing the drive was $75 typically. Takes me 1/2 hour or so, $11.

The bonus is all the other stuff we can do - pull fence posts, put in posts, trim tall trees, move brush piles, and on and on. things we'd pay for or more likely, just not do at all - or worse, do by hand! (post hols by hand..yuk)

Add in the cost of implements...bought most used, but $2500 ish is a guess.

How to put a "value" on having the tractor there...we're putting in a riding arena and using the scraped up dirt and clay to fill in low spots in /round the barn, re-sloped a hill that was too steep to mow on a tractor, move manure weekly instead of waiting for the brush hog guy to come with his tractor.

And also figure in the residual value of the tractor and implements when you go to sell them - so you get a net cost.

So far this year i've put 114 hours on the tractor in 3 months...and an easy 40 more to go - and i got it in early june...so 250 hours a year no problem, 2500 over 10 years. What is a 10 year old worth? $8k maybe more.

So 14,000 plus implenets..$2000 resale - 25k in, 16k out, 9k cost for 2500 hours, under $4/hour. Fuel/maint another $4, so $8/hour, plus your time (rent vs hire it out completely) if you out a value on it.

Renting a mini ex here for 4 hours is $220 (as of friday..I need to dig up something next week) or $320 for a day - so $32/hour (figure you'd run it 10 hours) plus fuel. Usually delivery and pickup is included.

The backhoe for my tractor is $7500..plus storage, finance fees perhaps..resale is what, $4k maybe. So $3500 to own it for 10 years, $350 a year, plus the hourly fuel of course - if I use it more than 10 hours a year it's probably worth owning it.

Not sure if you have looked at a bit of math to put it in perspective. Let痴 say it takes you 3 hours to dig a 6 stump on a SCUT W/BH that costs $10k. Let痴 assume to usable life is 3000 hrs. That is $3.33 per hour not including maintenance. So we have a cost of $10 to dig each stump. That is $500 plus 150 hours of your time. Rent a good sized mini ex and you can finish it in a weekend for less money. These numbers may vary, this is just an example. Please plug in your actual numbers to get a more accurate estimate.

Now if you don稚 mind 500 hours of play time on the SCUT, then you are good to go!

I have been struggling with the same type questions for my property and trying to do what makes the most sense financially and productively.

Maybe it would be best to rent a SCUT with BH and see how it works out. That $250 might answer a bunch of questions. I did and it helped a lot.

 

[majorwager]

Let's take a closer look at the fatalist's convoluted fiscal breakdown. Actually required 2 Excedrin to read the entire post. Look at this comparison.

Mike Morgan, You Tube channel " Outdoors w/ the Morgan's", has four compact tractors. Follow me here, one he owns, three are provided on trial for his use, at no cost, excluding fuel and fluids .

Two of the loaner tractors are equipped w/ backhoes, one a 55 hp model. Not sure if Mike's owned machine is hoe equipped? Mike lives in the general vicinity of the fatalist so geography is not an issue.

With the above/below verifiable in a video link below, when Mike had need to construct a new trail through his woods, He rented a tracked Excavator for the task. Mike has a long employment history in the heavy highway road construction industry, so he is no novice when selecting the right equipment for the task EVEN, when renting is the practical approach. The link appears below momentarily.

Actually there are five videos is this trail construction series #200 -#205 for curious folks. Below is # 200.
#2 How to Build a Trail Through The Forest! - YouTube

 

[prof fate]

The 'right' equipment makes work go faster, easier and safer. Sometimes renting is best - I CAN dig a basement with a shovel, but an excavator is much faster. And there is a point where one is too big for the job.

If you buy a tractor for 20k and use it 10 years and sell it for 10k, it cost you $1000/ year to own it - vs renting. With the cost of renting ($300/day say) it's soon apparent it's cheaper to own.

Cheaper...vs convenient..is a consideration for some. My girlfriend didn't WANT a tractor - the cost was only part of the issue - maintenance was a biggie as she does NONE of it - the hassle of hiring it out is a factor. Just talk to folks that get their car fixed..or not, as the case may be. I can pay for an oil change on my car or do it myself...cost diff isn't much, if any, with a coupon. BUT to drive there, wait, drive home is 45 min to an hour. I can do it at home in 15 min.

If you own the tractor you'll use it for many jobs it's maybe more efficient to rent..but you OWN it, so you use it. Like stuff more in your truck than maybe it should hold, or pack the car for a family vaca when a van would be more comfortable.

 

[atsah]

what if your house doesn稚 wait 30 years to burn?

I burn wood for primary heat and I have many critters trying to live in my house everyday, besides the fact NOTHING lasts forever, like wiring for an example.. No way would I risk not having homeowners insurance, I have worked WAY too hard for what I have to lose it to a freaking squirrel or mouse for that matter..

 

[paulfun9]

The problem with insurance is that ever since the law mandated that we can not have stated value policies the insurance companies steal more from us by inflating the risk factor, the value and the rebuild costs artificially and we have no alternative but to pay it.
If your willing to take the risk and invest the insurance costs you could be like some of us who have actually set aside more than enough to cover any loss and actually get paid dividends from the investments on a yearly basis.
Do the math carefully and weigh he risks but keep in mind that most never get paid a cent from thier home owners policy and those that do usually only see a drop in the bucket compared to what they pay in over thier life.

Please explain why I would be in trouble?
The reality is I would simply rebuild it with money that is already mine! The next fact is that the money aside would be enough to do it and still pay me dividends each year. What are the chances it will burn to the ground 3 times?

A younger family member is currently fighting with his insurance carrier because the are charging him for a 250,000 replacement policy that most people would not even question. The problem is the house can be replaced in its entirety for 150,000, which has been confirmed by the builder. So why let them rip you off every year?
It痴 a gamble in every direction and most are just to fearful and over extended to even begin to evaluate the true risks.
At my age and for the entire amount of years that my father and grandfather lived they never actually collected a payment from the homeowners policy. My father submitted one claim but it was denied and they raised his premium anyway!
If others want to be stolen from feel free, I don稚 and won稚.

 

[4570Man]

Please explain why I would be in trouble?
The reality is I would simply rebuild it with money that is already mine! The next fact is that the money aside would be enough to do it and still pay me dividends each year. What are the chances it will burn to the ground 3 times?

A younger family member is currently fighting with his insurance carrier because the are charging him for a 250,000 replacement policy that most people would not even question. The problem is the house can be replaced in its entirety for 150,000, which has been confirmed by the builder. So why let them rip you off every year?
Itç—´ a gamble in every direction and most are just to fearful and over extended to even begin to evaluate the true risks.
At my age and for the entire amount of years that my father and grandfather lived they never actually collected a payment from the homeowners policy. My father submitted one claim but it was denied and they raised his premium anyway!
If others want to be stolen from feel free, I don稚 and won稚.

Burning to the ground 3 times isn’t very likely. What if it burnt before you had enough money saved?

 

[atsah]

Please explain why I would be in trouble?
The reality is I would simply rebuild it with money that is already mine! The next fact is that the money aside would be enough to do it and still pay me dividends each year. What are the chances it will burn to the ground 3 times?

A younger family member is currently fighting with his insurance carrier because the are charging him for a 250,000 replacement policy that most people would not even question. The problem is the house can be replaced in its entirety for 150,000, which has been confirmed by the builder. So why let them rip you off every year?
Itç—´ a gamble in every direction and most are just to fearful and over extended to even begin to evaluate the true risks.
At my age and for the entire amount of years that my father and grandfather lived they never actually collected a payment from the homeowners policy. My father submitted one claim but it was denied and they raised his premium anyway!
If others want to be stolen from feel free, I don稚 and won稚.

You may have taken all the money that you would have paid for home owners insurance and put it into an account and still have it, most people don't do that..
And if they do, something will come up that they need the cash for.

 

[dnw64]

...I don't currently have homeowners...

"You pays your money and you takes your chances"