Best motorcycle forum?

[Trials]

Only since 1986

Considering many motorcycles don't even come with a warranty or are very poor at supporting their product when a claim is made, I find it difficult to hold it against a manufacture when they successfully stand behind the materials and workmanship in they products.

 

[Zerk]

Only since 1986 [ipg[/img]

Considering many motorcycles don't even come with a warranty or are very poor at supporting their product when a claim is made, I find it difficult to hold it against a manufacture when they successfully stand behind the materials and workmanship in they products.

Never heard of a motorcycle that did not come with a warranty. Have you really?

The problems seem to have started early 2000s.

One thing I point out to people, no matter the product, if you know they have good customer service, it is because they have a bad product. Best product you never know if it has a warranty.

 

[Trials]

None of my competition bikes came with a warranty, that would be 7 bikes to date, apparently there are a number of Chinese manufactured motorcycles that have no warranty and I tried to make a warranty claim for an 8$ part on a Suzuki once (speedometer cable). I had to argue with the dealership for near 2 hours to make good on it and I was installing it myself, so that was pretty much a 4$ wholesale part they didn't want to make good on. Actually that is the Only warrantied item that I ever did make good on in 50 years of riding motorcycles.

 

[Zerk]

All the major bike companies have warranties. Ya maybe Chinese bikes don't,but I wouldn't buy one. I try to avoid buying Chinese products in general. Not just because they can be junk, but I don't want to support China.

Of all the major companies, BMW has the worse reliability. You knew what I was talking about. You are the one bringing up all the the bikes having to be returned for failures.

It doesn't matter if the dealer makes you feel good about the failures, whatever bike that failes the most, has the worse reliability. Not hard to reason.

I used to want a BMW. The storage space on the RTs and LTs turned me off. Maybe a GS.

I have a concours, but it is such a rattle trap, and has failed me. When I brought all the problems they don't fix with them on ADV, they say that is how Kawaski is they don't fix things. But they rail on Harley, which does the same thing at times too. They get a pass. Going to sell, just been to lazy.

 

[Garandman]

HDForums.com is all about HD.

I mostly go to advrider.com, not the place if you are only interested in cruisers.

 

[Trials]

All the major bike companies have warranties. Ya maybe Chinese bikes don't,but I wouldn't buy one. I try to avoid buying Chinese products in general. Not just because they can be junk, but I don't want to support China.

Of all the major companies, BMW has the worse reliability. You knew what I was talking about. You are the one bringing up all the the bikes having to be returned for failures?.

You completely missed the part about competition bikes, even warranty's where they are expressed become void the moment you use a motorcycle for competition and none of my competition bikes were made in China they include Scorpa, Yamaha and Montesa products. By your metric any motorcycles used in competition don't count towards adding credibility to a manufacturers record of building reliable motorcycles, does that make any sense to you? Right off the top, if a manufacturer wins the Dakar Rally or blows the competition away at a 24 hour endurance race :/ you aren't going to count that, you are only concerned about a high number of successful warranty claims.

You asked for an explanation of why I was laughing and you got it. Yes I was indeed clarifying the metric you were referring to for the benefit of other readers.

In my experience my HRC Montesa's and my BMW have been by far the most reliable motorcycles that I have ever owned. Surely you aren't seriously going to contend that My BMW's proven reliability record doesn't count because my bike is 30 years old and still going strong on mostly original parts. I contend that your blanket statement "Of all the major companies, BMW has the worse reliability." is seriously flawed.

After all that, I have to ask what you consider to be a reliable motorcycle in your experience? and never mind the warranty nonsense, warranty's don't last as long as I expect my motorcycles should and generally do last.


P.S. please don't read this as a hostile response in any way, it wasn't intended to be argumentative. It's a beautiful day today for riding and working on motorcycles and I'm all good with that

 

[Trials]

HDForums.com is all about HD.

I mostly go to advrider.com, not the place if you are only interested in cruisers.

I think I agree with that, Adventure Rider looks like a great place to read or tell about what people are doing on their motorcycles. Probably not the best place to go ask a question.

 

[Zerk]

You completely missed the part about competition bikes, even warranty's where they are expressed become void the moment you use a motorcycle for competition and none of my competition bikes were made in China they include Scorpa, Yamaha and Montesa products. By your metric any motorcycles used in competition don't count towards adding credibility to a manufacturers record of building reliable motorcycles, does that make any sense to you? Right off the top, if a manufacturer wins the Dakar Rally or blows the competition away at a 24 hour endurance race :/ you aren't going to count that, you are only concerned about a high number of successful warranty claims.

You asked for an explanation of why I was laughing and you got it. Yes I was indeed clarifying the metric you were referring to for the benefit of other readers.

In my experience my HRC Montesa's and my BMW have been by far the most reliable motorcycles that I have ever owned. Surely you aren't seriously going to contend that My BMW's proven reliability record doesn't count because my bike is 30 years old and still going strong on mostly original parts. I contend that your blanket statement "Of all the major companies, BMW has the worse reliability." is seriously flawed.

After all that, I have to ask what you consider to be a reliable motorcycle in your experience? and never mind the warranty nonsense, warranty's don't last as long as I expect my motorcycles should and generally do last.


P.S. please don't read this as a hostile response in any way, it wasn't intended to be argumentative. It's a beautiful day today for riding and working on motorcycles and I'm all good with that

Your BMW is 30 years old. What does that have to do with state of BMW now?

If one bike wins a race, it is a testament to performance, not reliability. Also the rider. I think the percentage of bike that need to be brought back to dealer due to failure, as good measurement of reliability.

A company can have one bike go million miles and thousand go 100, and will say they quality control problem. I don't know how you can't.


As for warranties, I did not miss you had 7 bikes without warranties. You said there were competition bikes. Off the floor bike all have warranties. How well there customer service is varies.

 

[Trials]

...
Of all the major companies, BMW has the worse reliability.

I have a concours, but it is such a rattle trap, and has failed me....

Your BMW is 30 years old. What does that have to do with state of BMW now?....

Only that my BMW is apparently proving to be more reliable then your Kawasaki long after the warranty has expired. I guess you should have bought a K100 instead.

 

[Trials]

Would I buy another BMW today? Yes I would, but I recently bought an MV Agusta so my wife would not be very impressed.

 

[Zerk]

Only that my BMW is apparently proving to be more reliable then your Kawasaki long after the warranty has expired. I guess you should have bought a K100 instead.

The Concours since it 2001 may be more reliable then a 2001 BMW. Not sure if they were still good or not at that point.

I don't care if the dealership makes me a steak dinner and sends the part girl over when they are fixining my bike. Either way it is a failure. I call it reliability, maybe you could call it bad quality control. But if the bike has to go back to the dealer for warranty work, I call that bad. Not sure why you don't. I am not talking 30 year old bikes with all the bugs worked out. I am talking new bike that fail, and have to be returned.

I think Harley has a similar problem last few years too, they have been getting cheaper. I havent followed it lately, but about the same time BMW started failing Harley started cheaping out and having warranty problems. Like BMW once you get the bugs worked out, they go forever. What has steered me back to Harley is the stories I have heard about working on the newer BMWs.

The older airheads were simplier. I would maybe consider one, but if I got a BMW I kind of want performance, not a 30 year outdated bike. Also the storage on the touring bikes sucks. GLs are probably king there. The new Vics though have alot of space, as do the dresser Harleys. I like big bikes with lots of storage for groceries.


But you can't have to many bikes. Though I may go down to 2 this year.

 

[Garandman]

I think I agree with that, Adventure Rider looks like a great place to read or tell about what people are doing on their motorcycles. Probably not the best place to go ask a question.

It's a GREAT place to ask questions, but for someone only interested in a cruiser-style, they're not going to like the answers. It's a form-follow-function kind of place, while the cruiser market is mostly about style.

The Face Plant forum there is terrific. People write post-mortems on their motorcycle accidents. You can learn a great deal about what not to do, why protective gear works and wat doesn't, and what training or techniques are effective at staying out of an accident in the first place.

There are some tragic posts (a guy who got hit from behind on a bike with a top case, that broke his back) and some hilarious ones, like the guy who hit a burro going 65mph two-up and slid 150+ yards on his side, wearing his safety gear down to threads.

Face Plant | Adventure Rider

And the "Perfect Line and other myths" forum is about riding techniques that apply to any bike.

The Perfect Line and Other Riding Myths | Adventure Rider

I had an HD Roadster for a while and HDForums was pretty good for things like parts and maintenance. For sample, the 2005 I had has a tendency to launch the $110 oil cover at highway speeds. They suggested replacing it with a 2007 cover, which had better clips, and using some cable ties to help keep it in place as well.

 

[Garandman]

Only since 1986

Considering many motorcycles don't even come with a warranty or are very poor at supporting their product when a claim is made, I find it difficult to hold it against a manufacture when they successfully stand behind the materials and workmanship in they products.

Those K bikes are crazy durable. I belong to a BMW club (though I don't own one) and there are lots of them with over 100,000 miles. They're also very inexpensive used.

 

[Garandman]

The older airheads were simplier. I would maybe consider one, but if I got a BMW I kind of want performance, not a 30 year outdated bike.//

I rode a BMW S1000RR at NJMP in track day sessions and was backing off at 145mph on the straight: the fast guys were hitting up to 160. Fast enough for you?

BMW has a whole series of bikes using detuned versions of the [199hp] S1000RR power plant, as well as six cylinder, 160hp K1600's, and the boxer 1200's are now water-cooled and have up to 125hp.

It's fair to say BMW's are expensive or complicated (or sophisticated), but to say they lack performance against any other brand is hard to defend. They also come with three year, 36,000 mile warranties.

BMW has recorded record sales for more than nine consecutive quarters and new success in the US. Perhaps the US market is finally moving on from chrome barges.

BTW I've owned six different brands of bike and currently own three brands, none BMW, so no dog in the fight. The only major brand I haven't owned is Ducati. My primary street bike at the moment is a Triumph and dirt bike, Yamaha.

 

[Trials]

...
It's fair to say BMW's are expensive or complicated (or sophisticated), but to say they lack performance against any other brand is hard to defend. They also come with three year, 36,000 mile warranties...

Oh, oh, that could spell big trouble for the brands reliability statistics, imagine all the additional warranty claims they would accumulate as a result of having a warranty that is 3 or more times longer then the competition :laughing:

 

[Trials]

It's a GREAT place to ask questions...

OK, you convinced me to join the forum for riders obsessed with really big luggage :dumptruck:

 

[Gary Fowler]

I thought they moved production some 3rd world Asian country.

I wouldn't call Japan a third world country. Honda did move their production of their flagship model Goldwing from the USA to Japan after decades of building it in the USA. (Reason not clear for the move)

 

[Zerk]

I wouldn't call Japan a third world country. Honda did move their production of their flagship model Goldwing from the USA to Japan after decades of building it in the USA. (Reason not clear for the move)

I don't think they moved to Japan. I read at the time they moved GL production Cambodia or Thailand.

I rode a BMW S1000RR at NJMP in track day sessions and was backing off at 145mph on the straight: the fast guys were hitting up to 160. Fast enough for you?
p..

I didn't say speed, I said technoogy. If I got BMW I'd like one with ABS or modern braking, modern suspension, ect.


My interest is mostly touring bikes. I like alot of bikes, but not enough to spend money on them. I was looking DS for awhile, but bought a side by side.

Can't have to many bikes, so not saying I would never have one.

 

[Trials]

I find it hard to imagine Honda ever moving production of its all time largest motorcycle to Cambodia :|

There would be zero local market, they would need to import 100% of the machinery and high tech parts then export 100% of the product. I think Mr.Honda is much smarter then that.

Wikipedia says they are made in Kikuchi, Kumamoto Japan since 2011, I find that slightly more believable.

 

[Zerk]

I find it hard to imagine Honda ever moving production of its all time largest motorcycle to Cambodia :|

There would be zero local market, they would need to import 100% of the machinery and high tech parts then export 100% of the product. I think Mr.Honda is much smarter then that.

China makes alot of stuff, that it sells outside of China.

We disagree on logic deductions quite a bit. Putting up funny pictures, doesn't make a logical arguement. Though maybe it made mine. They were lookig for cheap labor.