B series AC question

[dsb5610]

Yellowdogsvc,

The drain tube on the 'A' is located on the drivers side of the boom lift cylinder. I did not have to remove the skid pan that goatman mentioned to get to the tube but I did remove it to clean the debris from it as well. Not easy to get to but you should be able to slide your hand in next to the cylinder and feel around for the tube. The end of the tube is almost flush with the floorpan. It is not very big and has a closed end similar to the drain on your air filter. I was able to get a long screwdriver in mine and work it around. I did get out some dirt and a few dribbles of water.

Hope that helps.

dsb

 

[jmfox]

Where is this water coming from? Is it condenser discharge or condensation?

jmf

 

[Willl]

OK I'll bite, what is "condenser discharge" ?

 

[jmfox]

Air conditioning cools by removing air bourne humidity via condensation coils (condenser) which discharge (water) outside of the air conditioned space. You might notice moisture puddle under the vehicle when you park your air conditioned car. It wouldn't make sense to put the moisture into the space you are trying to cool.

jmf

 

[Willl]

Wrong.

A/C cools by removing heat from the air through the evaporator.

Warm air can hold more water than cool air.

During heat removal, the water collects on the evaporator fins till there's enough to flow down to the collector tray/pan.


The 'condenser' coil is the warm/hot one. If you were following the refrigerant flow, it's directly after the compressor.

 

[dsb5610]

hahaha, some of these posts are perty funny.

I had a chance to run the Toolcat for a while today. Before I did I took a q-tip bent in half and rubber banded it to the end of the long screwdriver. I was able to use this to further clean out the drain tube. After running for a while I let it sit for a bit and watched it drip water. I will add this to my regular grease maintenance steps. Figure I have to slide under the Toolcat to grease the bottom of the boom cylinder so while I am there it won't take much to clear the drain tube.

dsb

 

[jmfox]

Wrong.

Air is warm because of the thermal conductivity of the suspender water molecules, but indeed it is more than a dehumidifier. Here is an explanation of humidity relative to the air conditioning process from Wiki:

Refrigeration air conditioning equipment usually reduces the humidity of the air processed by the system. The relatively cold (below the dewpoint) evaporator coil condenses water vapor from the processed air, (much like an ice cold drink will condense water on the outside of a glass), sending the water to a drain and removing water vapor from the cooled space and lowering the relative humidity. Since humans perspire to provide natural cooling by the evaporation of perspiration from the skin, drier air (up to a point) improves the comfort provided.

It would be difficult to decrease the temperature of the water molecules and keep them in suspension/vapor. If not the process of air conditioning, a decrease in humidity is necessary and a sought after benefit. Lowering the humidity to 40% to 60% relative humidity is what we expect from a comfortable environment. For purposes here this is the source of the condenser discharge/water.

jmf

 

[Willl]

Air is warm because of the thermal conductivity of the suspender water molecules, but indeed it is more than a dehumidifier. Here is an explanation of humidity relative to the air conditioning process from Wiki:

Refrigeration air conditioning equipment usually reduces the humidity of the air processed by the system. The relatively cold (below the dewpoint) evaporator coil condenses water vapor from the processed air, (much like an ice cold drink will condense water on the outside of a glass), sending the water to a drain and removing water vapor from the cooled space and lowering the relative humidity. Since humans perspire to provide natural cooling by the evaporation of perspiration from the skin, drier air (up to a point) improves the comfort provided.

It would be difficult to decrease the temperature of the water molecules and keep them in suspension/vapor. If not the process of air conditioning, a decrease in humidity is necessary and a sought after benefit. Lowering the humidity to 40% to 60% relative humidity is what we expect from a comfortable environment. For purposes here this is the source of the condenser discharge/water.

jmf

And all this takes place in the condenser coil ?

 

[yellowdogsvc]

Yellowdogsvc,

The drain tube on the 'A' is located on the drivers side of the boom lift cylinder. I did not have to remove the skid pan that goatman mentioned to get to the tube but I did remove it to clean the debris from it as well. Not easy to get to but you should be able to slide your hand in next to the cylinder and feel around for the tube. The end of the tube is almost flush with the floorpan. It is not very big and has a closed end similar to the drain on your air filter. I was able to get a long screwdriver in mine and work it around. I did get out some dirt and a few dribbles of water.

Hope that helps.

dsb

This may help tremendously. i will keep you all posted. Thanks!

 

[yellowdogsvc]

hahaha, some of these posts are perty funny.

I had a chance to run the Toolcat for a while today. Before I did I took a q-tip bent in half and rubber banded it to the end of the long screwdriver. I was able to use this to further clean out the drain tube. After running for a while I let it sit for a bit and watched it drip water. I will add this to my regular grease maintenance steps. Figure I have to slide under the Toolcat to grease the bottom of the boom cylinder so while I am there it won't take much to clear the drain tube.

dsb

I have been using ramps to get under there with my creeper. I will look on my b series and see if it is the same. Makes sense.

 

[jmfox]

And all this takes place in the condenser coil ?

For purposes of resolving the presence of water in the TC cab, I think the fact that liquid water is a byproduct of air conditioning is all we need to know. I trust the condenser and discharge are mounted outside the cab, so the water must be caused by uncirculated/trapped warm air in the cab that is cooled/dehumidified outside of the AC process. If this is the case a strategically placed circulation fan in the cab would disperse the pockets of air and keep any rain clouds from forming in the cockpit.

jmf

 

[radman1]

jmfox
I think you maybe using the wrong terminology. This is why Willl is stating your are wrong. The condensor coli is the hot/heat exchange coil located near the radiator and is on the high pressure side. The evaporator is the cooling coil located near the cab/interior. The cold evaporator coil results in the "condensation" and water formation. I suspect the drainage from the evaporator coil is blocked and therefore running into the toolcat cab.

 

[jmfox]

Yes, I am referring to the condenser and evaporator as a single process. These components should be distinguished, this is why it is good to do your homework kids. The evaporator on my Red Dot system is mounted on the roof and drains down the outside of the back window. Where is the drain on the TC and what is it about its design that allows it to be exposed to junk and backup into the cab? There seems to be a pattern here with TC radiators/evaporators that are designed to collect junk.

jmf

jmfox
I think you maybe using the wrong terminology. This is why Willl is stating your are wrong. The condensor coli is the hot/heat exchange coil located near the radiator and is on the high pressure side. The evaporator is the cooling coil located near the cab/interior. The cold evaporator coil results in the "condensation" and water formation. I suspect the drainage from the evaporator coil is blocked and therefore running into the toolcat cab.

 

[yellowdogsvc]

I found the drain tube. Using a shop light I found it near the boom lift cylinder base. It was clogged with what appeared to be paint chips and some debris. I used the end of a welding rod to poke around. when the debris came out, it was followed by a steady stream of cold water. I think I found the reason why my cab has been leaking water and according to the first owner, leaking from day 1. It didn't look like it had ever dripped.
Thank you all for your help.

 

[yellowdogsvc]

Well, I have the AC draining but now the condenser behind the in cab filter froze over. It was very humid out but I think it may be my in cab filter has seen better days. I have cleaned it numerous times but it was so used to being wet and sticky, that I don't think it lets much air pass through. I am hoping i don't have a freon leak or a thermostat problem. Anyone else have this happen?

 

[radman1]

Your on the right track. Probably not enough air flow in the air box and high humidity resulted in the freezing. Change the filter and run the fan faster and the A/C control on a warmer setting.

 

[yellowdogsvc]

Our humidity levels have been at 70% + most of the summer which has been tough on all my machines cooling. I'll try what you suggested and see if that helps.

 

[goatman 1]

dsb
My deales says I have one of the earliest A models and that is why my drains are under the plate on the bottom of the cab. He says that there was a bulletin for a relocation of the drain to the area yours is to "improve" drainage. Must not be a perfect fix, huh?
goatman

 

[yellowdogsvc]

still tough to get to the drain. I think they should have just had a tube that ran out the cab. Could have had a hard line against fender wall.

 

[dsb5610]

goatman,

Yours sounds like it is more protected but harder to get too. Would be nice if it was accessible from inside the cab where the filter slides in.

I have not seen any water in my cab so the drain must be keeping up. When it's really humid out I get condensation on the outside of my windshield and have to run the wipers intermittently. The A/C will freeze you out of the cab though.

dsb