Anyone here give comments on 461 or 471 MF tractor

[jimmysisson]

I also thought the top link kicked the drive out so the tractor wouldn't rear over backwards like the old steel-wheel Fordsons did. There's lots of stories about a plow hanging up on a rock or stump and the tractor continuing to try to move forward and rearing up. And killing the operator, maybe. So the Ferguson 3-point was a safety invention also. Also, just having 3 points to hook up was a big improvement over a drawbar or two points, since the implement raises up parallel. My 2¢. Jim

 

[TractorTodd]

Southernman, I'm glad you like your tractor. It is a good value for the dollar. I operate two masseys(360 4wd and 3060) on a regular basis. They are good tractors.

Lets talk about the Ferguson & Gear pump. That is not a pump. It is refering to the tandem gear pump that operates the steering and auxiliary hydraulics and the ferguson pump that operates the 3pt hitch. You can combine both pumps for auxiliary hydraulics but not the 3pt hitch.

The 3pt hitch on your tractor does utilize the toplink to control draft. The spring and other components are in the lift cover just like the original design.

The following is a paragraph from AGCOs Massey Ferguson USA website describing the 400 series tractors.

<font color="red"> Sixty years later the Massey Ferguson 400 series still use a very familiar 3 Point Hitch that has come to be known as the Ferguson System.

<font color="black"> The Ferguson System is only mentioned on the 400 series tractors. It is not available on the other series and yet they all have 3pt hitches.

The Ferguson System 3pt hitch has not been able to keep up with the demands of todays farming needs. That is why it is only available on the economy series.

 

[Bob_Skurka]

This thread has me more confused than any I have ever seen. Todd, can you post a photo of an old Ferguson system and a new one?

 

[JerryG]

The best description of the Ferguson systems development that I have found comes for the other side of the pond. It's about half way down the page. Ferguson Society
Also see the "1948" heading at the bottom of the page.

 

[JerryG]

Jim,
Here is a good reference about keeping the front of the tractor down. Ferguson System Principal and Theory of Operation

 

[spb1971]

To keep it real simple. The "Ferguson System" was the 3-point hitch invention that used draft control through top link sensing. These tractors also used the "Ferguson Belly Pump" and several MF tractors still use them today. In fact, it is the most reliable 3-point pump there is. It is a simple and proven design. When you combine flow as mentioned earlier, you are combining the flow of the belly pump and auxillary pump, if so equipped. This only combines the flow to the auxillary not the 3 point hitch. So yes, all tractors that have a 3 point hitch derived from the "Ferguson System". Some now use lower link sensing, some use top link and some have no draft at all.

 

[JerryG]

Good summary and it has changed some over the years.

 

[Sprigman]

I actually have a 471, 4wd, fel, shuttle shift, etc. I must first comment on some of these "issues", than I'll give my honest impression to the gentleman who started the thread.

The top link has NO "draft" control sensor (so I don't understand the comment about "compression force exerted through a spring in the top link")..as far as the ferguson system being outdated - every line of tractor utilizes the ferguson system in one form or another --- let me restate --- EVERY tractor line. How many tractors don't have a 3 pt hitch? That is a Ferguson invention...

Now if you are talking about the pumps, then perhaps that is where you should focus your comments. And if 5-10 GPM more than many competitors is outdated, then perhaps I am in an alternate universe. The pump system is called Ferguson & Gear, and is utilized by many major manufacturers, such as McCormick, Farmtrac, AGCO of course, and others..

As far as my impressions of the 471 - I have over 100 hrs of hard use on it, and found little to complain about...that pumping system, when running my FEL, will pick up 6,000+ pounds to a height of just above the hood (I have a combining valve installed). Pretty good for a 60 pto hp tractor. I have carried 5X6 rolls of hay all over the place, with spears on both the 3pt hitch and the fel. If this tractor wouldn't pick em up, I wouldn't have it. The perkins 1104 is superb, as others I have had. And the shuttle is outstanding...

Now the gripes: no hydraulic oil cooler (most tractors don't have one though); pto lever is mechanical, which requires adjustment as necessary; no cupholder ....

I would suggest, that for the power and price, it's a pretty darn good bargain.

I need plow points for a MH-62 (Massey Harris) 3-bottom moldboard. Any ideas?