any downside to hst?

massiveSnow · Jul 7, 2006

I really appreciate everyone's responses -- they are quite helpful. No one has mentioned reliability or long term durability so I assume there are virtually no problems with either system in terms of breakdowns or durability?

JimR · Jul 7, 2006

My 27 horse Cub Cadet has almost 2700 hours on it now. I bought it used and was told it has never been apart. I work it like a dog and the driveline has been trouble free so far.

Bob_Skurka · Jul 7, 2006

massiveSnow said:
I really appreciate everyone's responses -- they are quite helpful. No one has mentioned reliability or long term durability so I assume there are virtually no problems with either system in terms of breakdowns or durability?

My oldest HST is 6 years old. No repairs of any kind.

Some of the "die hard" gear folks will say that HST costs more to repair and that is why they don't buy them. I think most of them are the same folks who still hand crank their windows in their cars because they think power windows are just another gimmick that will break and cost money to repair.

And I'm sure they will cost more money to repair IF they ever break. Its just not happened to me or to anyone I know.

MossRoad · Jul 7, 2006

massiveSnow said:
No one has mentioned reliability or long term durability so I assume there are virtually no problems with either system in terms of breakdowns or durability?

Last winter I sent my late 70's International 2500B to the scrapper... (Farewell old friend! ) He offered more for it than I could sell it outright for. I got rid of it because it was too big for my needs. The HST tranny was working fine. It had thousands of hours on it. I owned it for 14 or 15 years and never had a problem with the tranny... the distributor shaft broke, the carb would gum up, the block was leaking antifreeze into the oil, the pins on the FEL arms wore holes in the frame, the draft control chattered, the steering rusted shut so it would only go forward and backward, the hydraulic hoses blew, the bucket cracked a few times and I couldn't shut off the cab heater....

The HST tranny outlasted the rest of the tractor.

michiglenn · Jul 7, 2006

On my John Deere the cruise control will hold a constant speed if desired. The optional "Speedmatch" will hold the speed up or down hills within a couple of tenths MPH (digital speedo). I normally use it for brushhogging large fields.

FamilyFarm · Jul 8, 2006

My first HST was the BX22 and it was an easy choice as there were no other sub-compact TLB units available then and it only came as HST

When I bought the L5030, I drove GST models and shuttle shift M series tractors. I liked them all and seriously considered them as possibilities. I understand many people like them for loader work, but after using the little BX for 4 years, I know how easy loader work is with the HST. I also have boys that are learning to drive and operate tractors. For them HST is a real plus. It allows them to focus more on learning the implement operation and safety issues IMHO.

john_bud · Jul 8, 2006

There is one "pro" of the HST that I didn't see mentioned yet.

It is the easiest for hooking up attachments. There is nothing like being able to go 1/4" back or forward. My gear tractor has a 50% underdrive/overdrive and in super low, it is still a pain to go back slow and stop on the exact spot. This may not apply if the attachments are light, but a 1200# cutter or 950# box blade is no fun to move around into position!

Also, the ability to drive into a pile of dirt, slow down without loosing traction and power the bucket full is priceless. I can move about 25% more dirt in the same time with a 10 cubic foot bucket on my HST tractor than on my gear tractor with a 20 cubic foot bucket.

jb

chrisjbell · Jul 9, 2006

My own tractor is HST, but I use a couple of different gear tractors at one of my jobs. One thing I didn't see mentioned here is that when working on hills, HST offers some real benefits over gear drive. I don't worry at all about getting close to an obsticle or near a hazard with my HST, but the "pucker factor" can get a bit high when I have a manual tractor in a sticky spot.

Soundguy · Jul 9, 2006

Bob_Skurka said:
On the other hand, for tasks like lawn mowing, ...Others will have different opinions!

I'm pretty happy with a gear tranny for mowing. Put her in gear.. let out on the clutch and mow... when done, aim for home and reach down and kill the pto on the way...

Soundguy

fish_wisperer · Jul 9, 2006

im not quite sure how an hst works but it sounds like a hydrolic pump running a hydrolic motor, to me that sounds like a perfect transmission, if you need more power get a bigger engine and enjoy the user freindly hst transmission. my tractor dont have one because its too big but it would be nice. i think hydrolic motor power is limited or they would offer it on the bigger machines, but if your going under 35hp go hst.

Theowegian · Jul 9, 2006

As GeneD14 pointed out, the only downside to my hydrostatic transmission is that if you plow, i.e. mouldboard plow (not snow plow), then the hydro is not as desireable as a gear tractor. Actually, any groundbreaking equipment like springtooth, planting, disking, chisel plowing, i.e. any traditional farming activities, seem to work better with a gear tractor. Or maybe it is psychological?

BUT, the hydrostat excels when using a front end loader, box blading, mowing, finish or bush hogging.

Obtw, I DO mouldboard plow one acre and use a four row planter, too with my 31 hp hydo tractor and it works fine. I just miss my Allis D14 for those chores!

also, the comparison to stick shift and automatic cars is a pretty good one.
My family says, "Why would anyone drive a stick shift when you can drive an automatic?" And to that I say, because a stick is more funner....!

JimR · Jul 9, 2006

Many have stated that a gear tractor is best for plowing fields and such. My farmer friend has farmed his entire. A few years ago he bought a very big John Deere tractor that is loaded, ac, radio, fully enclosed cab and so on. I just found out yesterday that this tractor is an HST. I never would have expected him to buy such a machine as he has always had a standard shift. I'll have to ask him why he went HST this time. I think this is a 90 horsepower 4wd tractor.

JerryG · Jul 9, 2006

JimR said:
Many have stated that a gear tractor is best for plowing fields and such. My farmer friend has farmed his entire. A few years ago he bought a very big John Deere tractor that is loaded, ac, radio, fully enclosed cab and so on. I just found out yesterday that this tractor is an HST. I never would have expected him to buy such a machine as he has always had a standard shift. I'll have to ask him why he went HST this time. I think this is a 90 horsepower 4wd tractor.

Jim ask your neighbor what transmission he has. The 91hp 5525 has a 24 speed PowerReverser and the 95 hp 7720 has an IVT. JD doesn’t offer an HST in anything larger than a compact and never has. A person could believe that either one of these manual transmissions were a HST by the way in which they operate.

lawn_king · Jul 9, 2006

The new hydros dont whine nearly as much as the older models, we own a fairly new (6 months old) B3030 hsdc. After break in and the full 50 hr service the only whine at all is in high range. For our application hydro is the only way to go. We may be brush hogging monday, digging & loading tuesday, york raking wendsday and perhaps fertilizing & spraying the rest of the week. Having owned several tractors over the years (kubota & international) We would never own another gear, glide shift perhaps, but not a true gear.

AutoUnionTypeC · Jul 9, 2006

My family says, "Why would anyone drive a stick shift when you can drive an automatic?" And to that I say, because a stick is more funner....!

Indeed!!!

I agree, but not only is it funner but more efficient too. It goes hand and hand with the power loss. To achieve the same amount of work done with a HST figure on burning 10% more fuel +/-, then with a gear tractor. To my mind the time to throw away efficiency for mere convenience is long past. That is, if there was ever a time.

Regards, Jamie

Dargo · Jul 9, 2006

AutoUnionTypeC said:
Indeed!!!

I agree, but not only is it funner but more efficient too. It goes hand and hand with the power loss. To achieve the same amount of work done with a HST figure on burning 10% more fuel +/-, then with a gear tractor. To my mind the time to throw away efficiency for mere convenience is long past. That is, if there was ever a time.

Regards, Jamie

Yeah, standard shift cars with no A/C are more efficient as well. They are known as "hog legs with heaters" in the business. The time has long passed where there is any desirability or resale value in a loss leader that has no creature comforts. If you are concerned about the loss in power to drive a hydro, buy more hp. Duh! If it makes you happy, I not only have a hydro tractor, but I enjoy mowing while sitting in air conditioned comfort without bugs bothering me or getting covered in trimmings or dirt.

Oh, I forgot, I've also pulled a 3 bottom 16" plow all day long, hammer down in four wheel drive and standing on the differential lock, without any issues at all. I'm in the camp that says that it's an old wife's tale that gear is better than hydro for any ground engauging items. Four hours non-stop pulling at full capacity on a 90 degree day with the A/C on and the temp gauge only got 1/4 the way into the green.

MossRoad · Jul 9, 2006

AutoUnionTypeC said:
not only is it funner but more efficient too. It goes hand and hand with the power loss. To achieve the same amount of work done with a HST figure on burning 10% more fuel +/-, then with a gear tractor. To my mind the time to throw away efficiency for mere convenience is long past. That is, if there was ever a time.

Regards, Jamie

Time VS money.... I'td be a good bet that an HST equipped tractor will outwork a similar GEAR equipped tractor in typical homeowner use. That is, it will get the jobs done faster, using my time more efficiently. That time can then be spent doing important things, like catching bugs with the kids.

The few extra $$ spent on fuel and maintenance are far outweighed by the massive time savings the HST offers me for the tasks I do.

Dargo · Jul 9, 2006

MossRoad said:
That time can then be spent doing important things, like catching bugs with the kids.

You got a good point there. My 9 year old daughter has gotten the fishing fever bad lately. The sooner I can get my work finished, the sooner I can spend time with my 5 kids. (Yes, I really do have 5) Time that has passed can never be recovered, and we only have so much time. Hmm, maybe that's why I only sleep a few hours a night...

AutoUnionTypeC · Jul 9, 2006

Yeah, standard shift cars with no A/C are more efficient as well. They are known as "hog legs with heaters" in the business. The time has long passed where there is any desirability or resale value in a loss leader that has no creature comforts.

Well I drive a manual shift VW, New Beetle TDi, it has air conditioning but I only run it to keep it charged. Don't know what else to say, except.....................Got 50 MPG?

Dargo · Jul 9, 2006

AutoUnionTypeC said:
Well I drive a manual shift VW, New Beetle TDi, it has air conditioning but I only run it to keep it charged. Don't know what else to say, except.....................Got 50 MPG?

I guess we are both happy; my pickup is a 445 hp diesel with over 1000 ft. lbs. of torque and weighs almost 8000 pounds. I can tow a 15,000 pound trailer over 100 mph. Don't pull out in front of me.