Ant hill?

[Richard]

I stumbled onto something today and made me curious.

First, a bit of background to help understand why I'm confused.

Let's say about 5 years ago, we had the farm timbered. There was an area where they did all the cutting/loading of the timber (staging area??). This area was cleared flat to give them operating room. It's say, 500' off the road into the woods. The actual distance is not important as much as the relative distances.

Since this area was cleared out, they left and it has grown up VERY VERY thick. So thick it's almost impossible to get through without all those little thorny bushes hacking you to death.

Other day, father in law told me he heard some 4-wheelers back there (this is almost behind the houses) and I guess he saw them when he went down the road as he told me he yelled to them this was private property and they buzzed on down the road.

Today I was coming home from the co-op and for some reason, had a thought to walk down this path that they made.

Went to the top of the hill (500' in where the machinery use to be) About got hacked with all the overgrowth and stuff, but follwed their tracks.

The tracks went on a couple thousand MORE feet, WELL into the woods and actually almost behind my father in laws house.

So, we seem to have some punks who are not only trespassing but trying to make trails on the farm.

On this trail, I happened to find a plastic bag. Looked at it and it was a bag of topsoil.

That brought me back to the mound of dirt I saw about 20' prior to seeing the bag. Mound of dirt defined as possibly the contents of the bag having been dumped in a mound, 18/24 inches across.

Went to look at the mound and had a feeling in the back of my head to just kick it... then a stronger feeling to NOT do that.

Happened that there is a little sapling growing through this dirt so I just grabbed the sapling and rotated it, letting it sort of scrape the dirt around.

What I saw was darn near amazing.

Just under the top skin layer of dirt were THOUSANDS and THOUSANDS and THOUSANDS of eggs along with thousands of ants that came scrambling to the top with all the commotion going on.

I've heard of some kind of ant (that is to be mildly feared?) that builds a large dirt mound on top of the ground.

I don't know if that kind of ant makes it this far north, I've never seen an ant mound larger than a 1/2 tube of toothpaste.

So, are these ants the nasty ants to be feared? did they make the mound, or might the mound be that bag of topsoil that one of these trespassers dumped there and some 'generic' ants made their home in the nice pile of dirt?

had I not found the empty bag of topsoil, I would have concluded the mound had to be dug by the ants, as it is, I simply do not know.

If it is that nasty ant that makes mounds, is there a way to kill the nest? I don't really want to go back there but I will if I can put gas/diesel/my wifes cooking or something as deadly on it

Should I try to kill the nest regardless of what kind of ants they are?

I have never in my life, seen so many thousands of eggs just mixed in with the soil, much like chocolate chips inside cookie dough however it seemed there was 1 egg for every 10 piece of soil... and the zillions of ants that came storming out... other than the Science Channel or the old movie Helstrom Chronicle, I've never seen so many ants at one time.

made me keep my distance and in fact, decide to leave the area immediately.

So, any thoughts as to battle plan(s)?

 

[Jimbrown]

Sounds like fire ants. You need to do a google and read several articles to be sure. here is one Fire Ants

 

[Richard]

Fire ants...I guess that's the name I was looking for. Prior to you mentioning that, I was thinking "carpenter ants" thank you for clearing that up.

I've done some reading and some of the descriptions I read (paraphrased) "scrape the dirt and you will see white larva, that's the brood" as well as "if you molest the nest, the ants will come to the top via vertical shafts" and "the ant mound will be "X" size and NO apparent hole/opening in the center as with other ant mounds"

All seem to fit exactly what I saw. hmm... guess more research and then find out what to do. perhaps if I was lucky, they nibbled on some of those trespassers!!

 

[MSWoodlot]

Fire ants are a real pest the further South you go. Their mounds are troublesome when the ants invade your yard during mowing season--hard on equipment. Although gasoline and diesel will kill fire ants, the recommended control is a product called Amdro.

Fire Ant Killer and Lawn Weed Killer: Powerful Fire Ant Killers by Amdro and Tough Lawn Weed Killers by Image

MSWoodlot

 

[Bird]

Fire ants move those little white eggs up and down inside the mound with temperature changes, so sometimes they're very near the surface; other times down quite deep. I just "treated" 4 mounds today in one of my daughter's yards by mixing about a gallon of insecticide and pouring it slowly on the mound so it has time to soak in and/or flow down the tunnels the ants have made.

 

[wushaw]

Fireants in Tennesse? It must be warm there right now. A queen must have floated there and that mound is what you get with one queen.
The mound is an incubator for eggs, when the temp and humidity is right there will be eggs in the mound part.
If you can kill the mound...do it.... Fireants are predators and will kill/eat anything that won't eat them first.
I use Spectricide in the bag, it works good when there are eggs in the mound, I will upset the mound and pour the pesticide on the eggs and the eggs and Queens are the most important things to the mound so when all the workers come to retrive the eggs they get a good sampling of poison and 50% of the time the mound will die....I know this is not the method most use but I like it.

 

[Richard]

I'll try to take a picture of it tomorrow. My guess is, they've already fixed the damage I caused.

I'll go back (carefully now) and take a pic of the mound, then I'll wiggle it again with the sapling and unearth the top layer, I'll try to get another pic and then skedattle out of there!

is this something I should 'report' to some agencie that might want to try to control these little buggers or just try to kill the mound & move on?

 

[swiftboot]

Richard, i would suggest getting some acephate 97%, comes uder different brands like orthene etc. Sprinkle some of the powder or granules around the ant bed about two feet out and all over the top of bed. Approximately two tablespoonsful. You can get it at most feed and seed and hardware stores. Fire ants are common all over pastures here in Fl and that seems to do the trick better than anything i have tried. Its about $16.00 for a pint sized container. It smells really bad but the workers take it to the queen and kills the colony. I wouldnt think anyone would bring ants to your property unless they were not playing with a full deck. More than likely, they may have planted some reefer out in your woods ergo the potting soil. I am sure your extension agent and sheriffs ofc would be interested in knowing what you found. Keep us posted on the results. chuck

 

[jinman]

I'll try to take a picture of it tomorrow. My guess is, they've already fixed the damage I caused.

I'll go back (carefully now) and take a pic of the mound, then I'll wiggle it again with the sapling and unearth the top layer, I'll try to get another pic and then skedattle out of there!

is this something I should 'report' to some agencie that might want to try to control these little buggers or just try to kill the mound & move on?

I would notify the local agricultural extension service (we call them "County Agents" in Texas). They would have information on ants moving into your area and might actually do a survey and treatment. If that doesn't work, there are numerous fire ant poisons, but none of them do much more than cause the fire ants to move their mounds to another location. The latest technology looks like a virus that can actually kill them off in a 2-month time.

 

[DocHeb]

There are ant mounds that come from species other than fire ants.

 

[shvl73]

Mound of dirt defined as possibly the contents of the bag having been dumped in a mound, 18/24 inches across.

I've found some here in NH of similar size,maybe 6-8" high. No idea what kind of ant but, they don't seem to like my Woods cutter. Really bogs the tractor down when I hit one.

 

[Richard]

More than likely, they may have planted some reefer out in your woods ergo the potting soil. I am sure your extension agent and sheriffs ofc would be interested in knowing what you found. Keep us posted on the results. chuck

Well, I gotta admit that Mr. Innocent Minded here (my wife would say Mr. Naive ) never thought of that angle.

So, presuming you might know, if they planted anything, would they plant seeds or little baby plants? I might go keep an eye out for little splotches of potting soil plugs in the ground. Also, (and I know anyone might do it differently), if someone WAS planting some weeds , do people tend to plant them near each other, or might they plant one "here" another 50' away kind of thing?

If they planted a patch of them, it might be easier to find, as opposed to spreading them out (until they reach a higher height)

 

[Egon]

One of the members here, Inveresk I believe, also found an ant mound on his property. Turns out the exterminator identified them as beneficial but he did find some carpenter ants in another location.

The plantings that may be would probably best be looked after by the local officials.

 

[SteelDust]

We get ants there that build nests out of fir needles. They can easily make a mound that's 3-4 feet high and 3-4 feet across, comprised entirely of fir needles and forest floor debris.

I've got 2 or 3 mounds on the property. Look for a picture of a "thatch ant" and see if that is what you have.

 

[Richard]

here's a picture of the mound. I bought some Andro (or something like that) at the co-op and put about 1/2 the tub around the mound. All the ransacking I did the other day with the sapling in the middle, has been fixed!

As for the plants... I contacted the Sheriff's dept today & spoke with a detective. he said they'd come out, or if I found some plants, I could pull them. he said they won't get the helicopter for fly overs until later in summer. Seems they have a couple of choppers and they share across the whole state or something like that.

He said if I found a bunch of plants, I think defined as over 20/30, then he'd PREFER for us to let them put a camera there so they could try to bust the gardeners. I told him I thought we'd be fine with that though I was out of line speaking for my father in law without his knowing it.

The detective said he was told one of our neighbors might be planting plants. Although the family and the sons ARE sort of a "trouble maker" mold, I REALLY REALLY have a hard time seeing them doing that and if they did, I have a hard time seeing them do that on our property. My wifes uncle is somewhat of a grandfather to the two boys and they really think a lot of him. I would expect that the risk of loss of that respect would be enough to keep them from it...then again... when I was 9 years old, I stole a plastic lemon juice thingy from the grocery, so what do I know. Just for the record, I asked mom if I could get it, she said no. I thought it was a squeeze lemonaid thing!! I put it in my pocket. Upon getting home, I went to garage to drink my lemonaid but couldn't open the confounded thing...seems you need a hole punched into it! I went inside and gave it to mom and asked her if she'd open if for me.

Clearly my criminal mind needed more work!~!! She made me go back to the store, march inside and give it back to the manager telling them what I did. I was going to outsmart her and go in, put it back on the shelf where I found it and walk on past the manager. Little did I know that she was going to march inside WITH me

 

[RollTideRam]

If you want to be sure if they are fire ants, pick up one. I can't believe they have made it to Knoxville. I'm not sure when they first arrived in Mobile, we have been battling them in North Alabama for years. I usually spend 50$ a year on poison to keep them down on my land. They are mean and you have to watch them. If you get in them and don't know it, they will hurt you. It seems like they don't bite until several get on you then they all attack. JC

 

[Richard]

It seems like they don't bite until several get on you then they all attack.

I've heard others say that same thing...almost like they wait until they can see the whites of your eyes, then ambush you

Side question: Regardless of the kind of ant they are, I put the Amdro down and suppose that will kill most of them, perhaps all if I'm lucky.

If in fact, it kills them all and the mound "dies", how does one tell it's dead absent disecting the mound apart at the risk of a rush of them attacking you?

My guess is, since they maintain the mound, if the mound were to die, it would wither away in a rainstorm or wither away over time and sort of "deflate" for lack of better word. Conjecture on my part, anyone know?

 

[1bush2hog]

Richard -

I'm not so sure the ants actually die from the Amdro. I think all I do is just move the ants from my yard to my neighbors :O

You will know if they are gone - toss a rock in the center of the mound - no action - they are gone

 

[MSWoodlot]

If they were "fire ants", Amdro should do them in at that mound. Your instinct about what to expect is correct. After a good rain, the mound will flatten out and there should be no further activity to rebuild that mound. But, keep your eyes open for other mounds because it's highly unlikely that the mound you treated is the only one. Once fire ants invade, they are hard to eradicate.

MSWoodlot

 

[wushaw]

If they were "fire ants", Amdro should do them in at that mound. Your instinct about what to expect is correct. After a good rain, the mound will flatten out and there should be no further activity to rebuild that mound. But, keep your eyes open for other mounds because it's highly unlikely that the mound you treated is the only one. Once fire ants invade, they are hard to eradicate.

MSWoodlot

Hard to eradicate...I would say completely impossible, all one can hope for is a stalemate if one keeps treating the mounds.