Adding a 3rd control for the FEL

[wr400]

I am stuck with a snow plow issue! I have a blade off of my old truck RIP. Anyway it is going on my FEL. I have two options one is to dtach my curl to do left an right on the plow. There other is to add a 3rd control. I like idea number two best incase I ever want to add a brush grapple or somthing. here is the problem! I dont know how to add a third to my JD 990. Any ideas?
Jeff

 

[radioman]

I am no expert in hydraulics by any means, but from reading alot of posts here on TBN, its my understanding that plows tends to come with single acting cylinders and your curl cylinder is double acting. you would need to add a bypass connector to allow the fluids be returned to tractor. You would be better off replacing the single to double acting ram. Since you want to add a grapple , i am sure it will have a double acting ram on it as well. So no matter which way you go , you probably will need to think everything has to be double acting on your tractor. Maybe a fellow TBN'er might disagree and have a better approach. I'm always ready to learn more too.

 

[wr400]

Never thought of it like that! I figured make the plow go right the other cylinder would follow! There are only two hoses on the plow. One for each cylinder.

 

[kennyd]

I am no expert in hydraulics by any means, but from reading alot of posts here on TBN, its my understanding that plows tends to come with single acting cylinders and your curl cylinder is double acting. you would need to add a bypass connector to allow the fluids be returned to tractor. You would be better off replacing the single to double acting ram. Since you want to add a grapple , i am sure it will have a double acting ram on it as well. So no matter which way you go , you probably will need to think everything has to be double acting on your tractor. Maybe a fellow TBN'er might disagree and have a better approach. I'm always ready to learn more too.

Two SA cylinders will work fine in this situation, there is no need for any other"bypass connector"(whatever that is)

 

[kennyd]

I am stuck with a snow plow issue! I have a blade off of my old truck RIP. Anyway it is going on my FEL. I have two options one is to dtach my curl to do left an right on the plow. There other is to add a 3rd control. I like idea number two best incase I ever want to add a brush grapple or somthing. here is the problem! I dont know how to add a third to my JD 990. Any ideas?
Jeff

The best way is to use a electric solenoid diverter valve that effectively "splits" the curl circuit. A button is added to the joystick to operate it, so when the button is pushed-the plow will operate.

I added one to my FEL, You can view the project HERE, and HERE. Also do a search on these terms for hours of reading on this very subject:

diverter
3rd function
FEL plow
FEL snowplow
grapple

 

[wr400]

Kenny D your a smart man! wish you lived a bit closer for more help! Any way I just ordered the kit from Johndeere to ad controlled hydraulics to the back of my tracter. They said it comes with the spool valve an everything for the cost of 255.00. We will see! They did asurre me I can cange direction. This means I will just have to find some long hoses to go from the plow to the back of the tractor. I even have a buddie that can make them for me. I love my tractor!
Jeff

 

[kennyd]

Please let me know if I can help further...

 

[JB4310]

I am stuck with a snow plow issue! I have a blade off of my old truck RIP. Anyway it is going on my FEL. I have two options one is to dtach my curl to do left an right on the plow. There other is to add a 3rd control. I like idea number two best incase I ever want to add a brush grapple or somthing. here is the problem! I dont know how to add a third to my JD 990. Any ideas?
Jeff

Jeff,
I'm in the very same boat, I've got a 7'6" western plow for free and I'm trying to rig it to my tractor (JD 4310), I was going to make it front mounted to my loader like you mentioned, even though I never liked the idea before, think it's alot of stress on the loader with the plow so far out front. but anyway was going to use my fork frame to hold the plow, after trying it out I realized I still don't like the idea of the loader mounted plow, so now I'm gonna just rig it to my 3PT hitch via the Imatch.
So now I need the 3rd SCV valve, I got the same quote as you, I just hope kenny is right about those single acting cylinders working with the new valve set up???
Let me know how you make out, the dealer said it would be about $250. to have them install it, must not be to involved but not sure I want to do it myself.
I'm going to start another thread on my snow plow project soon so I don't hijack yours, I'll probably have alot of questions.

John,

 

[kennyd]

Jeff,
I'm in the very same boat, I've got a 7'6" western plow for free and I'm trying to rig it to my tractor (JD 4310), I was going to make it front mounted to my loader like you mentioned, even though I never liked the idea before, think it's alot of stress on the loader with the plow so far out front. but anyway was going to use my fork frame to hold the plow, after trying it out I realized I still don't like the idea of the loader mounted plow, so now I'm gonna just rig it to my 3PT hitch via the Imatch.
So now I need the 3rd SCV valve, I got the same quote as you, I just hope kenny is right about those single acting cylinders working with the new valve set up???
Let me know how you make out, the dealer said it would be about $250. to have them install it, must not be to involved but not sure I want to do it myself.
I'm going to start another thread on my snow plow project soon so I don't hijack yours, I'll probably have alot of questions.

John,

You can bet that I am right, I have done it as well as MANY others if you search the FEL snowplow threads. Also, on your 4310 the actual valve is already on your machine, what you are buying is the control lever, hard tubing, brackets and QD's. It is not a hard job if you have medium mechanical ability and the tools.


You could also make a frame that mounts to the front of the tractor with the loader off-that has been done before also...

 

[Willl]

I thought we had someone on here that tried that and I believe his 'regen' function played all heck with the SA cylinders.

 

[mjncad]

View attachment 111450Kenny D your a smart man! wish you lived a bit closer for more help! Any way I just ordered the kit from Johndeere to ad controlled hydraulics to the back of my tracter. They said it comes with the spool valve an everything for the cost of 255.00. We will see! They did asurre me I can cange direction. This means I will just have to find some long hoses to go from the plow to the back of the tractor. I even have a buddie that can make them for me. I love my tractor!
Jeff

I just put a third, fourth & fifth function and power beyond kits on my 4200. The 3rd function kit was about $275 for mine, and it uses the unused third spool on the loader SCV (1 & 2 functions). I doubt you will get a valve in the kit for $255 as the valve is the expensive part.

Since you have a 430 loader and I have a 420 loader, I'd suggest you contact your dealer to see if they have the third function extension kit for your loader. It uses long hoses to connect to the 3rd function's rear connectors. I'd give you a kit number; but I haven't been able to find one, yet I can easily find the individual part numbers on www.jdparts.com

I'm no expert wrench turner; but I installed the kits myself to save money and so far no leaks. I have bought a lot of wrenches though to make the installation possible.

Pictures will be coming as soon as I finish putting the fenders and seat back on.

 

[kennyd]

I thought we had someone on here that tried that and I believe his 'regen' function played all heck with the SA cylinders.

Semi true Will, the Regen will not work with with SA cylinders, or DA cylinders where there is no weight to help retract the cylinder like on a snowblower chute rotation setup. But the OP is going to use a rear remote for his plow-and there is no Regen on the rear remote. Only the dump/curl circuit has Regen, and it is easily locked out.

 

[JB4310]

Thanks for the replies,
I'm fairly mechanical but also fairly hydraulicly iliterate, I should be able to handle the install though.

mjcnd, I guess the price does reflect the fact that it's not a valve as I mentioned, also I actually have a 300cx loader (swapped the 430) but for now I'm not getting the lines up front since I'm putting the plow on the rear, they qouted like $500.! for the steel lines and acs for the loader. I figure I could hook up some flex hoses in the future if the need arises.

Kenny, I thought about a frame mount but don't want to loose the loader, even thought about using the loader to lift the frame mounted plow (kinda hokey) as far as that regen goes I can't notice much difference one way or the other when I've fooled around with it? I also already have the power beyond if that makes any difference.

I'm going to start another thread in this forum maybe tonight, have to get some pictures, I've got the simplest idea to share.
JB

 

[mjncad]

Thanks for the replies,
I'm fairly mechanical but also fairly hydraulicly iliterate, I should be able to handle the install though.

mjcnd, I guess the price does reflect the fact that it's not a valve as I mentioned, also I actually have a 300cx loader (swapped the 430) but for now I'm not getting the lines up front since I'm putting the plow on the rear, they qouted like $500.! for the steel lines and acs for the loader. I figure I could hook up some flex hoses in the future if the need arises.

JB

$500 seems steep for the front remote extension for the loader. Was that with installation?

I've been getting a hydraulics 101 so to speak by installing these kits. The biggest frustration is fittings. There are NPT (anything NPT is evil in my opinion), JIC, ORFS (O-Ring Face Seal), ORBS (O-Ring Boss Seal) that appears to be interchangeable with SAE terminology wise. Then there is metric, BSPT (British Standard Pipe Taper), and BSPP (British Standard Pipe Parallel). And if you have a Komatsu piece of machinery, they have their own proprietary fittings.

The ORBS seem common; but the ORFS are not. JIC is common and so is NPT. I'm not even going to go into the availability of the other stuff.

Parker makes tons of stuff; but their web site and catalogs if you can find them online leave a lot to be desired. Eaton makes it easier to find stuff online; but has less product than Parker.

 

[JB4310]

$500 seems steep for the front remote extension for the loader. Was that with installation?

I'm pretty sure that's just for the parts, doesn't surprise me, my 95 Dodge needed some tranny lines and they were gonna cost $1,000.!! even the parts guys were shocked, I let em seep.

How do you control that 3rd function?, is it a lever that goes in the available slot next to the rock shaft lever?

I'll have to cross that fittings problem when I get to it, though I should only have 2 quick connects.

 

[kennyd]

How do you control that 3rd function?, is it a lever that goes in the available slot next to the rock shaft lever?

Yes, that is correct.

 

[dirtworksequip]

The part number for the rear 3rd valve/loader front hard line kit is BW15630 and was $275.00 in April of 2007.

Sincerely, Dirt

 

[mjncad]

$500 seems steep for the front remote extension for the loader. Was that with installation?

I'm pretty sure that's just for the parts, doesn't surprise me, my 95 Dodge needed some tranny lines and they were gonna cost $1,000.!! even the parts guys were shocked, I let em seep.

How do you control that 3rd function?, is it a lever that goes in the available slot next to the rock shaft lever?

I'll have to cross that fittings problem when I get to it, though I should only have 2 quick connects.

If the 4310 is similar to the 4200 - 4400 series, the 3rd, 4th & 5th functions are controlled via fender mounted levers that are connected to control cables. I'm not crazy about the cables; but time will tell how well they work once I get something that needs hydraulic power. I may just get a cheap double acting cylinder to use as a test and diagnostic tool. Eventually I suspect I'll be needing hydraulic powered stuff at our new property and I'm prepping the tractor now since a new tractor is not in the budget.

 

[mjncad]

The part number for the rear 3rd valve/loader front hard line kit is BW15630 and was $275.00 in April of 2007.

Sincerely, Dirt

Is that kit number for the 430 loader? Do you have the kit number for the 420 loader?

 

[JB4310]

Is that kit number for the 430 loader? Do you have the kit number for the 420 loader?

The dealer told me that there is no part number for the 430 (not available any more) but that the hard line set for the 300 series can be modded to work. Don't know how that affects you with the 420, maybe the 200 series would be needed? if that's loader that replaced the 420.
JB.