Buying Advice 4x4 or 2x4

[whistlepig]

Brush hogging with a 5' brush hog is about an acre an hour for a decent cut. Finish mowing is about two acres an hour with a 6' RFM. Depends on the roughness of the ground and thickness of what's being cut. My figures are not sealed in stone but I have brush hogged and finish mowed a little more than some.

 

[aczlan]

I live on ground that is pretty flat. The only time I use 4WD is when using the loader. For loader work the 4WD is worth it's weight in gold. For snow removal with a loader I can't see where 4WD helps as much as tire chains on the rear. A 2WD tractor with tire chains will push far more snow than a 4WD without tire chains.

I will have to disagree on this.
Dad had a Massey Ferguson Industrial 35 (50HP Perkins diesel, industrial loader with a 6' bucket, chains on the (loaded) tires, a beast of a machine). When clearing snow with that machine, you ran out of traction quick, even with a 55 gallon drum full of rocks in the 3 point.
He replaced that with a Kubota L3650. Smaller tractor, but has 4wd and 4 loaded tires. That tractor does a MUCH better job at loader work WITHOUT any extra weight on the back and in the snow, it will push and push. It doesn't stop for anything until you tell it to.
It also has a Laurin cab with heat which makes it MUCH more fun to work in during the winter.

Aaron Z

 

[whistlepig]

I will have to disagree on this.
Dad had a Massey Ferguson Industrial 35 (50HP Perkins diesel, industrial loader with a 6' bucket, chains on the (loaded) tires, a beast of a machine). When clearing snow with that machine, you ran out of traction quick, even with a 55 gallon drum full of rocks in the 3 point.
He replaced that with a Kubota L3650. Smaller tractor, but has 4wd and 4 loaded tires. That tractor does a MUCH better job at loader work WITHOUT any extra weight on the back and in the snow, it will push and push. It doesn't stop for anything until you tell it to.
It also has a Laurin cab with heat which makes it MUCH more fun to work in during the winter.

Aaron Z

This isn't an apples to apples comparison. My brother had a Ford Industrial tractor 2WD with a loader and loaded tires that I have used. This was a 50 HP+ tractor. My 30 HP Kubota 4WD will do more dirt work, with out rear weight, than this Ford could ever do. The newer tractors have a much better transfer of the power to the ground. The newer ones are simply better tractors. When you lift a loader you can feel the weight being lifted off of the rear tires. A rear weight just allows the tractor to compensate for the offset weight of the loader.

 

[aczlan]

This isn't an apples to apples comparison. My brother had a Ford Industrial tractor 2WD with a loader and loaded tires that I have used. This was a 50 HP+ tractor. My 30 HP Kubota 4WD will do more dirt work, with out rear weight, than this Ford could ever do. The newer tractors have a much better transfer of the power to the ground. The newer ones are simply better tractors. When you lift a loader you can feel the weight being lifted off of the rear tires. A rear weight just allows the tractor to compensate for the offset weight of the loader.

That is essentially what I said. I was disagreeing with your statement of "For snow removal with a loader I can't see where 4WD helps as much as tire chains on the rear" We went from a 2wd tractor with chains to a smaller 4wd without chains and the smaller tractor does much better than the larger one ever did.

Aaron Z

 

[jlsmith]

Funny how people say a 2wd tractor with a fel is crippeled. All of my tractors are 2wd and i dont have any problems moving a FULL load of dirt or 2200lbs round bales. I have both flat and hill land and the 2wd works great and i dont tear up my land when driving around.

 

[TripleR]

You "can't fool mother nature" and the laws of physics are universal; works the same for all of us.

When my father in law retired, he bought a 2WD 70 HP Massey Ferguson with a FEL because he was told it would work fine. "It works fine for me" doesn't mean it will work fine for someone else. After about six weeks of getting stuck and poor performance, he took the financial hit and bought the same model with 4WD. We still have it twenty five years later.

I "believe" tractor for tractor, you will be able to do more with a 4WD than 2WD, now you have to decide if you "need" to do more. We have both types depending on our needs.

 

[Pushing_Tin]

There's no way I would own a 2WD tractor.

 

[MBDiagMan]

There's no way I would own a 2WD tractor.

Yes, in the size tractor that you use, a 2WD tractor would be a mistake for almost any usage. With heavy tractors, there are many situations where 2WD with R1 tires will serve very well.

 

[jlsmith]

It all boils down to the type of work your are going to be doing. I bale hay mow pasters and all around ranch work and have yet had the need for a 4wd, i personaly wouldnt put one in a hay field. Put for people up north that have snow and ice i can see where one might come in handy.:thumbsup: Just saying in my line of work a 2wd is better IMHO.

 

[LaVerne]

a 5055E and a HX6 cutter - you'll not regret either. On hilly ground, 4 wheel drive gives 4 wheel brakes. It's expensive but this is machinery you only have to buy once. The HX series cutters will cut anything the tractor can run over, and more if you back over it. Both machines are iron that you'll work with, and not work on too much. I bought a 709 cutter some years ago, and it has about a 3 1/2 inch solid output shaft. I think it has 3 or 4 inch rated capacity of cut, and that's published diameter! I cried over it, but I only cried once.

 

[jenkinsph]

a 5055E and a HX6 cutter - you'll not regret either. On hilly ground, 4 wheel drive gives 4 wheel brakes. It's expensive but this is machinery you only have to buy once. The HX series cutters will cut anything the tractor can run over, and more if you back over it. Both machines are iron that you'll work with, and not work on too much. I bought a 709 cutter some years ago, and it has about a 3 1/2 inch solid output shaft. I think it has 3 or 4 inch rated capacity of cut, and that's published diameter! I cried over it, but I only cried once.

While I will agree the HX6 is a good heavy duty cutter the OP stated in his opening thread that there were a few saplings about 1" in diameter, an HX6 is a little overkill considering his tight budget. Cutting his small pastures with any cutter should work after the first initial clearing. In the OP's case he may never benefit from the expense of an HX6.

 

[hawkeye08]

It all boils down to the type of work your are going to be doing. I bale hay mow pasters and all around ranch work and have yet had the need for a 4wd, i personaly wouldnt put one in a hay field. Put for people up north that have snow and ice i can see where one might come in handy.:thumbsup: Just saying in my line of work a 2wd is better IMHO.

jlsmith, great information. I agreed completely with you up to the end. You are right that it depends on the type of work, that haying doesn't need 4wd (at least where you are), but I don't think 2wd is better, it is just all you need. Wise money managers will not purchase more than they need. You have what you need. If you had to use that same haying tractor for work that also needed 4wd, and you had bought a 4wd, you could select to run in 2wd while haying and 4wd for the other work that needed 4wd.

I think it is better to get what you need. I have a L3130 and if I had a bigger tractor with R1 tires, I might be able to do everything I need to, but I have a smaller tractor and both for FEL work and mowing on steeper hills, 4wd is what I need. My goal is to get down to one tractor (not counting the collectibles of course).

 

[stlawrence]

Steve, you raise a good question about the brush hogging.

After I whack out the saplings, and there is a sizeable number of them in some parts of the fields, do they leave stobs that are going to puncture my tires and just be a pain to walk through?

I'm planning on about a six foot bush hog, and am hoping that will be large enough for the first clearing, but not too big for subsequent clean-ups.

I'm pinging between tractors. Right now, I think I'll go toward a 5045E with bush hog, and get the FEL later. I was looking today at Farmalls - boy, do they bring back memories. I can see going for a Farmall 45.

We had a 15-acre field when I was a kid, and Dad did everything with a Farmall Cub. I look at the photos of them now, and wonder how he did so much, with that little tractor.

 

[jenkinsph]

It might be a good idea to get a boxblade that you could use to push over the small saplings with and uproot them. You do have to watch out for your tires. Dull blades (on your brushhog)work better for this since they tend to shatter the small stuff rather than cutting it off sharp.

I would cut a few with the brushhog to see how it leaves the saplings, if they look sharp and pointed I would back over them with a boxblade. It may take some time to get this all cleaned up. I will also point out that in doing this you are changing direction frequently pulling forward and backing up, this is where hydro tractors really shine.


When I first posted in your thread I had you confused with another member who had 15 to 20 acres to deal with and suggested the used 110tlb, knowing now that you are looking to cut 50 acres of 80 total I have changed my suggestions.
I predict if you get the 5045E you will find that it takes a considerable amount of your hp to drive the tractor up the hills and in turn will slow down your mowing process. I suspect you will be trading up sooner than you now realize to a higher hp tractor. If it were me knowing you will branch out into many other tasks once you get more involved I would look into a 4720 cab tractor(66hp) and an MX8 two point cutter to start with. It will cost you alot less if you buy it the first time, I would hold out until I could make this happen, just my opinion.

About your dad and the Cub, I know the answer to that too, "he spent a lot of time on the tractor to make it happen". If you are retired and in good health you can take it slow. If you are still working age and have limited time to spend on this you need the right tools to get it done faster. Otherwise you will be spending an inordinate amount of your time mowing rather than making other lasting improvements. Give that some thought and good luck with your new place.

 

[MBDiagMan]

Yep, he spent TIME on it, that's why it was enough tractor. I had an elderly neighbor that died a few years ago. He still had his Ford 840 two row tractor that he had farmed about 300 acres with. He said he used the headlights a BUNCH.

 

[RoyJackson]

There's no way I would own a 2WD tractor.

As far as a Compact, I agree with you. However, I don't use front assist too much...just when needed.
Some circumstances, rear ballast helped more then the front wheel assist.

This will be my first year using rear chains...and I'm very interested in finding out how well they work in 2WD for snow removal.