48x39x14 shop build
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ovrszd
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I've just got a cheap thermostat. Not sure what it's tolerance is. Might be contributing to this issue.
It's not a big deal at all here in the shop. Might be in the house.
I'll get the bugs worked out this Winter. Then be better educated about the house.
truckdiagnostics
Platinum Member
On a monolithic slab you want the water temp to be about 10-20 degrees above room temp. Then as heat loss goes up, colder weather outside, you have to increase your water temp. If you are not opening and closing your doors you should not being seeing those temp swings.
I run 85 -90 degree water in the house garage(door opens very little) cheapest thermostat you can buy temp stays right where it is set. In our shop i run about the same temp water and we will see swings when we open the doors. If we do not open and close the doors stays right where it is.
My understanding of the probe being in the slab is they control room temp by the temp of the slab. They then have temp sensor outside that senses outside temp. When the temp outside decreases they raise the water temp going into the floor. This gets the or keeps the whole, slab at about 5 degrees above room temp. Just shot both slabs, runs right at 5 degrees above until I get to outer edges. Then at about 2' out I will loose 2 degrees. Knowing what I know now I would have put the tubing more closer together on the outer edges.
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ovrszd
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I'm at 110 degree water temp. I'll lower that another 5 degrees.
My slab temp is uniform until I get within a foot of the wall. I don't recall my tubing being any closer together out at the walls.
I see temp rise without opening the overheads. We haven't had any real cold weather yet. Right now we don't have any frost in the ground.
I think I have my water temp too high. I've learned to make adjustments in small increments and to allow longer time span between them.
I'll report my adjustments and results as they happen. Going to 105 water temp now.
My slab temp is uniform until I get within a foot of the wall. I don't recall my tubing being any closer together out at the walls.
I see temp rise without opening the overheads. We haven't had any real cold weather yet. Right now we don't have any frost in the ground.
I think I have my water temp too high. I've learned to make adjustments in small increments and to allow longer time span between them.
I'll report my adjustments and results as they happen. Going to 105 water temp now.
truckdiagnostics
Platinum Member
You want your water temp to be as low as possible and still be able to maintain your ambient temp. Ideally you should find a spot where it is just about running water through the floor all the time. That will give you an even heat. They also make a variable displacement pump now. Which helps with some of this, how I have not figured out because I don't have one. There is a specific change in temp you want on supply and return in your floor. My son says with more flow in my floor i could run a lower water temp, he says there is too large difference between supply and return. New manifold solved my issues and don't see fancy pump in my future.
So thinking out loud with a variable displacement pump, probe in the concrete, instant hot water heater boiler, sensor on inlet and return, all connected together with microprocessor one would think it is possible to find a sweet spot. Then with it sensing outside temp you should be able to maintain constant temp if the loads in the home do not radically change. Like opening garage door in the shop.
I can heat 900 square feet with a 40 gal electric hot water heater when ambient temps stay right around 40 degrees and it stays right at about 65 degrees. I didn't believe it was possible either until the geo had issues and had to use the back up. Much colder and the electric hot water heater can't keep up. The geo unit loves making 85 degree water, it is the domestic hot water that is ruff.
So thinking out loud with a variable displacement pump, probe in the concrete, instant hot water heater boiler, sensor on inlet and return, all connected together with microprocessor one would think it is possible to find a sweet spot. Then with it sensing outside temp you should be able to maintain constant temp if the loads in the home do not radically change. Like opening garage door in the shop.
I can heat 900 square feet with a 40 gal electric hot water heater when ambient temps stay right around 40 degrees and it stays right at about 65 degrees. I didn't believe it was possible either until the geo had issues and had to use the back up. Much colder and the electric hot water heater can't keep up. The geo unit loves making 85 degree water, it is the domestic hot water that is ruff.
Fallon
Super Member
I fought with radio reception in my barn/shop. In the end I gave up & put a cheap sntenna outside & found a cheap stereo system at a flea market that had an external antenna input.
I'm a HAM radio guy, which in theory means I know RF & radio a bit better than most people... in thoery.
A barn with metal siding & a roof is basically a faraday cage. Which is a fancy name for something that blocks radio waves. Not a perfect one by any means, but most are enough it will cause you problems with any radio stuff (AM/FM radio, cell phones, WiFi, etc).
Old transformer & new digital ballasts end up being unintentional radio transmitters. As such they basically act as poor quality jammers. You can try various ballasts & some are better than others. Industrial or commercial ones are usually quieter on the RF spectrum than ones for home use. I was putting in lighting into a WAY under lit barn & shop at the time so I was buying new fixtures at the time.* I tried a few, but none were quite good enough. LEDs were still almost double the price, so I didnt go that way at the time.
I'm slowly ripping out ballasts & putting in LED tubes as I have problems now though. Not even troubleshooting, just rip out the tubes & ballast & toss in 4*$7*LED tubes any time a fixture has issues.
The faraday cage aspect of the barn & jammer aspect of the ballasts individually weren't enough to kill my radio, but combined* were. I didnt like working in the dark, so put up an antenna outside, which works.
I loose radio reception just driving my tractor into the barn. If the lights are off you get extremely poor reception. If the lights are on, there is none at all.
I'm a HAM radio guy, which in theory means I know RF & radio a bit better than most people... in thoery.
A barn with metal siding & a roof is basically a faraday cage. Which is a fancy name for something that blocks radio waves. Not a perfect one by any means, but most are enough it will cause you problems with any radio stuff (AM/FM radio, cell phones, WiFi, etc).
Old transformer & new digital ballasts end up being unintentional radio transmitters. As such they basically act as poor quality jammers. You can try various ballasts & some are better than others. Industrial or commercial ones are usually quieter on the RF spectrum than ones for home use. I was putting in lighting into a WAY under lit barn & shop at the time so I was buying new fixtures at the time.* I tried a few, but none were quite good enough. LEDs were still almost double the price, so I didnt go that way at the time.
I'm slowly ripping out ballasts & putting in LED tubes as I have problems now though. Not even troubleshooting, just rip out the tubes & ballast & toss in 4*$7*LED tubes any time a fixture has issues.
The faraday cage aspect of the barn & jammer aspect of the ballasts individually weren't enough to kill my radio, but combined* were. I didnt like working in the dark, so put up an antenna outside, which works.
I loose radio reception just driving my tractor into the barn. If the lights are off you get extremely poor reception. If the lights are on, there is none at all.
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ovrszd
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I've got one more external antenna idea to try. If no success then I'll work toward eliminating the ballasts in my lights.
Really aggravates me that I have the same opener and same lights in my old all metal building and have 200ft range on the opener.....
Really aggravates me that I have the same opener and same lights in my old all metal building and have 200ft range on the opener.....
Citydude
Elite Member
Well, if all else fails and I can tell you loath the idea, high bay LED lights are an option. My neighbor has a 40x60x14 shop with no ceiling and installed just 4 of them in his shop. Huge difference in lighting that size of shop. You literally can not look at them they are so bright. He order them off of Amazon. I think he paid $130.00 for each.
GSVette
Gold Member
Here’s my 40x60x14, no ceiling with LED high bays (15 of them to be precise)-don’t lack for light!!!
Was it the coax style, and did you ground it as required? Everything I've read says coax and proper ground procedure makes the difference with these. Here's an installation guide showing how coax can be used to get to the external antenna. http://www.dslreports.com/r0/download/1688767~ab1a5f77e498f19bc19b04b1787fb2f6/External antenna.pdf
There are also instructions to use coax, extending externally as shown above, to avoid interference. The difference is how you connect the coax to the opener. Rather than connecting to the end of the existing antenna, you open the lifter and remove the antenna. Then strip the coax as shown above, but connect the center wire (solder) to the point on the board where the original antenna was connected. Connect the twisted braided shielding to a ground point on the circuit board. On the other end of the coax (outside) connect the original antenna wire to center wire of the coax. This shields the entire antenna to the outside of the shop.
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