422 vrs 425

[BobRip]

My reasons for rulling out the 422 have been stated and revolve around the lower rated motors, lack of standard rops, lift height, etc.

Skip

Good decision.

 

[toy]

Toy; I don't think they have made this thing for years. It has to be old as the master cylinder crossed to a mid fifties chevy truck. I haven't been able to find any info for this machine anywhere. There are no ID plates on it other than the transaxle has a manuf. name plate, I believe it is Haxco. I know of one other, that is owned by a church camp & I was told it was donated to them. A reletive who sells Stiener machines was trying to repair it for them, but I haven't seen it.
My reasons for rulling out the 422 have been stated and revolve around the lower rated motors, lack of standard rops, lift height, etc.

Skip

Its good that you look at both machines and determine what the differences are and is the differences worth the extra money. When I bought mine my wife insisted on the rops no matter which one I got so that would be an added cost for the ones that don't have one and reduces the difference in cost between the two at the time I bought mine I had the money for the 422 so I borrowed the extra to upgrade to the 425[hint that way you can get it sooner] .

 

[FOURTEEN]

As requested I am posting photos

Interesting unit!! What do you use it for? How old is it? Does it go in snow?



PS: For future reference:
It is best to 'Crop' your pictures to just show the relevant object, such as the tractor, and eliminate background, such as the lawn and the woods. Then 'Resize' the picture to no more than 800 wide and 200 KB.

In this case, I easily edited your picture to 800 x 441 and only 92.7 KB, making it easier to view and much faster to download.

 

[Barryh]

I'd like to bring this one back up to the top if anyone is game...

Bob in this thread you seem to have recommended the 425 like your dissatisfied with your 422. I know without a doubt the 425 is a great machine. I also know the plus's of owning one. Not trying to start anything here. Would just like to hear your experiences (422 owners.)

Has anyone changed there mind on their 422 ? How satisfied are you with your particular choice. If you bought the same machine again, any advice as what to look for or not to look for?

I may be upgrading this spring / summer, I've been seriously thinking of getting a new 422. I know there are used units out there in the 425 model. I just have a very hard time convincing myself to buy used. I wouldn't enjoy it as much, always wondering if the machine had been abused or neglected that's just the way I think.

On another note, how much do the high torque wheel motors cost? How labor intensive are they to install? Say if I wanted to upgrade later on. Anyone know??

 

[MuncyBob]

I have never "wanted" a 425 due to the lack of anything that the 422 does (or does not do) with the exception of the additional lift height. A makeshift ramp of some sort has always solved that problem! Sure, additional engine hp or wheel torque would be nice to have but lacking those features has yet to stop me from doing what I intended this tractor to do at purchase time.

 

[BobRip]

I'd like to bring this one back up to the top if anyone is game...

Bob in this thread you seem to have recommended the 425 like your dissatisfied with your 422. I know without a doubt the 425 is a great machine. I also know the plus's of owning one. Not trying to start anything here. Would just like to hear your experiences (422 owners.)

Has anyone changed there mind on their 422 ? How satisfied are you with your particular choice. If you bought the same machine again, any advice as what to look for or not to look for?

I may be upgrading this spring / summer, I've been seriously thinking of getting a new 422. I know there are used units out there in the 425 model. I just have a very hard time convincing myself to buy used. I wouldn't enjoy it as much, always wondering if the machine had been abused or neglected that's just the way I think.

On another note, how much do the high torque wheel motors cost? How labor intensive are they to install? Say if I wanted to upgrade later on. Anyone know??

Barry, I think you were refering to me. There are places where I have been stuck on my property when it is wet that the extra wheel motor torque would help. Initially I got stuck often, until I learned how to steer left and right (PT wiggle) to get out. Also I carry a winch.

I have considered the more powerful wheel motors, but my machine does not have the third hose for case drain and I might have to add those. Also PT uses a larger tram pump on the 425. Basically I am waiting till my present machine is 10 years old and will then give myself a new machine. Not because I really need it, but what the heck, I am not getting any younger and the cost is not that great. Also I am hoping that PT will make an even better machine by then. I am also considering getting the 1430 instead, but buying all new attachment does not appeal to me.

The new 422 does not have two steering cylinders and this bothers my goal for symmetry. I think failures have been few, but it's another strike against a 422.

I am an engineer and am never completley satisfied with anything, but if I had to live with the 422 for the rest of my life, it would not be a give deal. I have accomplished a lot with the 422 and it has been a reliable machine for me. Probably more fun per dollar than anything I have bought in the past 20 years. My hills, ruts, and mud do create issues sometimes. If you don't have a lot of either the 422 is probably a good choice.

Barry, as much as you have used the 180, go for the 425. You are not a casual user and need that capability. I wonder if the 180 and the 422 have the same wheel motors. If so you may find that you have less relative torque. Check on this with PT.

 

[Barryh]

Barry, I think you were refering to me. There are places where I have been stuck on my property when it is wet that the extra wheel motor torque would help. Initially I got stuck often, until I learned how to steer left and right (PT wiggle) to get out. Also I carry a winch.

I have considered the more powerful wheel motors, but my machine does not have the third hose for case drain and I might have to add those. Also PT uses a larger tram pump on the 425. Basically I am waiting till my present machine is 10 years old and will then give myself a new machine. Not because I really need it, but what the heck, I am not getting any younger and the cost is not that great. Also I am hoping that PT will make an even better machine by then. I am also considering getting the 1430 instead, but buying all new attachment does not appeal to me.

The new 422 does not have two steering cylinders and this bothers my goal for symmetry. I think failures have been few, but it's another strike against a 422.

I am an engineer and am never completley satisfied with anything, but if I had to live with the 422 for the rest of my life, it would not be a give deal. I have accomplished a lot with the 422 and it has been a reliable machine for me. Probably more fun per dollar than anything I have bought in the past 20 years. My hills, ruts, and mud do create issues sometimes. If you don't have a lot of either the 422 is probably a good choice.

Barry, as much as you have used the 180, go for the 425. You are not a casual user and need that capability. I wonder if the 180 and the 422 have the same wheel motors. If so you may find that you have less relative torque. Check on this with PT.

That thought crossed my mind also. I believe they are the same wheel motors. The 180 is lighter and has narrower tires. So given the wider stance and somewhat heavier 422, it may take away from some of the torque I'm used to.

The 180 has been a great little machine and for half the cost of the 425. I know I come off as bragging some times at what the 180 is Capable of. I don't mean to sound that way. What it really boils down to is... I'm always surprised how well it does everything. I'm sure other 180 owners would agree. Thats what makes me think I would be more than happy with the larger 422.

The jury is still out on a 422 / 425. I also really like the 1430 but, would have to go used on that and hearing some of the horror stories lately. Buying something this size used, I would have to think twice.

My property does not have a lot of hills the only place I would like a little more torque from the wheel motors would be when I use the bucket for digging out our hard clay and shale. Anyway thanks for summing up your experiences.

 

[Barryh]

I have never "wanted" a 425 due to the lack of anything that the 422 does (or does not do) with the exception of the additional lift height. A makeshift ramp of some sort has always solved that problem! Sure, additional engine hp or wheel torque would be nice to have but lacking those features has yet to stop me from doing what I intended this tractor to do at purchase time.

Very nice to hear, you might be reading my thoughts...

 

[DHS]

I ordered my PT-422 with ROPS in 2002. In 2002 the PT-422 and PT-425 were the same except for the ROPS and engine HP. My PT-422 does everything I need it to do. However, like everyone I sometimes wish it had a bit more power. I started thinking about upgrading to the Robin 25 hp when it comes time to replace the engine in a few years. I compared the Robin 22 hp to the Robin 25 hp engine. The Robin 22 hp is rated at continuous 17 hp. The Robin 25 hp engine is rated at a continuous 18 hp. Not much of an increase in contiuous HP rating for the cost.

While contemplating the cost difference of the extra continuous hp over the next couple of years I also decided to contemplate the idea of "being satisfied with what I have."

Dale

 

[Barryh]

I ordered my PT-422 with ROPS in 2002. In 2002 the PT-422 and PT-425 were the same except for the ROPS and engine HP. My PT-422 does everything I need it to do. However, like everyone I sometimes wish it had a bit more power. I started thinking about upgrading to the Robin 25 hp when it comes time to replace the engine in a few years. I compared the Robin 22 hp to the Robin 25 hp engine. The Robin 22 hp is rated at continuous 17 hp. The Robin 25 hp engine is rated at a continuous 18 hp. Not much of an increase in contiuous HP rating for the cost.

While contemplating the cost difference of the extra continuous hp over the next couple of years I also decided to contemplate the idea of "being satisfied with what I have."

Dale

I can relate,

I think the big sell for me on the 425 would be the dual steering cylinders and extra wheel torque, like most people have stated. I'm just not sure that it's worth an extra 2,500.

I think the 422 would be plenty of machine for me, as happy as I've been with the 180. I need to be real sure because once I decide, if after that I buy one more tractor. My wife is going to divorce me. The next one has to last me for a life time.

 

[BobRip]

That thought crossed my mind also. I believe they are the same wheel motors. The 180 is lighter and has narrower tires. So given the wider stance and somewhat heavier 422, it may take away from some of the torque I'm used to.

The 180 has been a great little machine and for half the cost of the 425. I know I come off as bragging some times at what the 180 is Capable of. I don't mean to sound that way. What it really boils down to is... I'm always surprised how well it does everything. I'm sure other 180 owners would agree. Thats what makes me think I would be more than happy with the larger 422.

The jury is still out on a 422 / 425. I also really like the 1430 but, would have to go used on that and hearing some of the horror stories lately. Buying something this size used, I would have to think twice.

My property does not have a lot of hills the only place I would like a little more torque from the wheel motors would be when I use the bucket for digging out our hard clay and shale. Anyway thanks for summing up your experiences.

Barry, I talked to Keith about this (I think it was Keith at PT, anyway the PT sales guy at the time), he stated that professionals would buy the 422/425 (at the time they both had the same wheel motors) and be dissastified after about 2 years of use. This is why PT put the larger wheel motors in. As stated the extra torgue is a big help with bucket work. The wheel motors on the 425 are rated at 3000 PSI versus 1500 on the 422 (correct me if I am wrong). I have considered upgrading the engine on the 422 to around 30 HP, but I feel this would put a lot of strain on the wheel motors. So my most likely purchase is the 425 or a 425 with big wheels and 1430 wheel motors like Mr. Beach has. Again the decision is 3 years away and we will see what happens. Since this is your last tractor, I would check with PT on the 180 versus 422 wheel motors. If they are the same I would definately go with the 425. If I could send $2500 to PT tomorrow and upgrade my wheel motors, engine, and tram pump, I would do it in a heart beat. In your case, you only go around twice in life (two different tractors), pick the one you really love. I don't know what PT sales are like, but I would check and see if they sell the most of the 425. If so that would push me towards it. This means they have more experience with it.
Maybe this will help. When you go up a steep hill with your 180, does the engine bog down first, or the wheels just stop turrning, or do the wheels slip. On my PT 422 the wheels stop and then the engine will stall if I keep pushing the pedal down. I then have to wiggle (left and right steer) to reach the top (if I don't stall the engine of course). If your 180 has the wheels spin, then you have more torque per pound of vehicle than the 422, and you will be more limited by the 422.
Good luck on your decision, I hope this is helping and not confusing. You need to do extensive driving of the 422 to really determine what you should do.

 

[Barryh]

Barry, I talked to Keith about this (I think it was Keith at PT, anyway the PT sales guy at the time), he stated that professionals would buy the 422/425 (at the time they both had the same wheel motors) and be dissastified after about 2 years of use. This is why PT put the larger wheel motors in. As stated the extra torgue is a big help with bucket work. The wheel motors on the 425 are rated at 3000 PSI versus 1500 on the 422 (correct me if I am wrong). I have considered upgrading the engine on the 422 to around 30 HP, but I feel this would put a lot of strain on the wheel motors. So my most likely purchase is the 425 or a 425 with big wheels and 1430 wheel motors like Mr. Beach has. Again the decision is 3 years away and we will see what happens. Since this is your last tractor, I would check with PT on the 180 versus 422 wheel motors. If they are the same I would definately go with the 425. If I could send $2500 to PT tomorrow and upgrade my wheel motors, engine, and tram pump, I would do it in a heart beat. In your case, you only go around twice in life (two different tractors), pick the one you really love. I don't know what PT sales are like, but I would check and see if they sell the most of the 425. If so that would push me towards it. This means they have more experience with it.
Maybe this will help. When you go up a steep hill with your 180, does the engine bog down first, or the wheels just stop turrning, or do the wheels slip. On my PT 422 the wheels stop and then the engine will stall if I keep pushing the pedal down. I then have to wiggle (left and right steer) to reach the top (if I don't stall the engine of course). If your 180 has the wheels spin, then you have more torque per pound of vehicle than the 422, and you will be more limited by the 422.
Good luck on your decision, I hope this is helping and not confusing. You need to do extensive driving of the 422 to really determine what you should do.

No, not confusing at all.

Sounds like some real good advice, since you do own a 422 you would know. My place has no steel hill issues. I do have a slight continuous grade out front enough that when I go off camber it almost feels like the PT might tip but it never does. I do some crawling around back in the woods where there are some pretty deep but, small ravines. This is why I love the small power to size ratio on these tractors.

The 180 crawls right down in up, and out even with a load aboard but, it's not a continuous up hill battle. While digging my pond and it's about two foot deep. The PT would go in and I would have to do the wiggle, to back it out with a full bucket.

My guess would be with your larger pump and added hp, the 422 might equal the wheel torque of the 180, and compensate a little for its weight and size? I don't use my PT to mow the lawn. I like the idea of a dedicated throw away lawn / garden tractor, that way I can keep my hours low and save the PT for other tasks. Heavier loader and related work around the house.

Also this way my wife doesn't get a chance to abuse the PT the way she does our lawn tractor. How strong do you feel that one cylinder is on your 422? I know it takes a lot of abuse on my 180. The PT wiggle with heavy loads backing out of deep holes must put excessive stress on that weld. That is my real concern with the heavier 422.

Along with the wider tires I'm sure there would even more stress evolved. Like you, I'm getting older now and the next PT will be my last, so I'll have to exercise some patience and buy the right one.

You mentioned larger tires. We must be on the same page I have been thinking a taller / larger tire for a little added clearance. I know that may change the top end but, I never use more than half of its speed capabilities anyway. So that's not a none starter for me.

 

[Marks481]

I love my 422, and have seldom encountered situations where I wanted more wheel torque. The sngle steering cylinder actually has an avantage: you don't need to put a "knuckle buster" on the steering wheel, because it is less then a turn from lock-to-lock, so you don't have to rapidly spin the steering wheel while driving.

The disadvantage of the single cylinder is that it obviously concentrates stress, and one individual here has had the steering cylinder mount rip loose in the footwell. PT foolishlessly put a drain hole near the mounting, leaving only a small ligament to support the stress. I frequently take off the deckplate to check for any indication of stress fractures in this area, and will someday probably weld some reinforcements to the cylinder mounts to eliminate that worry. I would like to think that PT has changed their design to eliminate this flaw, but really doubt it, since they don't really seem to listen to this forum or implement feedback into their design.

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/power-trac/62158-broken-frame-pt-422-a.html

 

[Barryh]

I love my 422, and have seldom encountered situations where I wanted more wheel torque. The sngle steering cylinder actually has an avantage: you don't need to put a "knuckle buster" on the steering wheel, because it is less then a turn from lock-to-lock, so you don't have to rapidly spin the steering wheel while driving.

The disadvantage of the single cylinder is that it obviously concentrates stress, and one individual here has had the steering cylinder mount rip loose in the footwell. PT foolishlessly put a drain hole near the mounting, leaving only a small ligament to support the stress. I frequently take off the deckplate to check for any indication of stress fractures in this area, and will someday probably weld some reinforcements to the cylinder mounts to eliminate that worry. I would like to think that PT has changed their design to eliminate this flaw, but really doubt it, since they don't really seem to listen to this forum or implement feedback into their design.

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/power-trac/62158-broken-frame-pt-422-a.html

Hmmm very interesting thanks for the link also J.J.'s comment about the added push force when turing right, something to think about if digging or carrying a heavy load.

So we have 1 found crack around the weld joint, and two noted failures to date. I wonder if Power Trac has made any notable corrections in this area. Something to ask about if I do decide on a 422.

 

[BobRip]

Barry, my 422 is older and has two steering cylinders. When I bought it I considered the 425, but at that time the wheel motors were the same and three extra horsepower did not seem like much. That was the only difference at the time. No extra lift height.

The big wheel justification is not ground clearance (for me anyway), but more flotation and more wheel torque (am I greedy for wheel torque or what). The negative is that PT has only built one machine like it. I have found in life that if you buy something that a company builds a lot of then it is usually more reliable and has fewer flaws.

 

[KMA]

Wouldn't bigger wheels = less torque? It's like being "geared" higher isn't it?

 

[SnowRidge]

Wouldn't bigger wheels = less torque? It's like being "geared" higher isn't it?

Yes, you gain top speed and lose grunt.

 

[BobRip]

Yes, you gain top speed and lose grunt.

The PT425 big wheel has motors from the 1430. I don't know what this does to the top speed. Certainly your comment above is correct.

 

[SnowRidge]

The PT425 big wheel has motors from the 1430. I don't know what this does to the top speed. Certainly your comment above is correct.

When PT switched to the high torque wheel motors on the PT-425 in early to mid 2003, I think it was, top speed declined slightly. PT eventually dropped the previously stated 8 MPH top speed from their spec sheet. The last time I looked, it was unstated.

 

[KMA]

The PT425 big wheel has motors from the 1430.

Ah... big wheel motors. I was a bit confused, sorry about that.