410 loader cylinder repair?

[bucknut]

Does anyone have a service manuel for a 410 loader(on a JD 4100 CUT)? I blew a seal and was trying to disassemble it to replace the seal. I got it apart, but may have tore it up. The ser # is less that 8801. There is a wire lock of some kind that locks the rod end of the cylinder to the cylinder tube. I would like to know the proper way to remove it, and install the new one. Thanks for any help.

 

[kennyd]

I have done it, and described the procedure before. Take a look at THIS post and see if it answers your questions, if not-ask away

 

[Wayne County Hose]

Dang Kenny, you da man!

Pictures and more pictures. We can walk you thru most any cylinder rebuild with pictures. There are so many ways for these things to be put together it ain't funny! I have to admit, sometimes I even get fooled. Some little snap ring inside that I didn't see. Darnitall! By the way, that's the name of the pain killer I am going to invent. If it will cure the darnitall, it will cure anything!

 

[bucknut]

Thanks for the help. I read the post, but it seems the cylinder is made different. Mine has no snap ring on top, it is solid. It seems to be retained by a round wire ring that protrudes through a slot in the cyl tube. I thought it was threaded on and used a pipe wrench, which broke the wire ring, and I had to pull it out by breaking it in pieces an pulling out through the slot.
I attached some pics of it disassembled. I would like to know how I should have done it, and how to get it back together. If you have any experience with this type please enlighten me before I have to buy a new cyl. Thanks

 

[bucknut]

I forgot to attach the pics

 

[Wayne County Hose]

Ah yes, I thought this was it by the way you described. On your cylinder, that wire is what holds the gland in. Lock your cylinder in a vise with the groove up. Now while turning the gland, stick a pick down in the groove and catch the end of the wire as it comes around. You want to guide the wire out of the groove as you turn the gland. When the wire tries to come out of the groove, the gland will become harder to turn, just give her a little extra, it will pop out. You will need a good pick so it does not bend. After the wire is out, use the rod like a slide hammer and pound the gland free. Just be careful as oil will go flying everywhere. I've lost many a good work clothes and shoes doing this. I've even stripped right there and used my clothes to soak up the oil. I don't know about you, but in my case, it wasn't a pretty sight. Let us know how you do.
Andy

Oops, just saw your pics. Already apart, okay, disregard. Looks like you boogered her up a little, but should be fine. Anyhow, the above is the way it's done. Sounds like you did all you could to do it the right way. The ring broke, this is common. Get a new one, slap it together. Looks like an easy cylinder to do. Good luck.

 

[kennyd]

OK, I missed the part about the serial #. I just looked them up on JDParts. I have not taken this type apart, hopefully Andy can help when you get the pics posted. I will post the parts breakdown...

 

[kennyd]

Ah yes, I thought this was it by the way you described. On your cylinder, that wire is what holds the gland in. Lock your cylinder in a vise with the groove up. Now while turning the gland, stick a pick down in the groove and catch the end of the wire as it comes around. You want to guide the wire out of the groove as you turn the gland. When the wire tries to come out of the groove, the gland will become harder to turn, just give her a little extra, it will pop out. You will need a good pick so it does not bend. After the wire is out, use the rod like a slide hammer and pound the gland free. Just be careful as oil will go flying everywhere. I've lost many a good work clothes and shoes doing this. I've even stripped right there and used my clothes to soak up the oil. I don't know about you, but in my case, it wasn't a pretty sight. Let us know how you do.
Andy

Oops, just saw your pics. Already apart, okay, disregard. Looks like you boogered her up a little, but should be fine.

Dang Kenny, you da man!

NO You are!

 

[Wayne County Hose]

Okay, to install the new ring. Put the whole cylinder back together. The ring is the very last step. I like to put a little grease on the o-ring by where the retaining ring goes. Line up the hole in the retaining ring groove with the groove on the cylinder housing. Slide the gland into the cylinder until you can see the hole in the gland. There should be a little hook on the new ring. Put the hook into the hole in the gland. Now turn the gland with your pipe wrench drawing the ring into the cylinder. I like to put some grease on the ring so if you ever have to remove it again, it's a little easier. It's just that easy!

 

[bucknut]

Thanks, you guys are awsome. I am going to the dealer to get the seal kit Tuesday. I would not have thought to "roll" the new retainer in through the slot. Thanks again Wayne County Hose and KennyD.

 

[dgr321]

I'm going to resurrect this topic with a question regarding the cylinder repair JD 4100 with a 410 FEL. I have looked through various threads in this forum and in others and need some assistance with the cylinder disassembly. Has anyone dealt with a broken wire and what might be the next step? I pulled up the end of the wire to start. I got the rod holder to turn, clockwise and counterclockwise, but the wire didn't move. So I tried to pull on it while rotating the rod holder - and the wire broke - and there is nothing left to grab. Any suggestions would be appreciated. TIA.

 

[kennyd]

Turning the end cap does not expose the end of the wire I assume? I'm not sure what the next step would be, sorry.

 

[dgr321]

No. The wire does not move as a I rotate the end cap. I can move the end cap 360 deg in both directions. My guess is the wire is corroded and stuck in place.

 

[Zebrafive]

Does rotating the cap show any of the wire? Maybe you can drill and break it into multiple pieces? If the access hole gives a clear shot to the wire?

 

[dgr321]

Unfortunately the wire does not move as I rotate the end cap CW or CCW. It stays in the position as is shown.

 

[dgr321]

Finally got the Wire out and the cylinder apart. Used a center punch to slowly work the exposed part of the wire. There was not much wire exposed but enough that I could get a little area to make contact with and start to work it out. So with the center punch, hammer, PB Blaster, heat, spin the rod holder, and repeat it slowly started to move. It took a couple of hours but then I could finally get some pliers on it. Now on to the seals.

 

[beenthere]

Thanks for reporting back with your success and method used. Your persistence and McGuyver approach paid off. :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

 

[dgr321]

Back together and back in business. Took a little work to get the broken wire piece out of the hole in the rod holder with my available tools. But got it cleaned up and back together. No leaks so far.

 

[kennyd]

Thanks for the update DGR :thumbsup:

 

[dgr321]

Thought I'd update this thread since I had to repair another cylinder recently (a few more and I might get the hang of it). This one came apart like it was supposed to. The wire came out nicely (Don't be afraid to put some muscle into it - took a pipe wrench - and an extra pipe) and cylinder came apart as it should.

Also want to show the parts that I used and the orientation of the seals for the inner bore. I could not find a good picture in the JD info online regarding seal orientation so this shows the orientation I used. Back together and so far so good.