Backhoe 3pt backhoe to tractor "mis-match"

[Kaliburz]

3pt backhoe to tractor \"mis-match\"

Not sure if this is the right section to post in, but .... here I go.

I purchased an 'old' Kelley B-20 3pt hitch backhoe from a surplus equipment auction from the local school district. I converted the hydraulic system over to closed center for use on my John Deere tractors (older ones- 2240, 2640, 2030, 3020, etc).

Any how, I was going to try to mount it on my 2030 orchard/vineyard version tractor, and there is a problem. The seat on the backhoe looks as if it will hit the roll guard assembly on the tractor. /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif The 2030 has one of the collapsible guards, slides up and down and it's right behind the driver's seat (not the axle mounted roll guards). When I backed it up, the lift arms were about 1' away, and the seat was nearly right up against it...

I'm at a loss here. I recall this backhoe mounted on a tractor at the school and I don't recall the seat being that close, granted, it might have been. Heck, I used it when I was in school......some time ago.

Any suggestions to my problem? /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif I don't want to remove the roll guard. I was thinking of making an adapter to mount onto the backhoe to get it moved back far enough to clear. The back hoe is the 3pt type where you remove the adjustable center link, as the unit has a ridgid set up once attatched. I'll try to post some pics when I get some time......

(I wonder if this is what I get for buying old, used and cheap.... /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif)

 

[beenthere]

Re: 3pt backhoe to tractor \"mis-match\"

Do you remember what tractor the hoe was mounted to when you drove it at school?

I would think removing the ROPS would be the option I would take, as long as it isn't a pain and can (will) be replaced when the hoe is removed.

Pics would be great.

 

[Henro]

Re: 3pt backhoe to tractor \"mis-match\"

<font color="blue"> I would think removing the ROPS would be the option I would take, as long as it isn't a pain and can (will) be replaced when the hoe is removed. </font>

Additionally, removing the ROPS may have another advantage when using the backhoe on your 3PH...It won't be there to squash you if the backhoe somehow breaks off the 3PH for some unknown reason.

There have been deaths resulting from 3PH backhoes lifting off the 3PH and smashing the operator between the seat and the ROPS. My Kubota backhoe has a "limiter bar" which is there to keep the hoe from going up if the top-link attach point would fail. You may want to look at this kind of design for yours.

Also, my tractor has some additional brackets that bolt to the rear end and also to the loader frame. A sort of quasi sub frame I guess. There have been reports of tractors splitting in half, or trying to, when used with 3PH backhoes. Something to keep in mind...

Look forward to seeing some photos, by the way... /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[KiotiJohn]

Re: 3pt backhoe to tractor \"mis-match\"

One thing that comes to my mind is that maybe you can adjust the hitch arms to give you more room? Many arms have adjustment holes in them to give different lift, maybe your's does? John

 

[OkieG]

Re: 3pt backhoe to tractor \"mis-match\"

<font color="blue"> There have been deaths resulting from 3PH backhoes lifting off the 3PH and smashing the operator between the seat and the ROPS. </font>

The image that conjures up gives me the shivers!

OkieG

 

[Kaliburz]

Re: 3pt backhoe to tractor \"mis-match\"

Now that is a scarry thought..... the top link connecting point breaking..... I don't think it will break, as the OEM link is removed for the use of the backhoe. The backhoe center link is adjustable, by selecting which holes would best work for it, but that is all. No extra position for the tractor lower arms.

Removing the roll bar would be a hassell. I'm the one who put it on, and I know how heavy it is and I would rather keep it on..... Even if I put down the guard, I'm thinking it'll hit still...... Roll guard is OEM, but an after thought type. It was offered as an option to having the axle mounted roll bar (axle mounted would not work in our application)

Maybe I'll use it on my 3020 instead. It's a much larger tractor.... and the arms "should" be long enough (it's a row crop tractor). But I'll post pic...rained this afternoon/early evening....so I took a nap /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

Orginally, the school used this on a Case tractor. Don't recall the model, but it was one of the smaller ones, sized similarly to my 2030 (but not same HP).


Edit- I was looking at a PDF on Bushhog backhoes and those things are right up agains the tractor! I can see why using a backhoe on a JD w/ the new type roll guard may cause this issue I'm having....

 

[Kaliburz]

Re: 3pt backhoe to tractor \"mis-match\"

Well, I'd try to post pics, but my camera took too big of a file.....dang....and I don't know how to slim them down.

 

[Kaliburz]

Re: 3pt backhoe to tractor \"mis-match\"

All right.....found a program I had /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif to slim them to post.....

Here is the the backhoe.....

 

[Kaliburz]

Re: 3pt backhoe to tractor \"mis-match\"

Here is the tractor (this is the 2640....)

 

[Kaliburz]

Re: 3pt backhoe to tractor \"mis-match\"

And the proposed "adapter" to get the backhoe far enough back.....

 

[MarkV]

Re: 3pt backhoe to tractor \"mis-match\"

You might want to take a look at the mounting point for the upper link on the tractor side also. That looks like a fair size JD so this may not be an issue but on the Kubota B series they have an optional bracket that is stronger for using a backhoe. The backhoe can cause a great deal of stress at that upper mounting point.

MarkV

 

[Henro]

Re: 3pt backhoe to tractor \"mis-match\"

Couple thoughts which may or may not help...

With the 3PT backhoe on my B2910 Kubota, the lower lift arms do not exert any upward force when the backhoe is attached. My tractor has position control, and the position control lever is set to the lowest position. The 3PH arms essentially float at a higher position.

The backhoe seems to hang from the hardened pins used at the top link bracket. Very important that strong, hardened pins are used at the top link attachpoint. Make that VERY IMPORTANT.

I have extendable lower link arms and usually end up extending them so I can hook up the lower arms easily. When it is all hooked up, and I lift the stabilizers, the extendable lower link ends immediately click back in place. This tells me that in the transport mode, the backhoe is pivoting on the pin in the top link bracket, and pushing against the lower arms.

So I wonder if the extension that you have in mind for the lower arms will work for you? Seems to me that for it to work, it needs to be a non-rotating type of hook up. In otherwords, stiff in the direction the lower arms are pointing, so when you have the extension on you could stand on the end and it would stay where it is, and not move towards the ground...

When in use, the lower arms may find themselves mostly in tension for all I know. But I do know during normal use, while the backhoe is on the tractor and being transported as well as used for digging, that the lower arms will at times be in tension and at other times in compression so your design should allow for that.

Hope this helps... /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[Kaliburz]

Re: 3pt backhoe to tractor \"mis-match\"

The center link mount won't be an issue. JD used this "style" of tractor for a loooooooonnng time. Starting about mid 1960's with the 1010's all the way with the w/ the 55 series, which ended about the mid to late 1990's. Thirty plus years is a long time....the introduction of the 5000 series (and 5000 ten, 5000 twenty) went to a different top sensing 3pt vs lower arm sensing.

Side note- one of the most "beloved" tractors before the 5000 series came out is the last, the 55 series. The 2355N (N= narrow; 55hp@ pto, 3 cylin turbo is common here) and it's BIG brother, the 2855N (80hp@pto!!!!! 4 cylin turbo) ended the series. The 2855N is a rare beast here. I'd love to get my hands on a 2855N, especially the one w/ the mechanical front wheel drive!!! A 2855N w/ mechanical front wheel drive is a rare beast...... The closest thing to it would be a 2640 w/ 4wheel (and that's even rarer). A used 2855N 4x4 was being sold at a dealers for $25,000 (w/ loader......and get this, it ONLY HAD 550 HOURS!!!!)

A used 2355N 4x4 runs anywhere from $7,000 to $14,000 (the 7K is like what the trade in cost would be, if a dealer lets it out the door for what he gave for it....and it's still in a "needs work" condition).

Enough w/ the historical detour.........

The OEM pin for the center link to conect the tractor looks small, but it can lift a 3 bottom plow.....w/ no problems. That is a hardened, hardened pin.

The 2640 came in two verions, the Orchard/Vineyard (as seen) and a row crop tractor. Heck, its 70hp at the pto..... /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif and it weights like 5500lbs dry...(doesn't help when with calcium filled 16.9R24 tires)..... /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

I plan to make the adapter/extension rigid. Bacically an extension of the backhoe frame..... I just never thought about the roll guard being in the way.... I guess it would have eventually come up, weither I bought a used or new...... as most 3pt backhoes seem to mount fairly close....