Zero Turn Mower Questions

[PT_4WD]

Hello,

I have been considering purchasing a zero turn. Mowing with my Case 448 and 4' deck can take as long as 8-8.5 hours in view of the bumpy, sloped terrain, density, and high growth rate or several parts of my lawn. I mow close to 3.5 acres. I see no means to purchase a new zero turn as these are out of sight expensive. However, I am finding a good sampling of low hour used machines within a reasonable driving distance from my home. By 'low hour' I mean 600 h and below but my definition could be flawed. Please guide me on some of these issues I'm navigating:

1) Hydraulics - Some of the used machines I have identified feature independent pumps and motors. I have maintained both types of hydraulic systems for neighbors and used these same zero turns. Is this considered inferior technology by any measure of the phrase? I do not consider these pump/motor systems bad. I have read generic comments that lend suspicion to the presence of hoses but I'm uncertain if these perspectives are legitimate.

2) Suspension upgrades to a ZTR that lacks suspension. How well does the ZGlide and any type of suspension seat help with my bumpy terrain? The standard in ride comfort for terrain like mine seems to be Ferris. I have read repeatedly the Toro MyRide system is supposed to make a considerable improvement above the ZTR that lacks any form of suspension but we're all different and I have no means to evaluate the MyRide system.

I am forcing myself to restrict my attention to commercial machines that have been used for personal use only or commercial machines with limited use. Presumably, the better technology will help in all regards. For example if I purchase a system with transmissions I think the HG ZT-3100 is the minimum level I should purchase so I'm focusing on the ZT-3200 machines. I do not yet understand the limitations of the pump/motor systems but I'm still working on this.

Regardless, this is an expensive purchase.

 

[Carl_NH]

Short answer - you are on the right track.
Ride:
- Ferris is the better/best of the pack for ride/suspension
- A suspension seat will make most machines comfortable - and you can easily add these too.
- A larger machine like Kubota diesels are reported to have a good ride over rougher ground but are $$$
- machines with larger tires are smoother

Hydraulics:
- The parker wheel motor and hydro gear pumps as separate units were the "standard" for commercial units for years. And IMO are better than "all in one" but that's subjective.
- These setups usually have a oil tank and filter setup and you can smell the oil - if its burnt smelling that's not good
- As you have noted correctly HydroGear 3200 and higher are more commercial all in one, and with care last a while.

Age and Hours:
- 600 hrs and under agree is a good number, and I like Kawasaki engines on these machines, but the Briggs commercial big block with the oil system seem to work good - but ai have no first hand experience.
- Brands - Scag, Exmark, Toro, Ferris, Kubota all make excellent commercial machines most lawn care co's run the scag/exmark. Personal use of these commercial machines is common for larger properties and they can be found with low hours - 2-400 - and 10 years old.

Overall I would expect you can find a very good commercial ZT for $4-6K range. What's your budget or target ?

 

[CloverKnollFarms]

Wow, you will save a lot of time. I have a 72" commercial Hustler and I can mow 3.5 acres very leisurely in 2 hours!

 

[JTKub]

8.5hrs of mowing. That's got to be a lot of fuel burned with the old Case 440. You'll save time and money on fuel with a ZTR. Like said, I wouldn't shy away from the ZT-3100s.

 

[jyoutz]

One bit of information. Stihl is selling the identical Ferris machine with suspension. It is simply a rebadged and repainted Ferris, but there are more Stihl dealerships than Ferris. The suspension is a game changer and I wouldn’t own a machine without it.

 

[zzvyb6]

There are other "zero turn" mowers that do a very good job and serve other purposes. I Have a JD F-935 with an 78" front mounted rear discharge deck that handlesvery tall grass, leaves, sticks, etc. It can run my Winpower pto generator, broom, snow blower and pull a large dual axle trailer. I also have a JD 1435, runs a 72" deck, the broom, and my PTO generator. It can move at 12 mph (measured by my driveway radar sign gadget). Both are diesels with Yanmar motors. They both start on the second revolution after sitting for 5 months or more. The broom also serves my snow clearing needs on an 800' driveway and windrows leaves very nicely. both are 26 hp and sip fuel much better than my friend's ExMark with a Kubota motor. Her Toro gas equivalent uses a LOT of gasoline. (about twice as much by volume).

Both of mine have a steering wheel. Don't laugh, I drive them with 1 hand and can make use of the built in drink holders.
Around here F935s go for about $2500 and the newer 1435's for about $5k

 

[Shawn T. W.]

I also went used commercial Z-turn, 1300 hours on this John Deere Z-Trak Z960M ... 31 HP Kawasaki gas ... Burns roughly 2 gallons an hours! (1400+hrs now!)

But it cuts the grass! It has a suspension seat, and I run the rear 24" tires at 10 PSI, it has separate filters in each drive motor that share a common reservoir ...

Much better cut than a brush hog! Faster too!

6 acre field, no obstacle's ... 2 hours, 6 gallons of 91 octane no-ethanol gas!

Takes about 40 minutes to go around the 1.5 acres of house just regular mowing ... But also pulls extra duty too!

Same 6 acre field, Kubota L5030 with 52" tires at 10 PSI and suspension seat, with 90" rear finish mower ... 1.75 hours, less than 3 gallons of off-road diesel, cab makes it very comfortable, no bugs, grass/dust flying, A/C is handy too, less noise! (I NEED to wear ear plugs once I engage Z-turn blades!!)

 

[Tractor2011]

Whatever brand you choose pay close attention to the transmission. Some of the less expensive zero turn mowers have weak transmissions, some non-serviceable. As always, ya pay for what ya get.

 

[fatjay]

I have a zd21 kubota with 60" deck. It's genuinely fuel sipping. The suspension is in the seat and it's a really good feeling seat. I don't feel anything. For the smooth bits I can mow flat out at 11mph, then turn on a dime and do it again.

My father bought a cub cadet zero turn, and it's transmission is jerky and doesn't feel good.

Two different classes of machines, I know. But they are deeply different from each other. I've been running my kubota for 5+ years now and plan to keep it going for another 20. I couldn't imagine that cub cadet zero turn lasting that long, nor would I want it to. Such an unpleasant thing to mow on.

 

[lej]

Hello,

I have been considering purchasing a zero turn. Mowing with my Case 448 and 4' deck can take as long as 8-8.5 hours in view of the bumpy, sloped terrain, density, and high growth rate or several parts of my lawn. I mow close to 3.5 acres. I see no means to purchase a new zero turn as these are out of sight expensive. However, I am finding a good sampling of low hour used machines within a reasonable driving distance from my home. By 'low hour' I mean 600 h and below but my definition could be flawed. Please guide me on some of these issues I'm navigating:

1) Hydraulics - Some of the used machines I have identified feature independent pumps and motors. I have maintained both types of hydraulic systems for neighbors and used these same zero turns. Is this considered inferior technology by any measure of the phrase? I do not consider these pump/motor systems bad. I have read generic comments that lend suspicion to the presence of hoses but I'm uncertain if these perspectives are legitimate.

2) Suspension upgrades to a ZTR that lacks suspension. How well does the ZGlide and any type of suspension seat help with my bumpy terrain? The standard in ride comfort for terrain like mine seems to be Ferris. I have read repeatedly the Toro MyRide system is supposed to make a considerable improvement above the ZTR that lacks any form of suspension but we're all different and I have no means to evaluate the MyRide system.

I am forcing myself to restrict my attention to commercial machines that have been used for personal use only or commercial machines with limited use. Presumably, the better technology will help in all regards. For example if I purchase a system with transmissions I think the HG ZT-3100 is the minimum level I should purchase so I'm focusing on the ZT-3200 machines. I do not yet understand the limitations of the pump/motor systems but I'm still working on this.

Regardless, this is an expensive purchase.

We have a Ferris and do not regret buying it. We used to take 6 1/2 hours to mow with the old John Deere and now it takes three hours. We mow 12acres. I mow around trees with old JD. Beautiful cut at full speed and smooth ride!

 

[JJT]

I have a zd21 kubota with 60" deck. It's genuinely fuel sipping. The suspension is in the seat and it's a really good feeling seat. I don't feel anything. For the smooth bits I can mow flat out at 11mph, then turn on a dime and do it again.

My father bought a cub cadet zero turn, and it's transmission is jerky and doesn't feel good.

Two different classes of machines, I know. But they are deeply different from each other. I've been running my kubota for 5+ years now and plan to keep it going for another 20. I couldn't imagine that cub cadet zero turn lasting that long, nor would I want it to. Such an unpleasant thing to mow on.

I've had my zd21 for more than 20 years and expect it to outlive me. Highly recommended machine.

 

[John0829]

All I will say about going from a 3 point finish mower to a ZT is that unless the ground is reasonably smooth a ZT, EVEN WITH SUSPENSION, will beat you to death.

I mow old horse pasture with dips and sways and washed out mole runs and switched to using my ExMark with the best suspension seat they offered to "speed" things up. After one year I was back to using the tractor, bought a wider cut finish mower and I can cut as fast using the tractor on the field as I can with the ZT and still stay in the seat. On smooth ground the ZT will win for speed of cut but big tires equal better ride over un-smooth ground.

And for the record the Woods finish mower leaves just as nice a cut as the ZT. I have made side by side cuts and other than width of track you could not tell which cut belonged to which mower. This from my SIL who is picky about mowing.

 

[tradosaurus]

I would suggest visiting ZT dealerships just to sit in and get the feel of the seat. You might be surprised that with 0% financing you can afford a new ZT.
I have a Toro Titan HD 2000 with the MyRide. My only regret is not getting the HD 4000 with a bigger motor.

 

[CH4Ohio]

And for the record the Woods finish mower leaves just as nice a cut as the ZT. I have made side by side cuts and other than width of track you could not tell which cut belonged to which mower. This from my SIL who is picky about mowing.

If you don't mind, what model Woods finish mower are you using?? Thanks!

 

[Nightowl66]

I bought a used JD F725 20 years ago and used it up until last year, deck finally rusted out. About 5 years ago I bought a used Simplicity with the suspension, same as Ferris and didn't like the ride, my yard is very rough, ended up selling it. The JD was a smoother ride. I ended up buying a used Grasshopper 620 z turn with the deck out front this year and really like it. When I was shopping for a z turn this spring, I had a dealer tell me if I didn't like the simplicity I wont like any zero turn with the deck underneath. If the deck is out front you get a smoother ride.

 

[Mister3]

I'd recommend a used hustler hyperdrive, superZ or dieselZ.

This guy does alot of mower comparisons, check out his videos, covers almost all available mowers on the market

 

[Suburban Plowboy]

Regarding Kubota diesel suspensions, I have a ZD326, and my rear end goes BANG BANG BANG BANG all the way across the yard.

Okay, maybe I should clarify that.

 

[AnotherBueller]

Short answer - you are on the right track.
Ride:
- Ferris is the better/best of the pack for ride/suspension
- A suspension seat will make most machines comfortable - and you can easily add these too.
- A larger machine like Kubota diesels are reported to have a good ride over rougher ground but are $$$
- machines with larger tires are smoother

Hydraulics:
- The parker wheel motor and hydro gear pumps as separate units were the "standard" for commercial units for years. And IMO are better than "all in one" but that's subjective.
- These setups usually have a oil tank and filter setup and you can smell the oil - if its burnt smelling that's not good
- As you have noted correctly HydroGear 3200 and higher are more commercial all in one, and with care last a while.

Age and Hours:
- 600 hrs and under agree is a good number, and I like Kawasaki engines on these machines, but the Briggs commercial big block with the oil system seem to work good - but ai have no first hand experience.
- Brands - Scag, Exmark, Toro, Ferris, Kubota all make excellent commercial machines most lawn care co's run the scag/exmark. Personal use of these commercial machines is common for larger properties and they can be found with low hours - 2-400 - and 10 years old.

Overall I would expect you can find a very good commercial ZT for $4-6K range. What's your budget or target ?

Any of the listed Z-turns with a diesel are long life commercial grade machines. If you look on utube for Kubota D1211 these are very well regarded, one presenter showed his two that he's used commercially for about 20 years. Locally the mowing companies who keep their equipment really like the Ferris diesel. The rest trade every year with a deep fleet discount.

 

[Grumpycat]

I have a preference for Bad Boy because I have an excellent dealer.

Is my suspicion brands slap the “commercial” label on at a certain price level, not necessary when the unit is made sturdier. All Bad Boy mowers are built strong, generally with higher duty transmissions than others in their price class.

When looking for longevity you want serviceable transmissions with oil tanks and filters.

Kawasaki makes the best gasoline engines.

 

[Suburban Plowboy]

Whatever weird design issues my old Kubota may have, I have to say it shows how different a commercial mower can be from a Home Depot job. Kubota put heavy steel all through it. When I step onto the deck to get into the seat, the deck plate seems unaware I'm putting my weight on it.

The frame and so on will last forever. I think the main thing that limits longevity is Kubota's willingness to keep making parts.