2A Limestone for driveway

[General Lee]

What's everyone's opinion opinion on 2A limestone for a driveway? Typically I use asphalt millings (cheapest) but because of the shaded road, the millings really don't pack well and don't last very long. Looking for something that packs better and gets a little more solid. Not thrilled with the dust that comes along with 2A, crap sticks to everything, I assume with some time that gets settled down in and is not a problem?

 

[Lineman North Florida]

I don't know what 2A is but I have had a limerock driveway for about 20 years and every now and then I will patch a pot hole that has gotten beat out but other than that it has held up outstanding, but I didn't put it 3" thick 20 years ago when I did it , I put it about 6" thick which I believe made the difference. I have also put in quite a few for customers since I retired and started my skid steer business without any complaints.

 

[deezler]

I don't think the dust issue ever goes away with 2a limestone. If you have a dry summer stretch, it will be dusty. Not to mention muddy and splattery when wet. With occasional potholes that hold water.

In my opinion this is all primarily because the fines in the mix. Which is why I keep my driveway topped off with clean, washed limestone only. I don't mind that the top stones move around a bit, I can dress it back up with the tractor, maybe twice a year when needed.

We have a ~24" frost depth currently here in Michigan, so it's going to be a long muddy spring thaw for us gravel driveway folks... ugh.

 

[dieselscout80]

If slag is available where you are that’s what I would use unless you have it paved.

 

[General Lee]

If slag is available where you are that’s what I would use unless you have it paved.

Not really sure what slag is, chipped up slate? Also paving is not an option, it's a shared private lane and the few others won't pitch in for that cost. I'm usually the one doing the maintenance on the road and it's reached the point it needs more material. I was going to use the limestone where my property begins first and see how it goes before using it on the rest. Total length is about 1/3 mile.

 

[dieselscout80]

Slag is the splatter from a steel mill.

It’s great because it’s dust free and is heavier than gravel so water doesn’t really wash it away.

 

[ponytug]

Slag is the splatter from a steel mill.

It’s great because it’s dust free and is heavier than gravel so water doesn’t really wash it away.

And it is somewhat cementitious, so if the slag gets spread, packed, and then watered, it tends to "set" really well.

2A Limestone (e.g. also known as 1" minus) can be spread and used, but I think that ideally it really benefits from watering, and compaction. Thicker is better, but the spread layers should not exceed whatever you are using for compaction. It will always have some dust, but I think that is a bit dependent on your local weather (e.g. how often it rains), and how well it was/is compacted.

All the best,

Peter

 

[dieselscout80]

And it is somewhat cementitious, so if the slag gets spread, packed, and then watered, it tends to "set" really well.

All the best,

Peter

Yes it does bond together hard if you put a bunch down/thick. I’m not sure if it would stay solid if you are driving on it though.

I made pad about 6” thick and it is almost like a concrete slab except for some loose stuff on the very top.

 

[paulsharvey]

So, without knowing anything about 2A limestone, ill speak on RAP/asphalt millings. They are expensive down here, atleast $40/T delivered, where limerock is half that.

Anyways, millings dont really "set" the way folks talk about. They have very little AC content left, and sun isnt enough to melt it anyways. They are Low dust, and erosion resistant; but they arent magic. Lay 6", prime and sand, and you get a good product. Even skipping prime and sand; thickness and subgrade are key. That does go with any base material; be it limerock, limestone, superpave asphalt base, ect.

So, my point is, if millings are cheaper, and arent holding up, I think there is another issue; drainage, subgrade, or thickness.

 

[paulsharvey]

Not really sure what slag is, chipped up slate? Also paving is not an option, it's a shared private lane and the few others won't pitch in for that cost. I'm usually the one doing the maintenance on the road and it's reached the point it needs more material. I was going to use the limestone where my property begins first and see how it goes before using it on the rest. Total length is about 1/3 mile.

Slag is a bi product of steel and iron foundries. Its like a cross between glass and lava rock.

 

[paulsharvey]

Not really sure what slag is, chipped up slate? Also paving is not an option, it's a shared private lane and the few others won't pitch in for that cost. I'm usually the one doing the maintenance on the road and it's reached the point it needs more material. I was going to use the limestone where my property begins first and see how it goes before using it on the rest. Total length is about 1/3 mile.

So, are you at the back of the 1/3rd i assume? I wouldn't be adding material to a private road for others benefit.

So, one frequent mistake made by folks on this forum, is messing with a driveway. If its not terrible, stop grading it, stop shaping it, stop cutting the grass off the quarter crown, ect. Every time you grade, you loosen and lose your material. That grass on the center strip or the edges might not be a "pretty" gravel drive, but it isnt hurting anything.

If you do add material on top, of an existing, compacted drive, you need to make sure your adding atleast 4" or you need to scarify the existing to get them to act as one unit.

For 1/3 mile, at 12 ft wide, I get 2350 square yards. Figure 100#/sy/inch of thickness, as a rough estimate of impact, compact material; we are at 470 tons... thats a lot of money, even if rock is cheap there

 

[General Lee]

So, are you at the back of the 1/3rd i assume? I wouldn't be adding material to a private road for others benefit.

So, one frequent mistake made by folks on this forum, is messing with a driveway. If its not terrible, stop grading it, stop shaping it, stop cutting the grass off the quarter crown, ect. Every time you grade, you loosen and lose your material. That grass on the center strip or the edges might not be a "pretty" gravel drive, but it isnt hurting anything.

If you do add material on top, of an existing, compacted drive, you need to make sure your adding atleast 4" or you need to scarify the existing to get them to act as one unit.

For 1/3 mile, at 12 ft wide, I get 2350 square yards. Figure 100#/sy/inch of thickness, as a rough estimate of impact, compact material; we are at 470 tons... thats a lot of money, even if rock is cheap there

Yes, I'm at the end. Myself and another neighbor add asphalt millings as needed, here and there in spots about once every two years, a dump truck or two loads. We got fed up being the only ones chipping in for the road, so we let it go. now it's filled with pot holes. Been debating on taking the box blade with scarifiers down and regrading. Not sure sure that's the best way. It is to remove the potholes, but I'll be disturbing the base.

 

[Lineman North Florida]

So, are you at the back of the 1/3rd i assume? I wouldn't be adding material to a private road for others benefit.

So, one frequent mistake made by folks on this forum, is messing with a driveway. If its not terrible, stop grading it, stop shaping it, stop cutting the grass off the quarter crown, ect. Every time you grade, you loosen and lose your material. That grass on the center strip or the edges might not be a "pretty" gravel drive, but it isnt hurting anything.

If you do add material on top, of an existing, compacted drive, you need to make sure your adding atleast 4" or you need to scarify the existing to get them to act as one unit.

For 1/3 mile, at 12 ft wide, I get 2350 square yards. Figure 100#/sy/inch of thickness, as a rough estimate of impact, compact material; we are at 470 tons... thats a lot of money, even if rock is cheap there

Down here where you and I are it would be a little over $100k in material cost.

 

[paulsharvey]

Yes, I'm at the end. Myself and another neighbor add asphalt millings as needed, here and there in spots about once every two years, a dump truck or two loads. We got fed up being the only ones chipping in for the road, so we let it go. now it's filled with pot holes. Been debating on taking the box blade with scarifiers down and regrading. Not sure sure that's the best way. It is to remove the potholes, but I'll be disturbing the base.

So, it sounds like two seperate possible directions to go. #1; scarify and add a bit in bad areas, hopefully not the entire thing, and if possible I would try to stay with millings, especially since you said they are cheaper (confirm first, prices skyrocketed a few years ago, like from $400/load to $1200/load). #2; deal specifically with the pot holes. Dont know what equipment you have available, but try to square the hole up, maybe a few inches beyond the edge, clean up sides, and add material to just the hole.

Redoing the entire 1/3 mile, unless your in a deeper part of the budget pool then most, just isnt realistic. Im getting right around $16,000 at the cheapest, with my areas prices, including trucking.

Edit: That $16,000; is material, dumped, and thats it, not graded, rolled, or anything else; and to top it off, its not a permanent, one and done solution either...

 

[paulsharvey]

Now, "mid atlantic" as the area, not sure what other options might be around there? We have ball field clay/sand clay, that works well, is cheap, but get slimy in rain, and stains everything, but makes a good base.

Recycled concrete might be either very expensive or cheap in your area, and thats a good product.

If the base is good, just pot holed, an option may be to scarify, regrade, roll, and chip seal, IF you can get some cost participation from neighbors. If you have chip seal contractors in your part of the world, and base is solid, it could be a "permanent" solution for between $5.25 and $10 per square yards. So, something like hiring a company to grade, roll, and chip seal, might be in the $35k range, and its done for the next 15 years.

 

[paulsharvey]

Upload some pictures when you get a chance maybe. Might give us an idea on how bad we are talking.

 

[paulsharvey]

Chip seal is a lot cheaper then asphalt, but a double application chip seal (asphalt, 1/2" rock, roll, asphalt, and then 3/8" rock), makes for a decent traction, all weather, 15 year road, that can be re chip sealed or tacked and paved, for about 30% the cost of 1.5" of super pave. It doesnt have the traction of asphalt when wet, but its decent.

It does fine on low traffic (sub 1000 vehicles per day), low speed (35mph or less) roads.

Im Only suggesting this if there are maybe 5-10 folks that are willing to pitch in atleast a few grand, or if the drive has county/city maintenance, and they will charge by parcel passed or by LF of frontage.

 

[General Lee]

So, it sounds like two seperate possible directions to go. #1; scarify and add a bit in bad areas, hopefully not the entire thing, and if possible I would try to stay with millings, especially since you said they are cheaper (confirm first, prices skyrocketed a few years ago, like from $400/load to $1200/load). #2; deal specifically with the pot holes. Dont know what equipment you have available, but try to square the hole up, maybe a few inches beyond the edge, clean up sides, and add material to just the hole.

Redoing the entire 1/3 mile, unless your in a deeper part of the budget pool then most, just isnt realistic. Im getting right around $16,000 at the cheapest, with my areas prices, including trucking.

Edit: That $16,000; is material, dumped, and thats it, not graded, rolled, or anything else; and to top it off, its not a permanent, one and done solution either...

No, no Lol, I won't be doing the whole thing. There are a couple sections 50 yards long or so that need the attention. I originally asked about the limestone to possibly try and see how well it works and as time goes on, add to the other areas if it holds up. For "my" section of the road, the last 200 yards or so I'd like to try something other than milling. Milling has been ok, I just need a fresh topping of something. The millings don't stick well, my road section is shaded, so it's just like loose rock. Mind as well just use pea gravel.

I've got a rear blade, box blade, rake and an excavator with a front blade.