New 2025 Ram 1500 with hurricane engine.

[jyoutz]

Exactly. Especially when we have bureaucrats out there who have the power to mandate that manufacturers can make only electric vehicles after a certain date. This is especially telling after hearing from my relatives back in Pennsylvania where the power is out due to storms and won't be back on for a week or so. So you'd charge your electrical vehicle how?? These same bureaucrats are now proposing to ban the use of gas stoves and furnaces. This isn't about politics - it is about people in power that have no common sense.


I have a Dodge/Cummins dually with the manual 6 speed transmission. Super stout unit - I have no doubt that transmission will never give me a problem. But...in stop-and-go traffic, in a city with a lot of stop light and stop signs, I find myself wishing the truck were an automatic. That old 6 speed is not a slick shifter - slow and deliberate is how you shift it. I find myself holding up traffic, trying to get the truck up to speed. In slow speed maneuvering I have to shift the transfer case into low range to keep from slipping the clutch too much. Something the torque converter would alleviate, with the automatic. And from what I read, the new automatics they are putting in the heavy duty trucks these days are excellent and will hold up to the torque the engines can put out. The last few years that Ram put manual transmissions in trucks, the engine power was derated to protect the transmission. Not so with the automatic.

I had a 1999 Dodge Cummins with manual transmission. One day I was pulling a stock trailer down the interstate and the transmission seized up on me. Unbeknownst to me, the case had developed a crack and all the fluid drained out. The transmission was completely seized and I bought a rebuilt one for replacement. Manual transmissions aren’t bulletproof.

 

[ruffdog]

Engine has been out now for 3 years in the jeep wagoner.So no NOT a new engine.

The only thing I heard about the hurricane engine was an issue with the thermostat and t-stat housing. It doesn't look like a plain ol t-stat either. A small part would break off and keep the t-stat from opening and cause overheating. I would assume that the issue has been addressed.

 

[mrmikey]

It doesn't look like a plain ol t-stat either.

No it's not. One of the comments I heard was that the old wax bulb worked fine for decades, why change it.

 

[WinterDeere]

I like ya bro, but you lost me on that one. I’ve driven manual plow trucks and automatic plow trucks and automatics were way better in snow.

Probably true. But I’m just driving, not plowing. You already know our conditions around here are that half-plowed and rutted crap where your tires spend 60% of their time on bare pavement and 40% of their time on drifted snow or compacted ice. So, leaving it in 4wd is usually not an option, and we end up driving our 4wd pickups around in 2wd more often than not on snow days. With manual trans in these conditions, I know within a fraction of a second when the rear tires have lost traction, but with automatic it’s almost completely undetectable until the rear starts walking on you.

I always had manual pickups, until buying the current truck in 2017. The following year I had the pleasure of coming around a long sweeping bend in the road, one of those 1/2 mile arcs to turn just 30 degrees, and didn’t even realize the rear had broken loose in a surprise slippery patch, until it started walking around on me. That just won’t happen with manual transmission, if you’re paying attention, as you hear and feel it in the RPM’s change before inertia allows the vehicle to walk any noticeable amount. In manual I’d have let off the gas and seen the vehicle correct, rather than playing the game of steering into the slide at 35 mph that I was having to do in the automatic.

Like Peter said, different strokes for different folks, but I really prefer manual for driving in the type of snow we get around here, especially on heavily-traveled and rutted winding country roads that dominate our area.

Manual transmissions aren’t bulletproof.

Auto’s definitely have higher initial strength, the clutch usually being the weak link on manual gear trains. But auto’s also have more costly and frequent need for repair.

I love the 8HP-90 in my Charger, it’s easily the best auto trans I’ve ever owned. But it’s also a lot less fun than manual. I almost bought a Challenger, a 2-door vehicle at a time when I was still strapping two kids into car seats for every ride, just because it was the only one available with a manual.

 

[Panik]

I had a thought... perhaps not a particularly well thought out or good thought... and certainly not one directed at anyone here...

Grew up in the 80's and 90's... learned how to drive on a manual and also was part of the younger drivers who came up through the advancement/transition to ABS, drum to disc, traction control, etc type of developments for personal vehicles. Dad drove a mid-80's BMW 325i until he passed in '98 and could float/slip/dead shift with complete confidence - in fact that's how he got around while being in full left leg casts after knee surgery.

I wonder if, for people (again not anyone here), some of the nostalgia & view that manual transmissions are better in rough conditions is more about the perception of control as opposed to reality... I.e that because manuals are broadly simpler than todays computerized and synchronized traction, braking, shifting system it's easier to understand how a vehicle would behave under a known set of conditions?

I'm basing that question/observation that on my own experiences with adapting to the behavior of nascent ABS & traction control systems in heavy Florida rains when I was younger. I can certainly remember being caught off-guard by the behavior of computerized braking/traction when attempting controlled hard stops in poor conditions because I was used to driving without those features.

** Edit: ...And for reference, I keep threatening my wife that my dream vehicle when the kids get out of the house and we might have a bit of disposable income is to get either a used manual Mazda Miata/MX-5, or an older manual beater jeep that I can take the doors and top off of and drive as a 3-season vehicle.

 

[Hay Dude]

I think the perception of manuals being “tougher” than autos comes from 2 sources

1. Hardcore OTR truckers use them. This is primarily for finding “just the right gear” and maximizing fuel economy. Maybe a little “machismo”. Manuals also get better fuel economy because of less parasitic loss.

2. 70’s-90’s automatics were weaker and had fewer gears. They were pretty bad in lighter vehicles like pickups. They needed more service and frequent replacements.

Today’s computer solenoid controlled automatics are much tougher and have more gears. Aisin, Allison & ZF have really improved the light truck automatic.

Same thing is going on with farm tractors and off road equipment. The CVT transmission is overtaking the powershift transmission.

Once you drive one, you will never go back.

 

[Hay Dude]

I had a thought... perhaps not a particularly well thought out or good thought... and certainly not one directed at anyone here...

Grew up in the 80's and 90's... learned how to drive on a manual and also was part of the younger drivers who came up through the advancement/transition to ABS, drum to disc, traction control, etc type of developments for personal vehicles. Dad drove a mid-80's BMW 325i until he passed in '98 and could float/slip/dead shift with complete confidence - in fact that's how he got around while being in full left leg casts after knee surgery.

I wonder if, for people (again not anyone here), some of the nostalgia & view that manual transmissions are better in rough conditions is more about the perception of control as opposed to reality... I.e that because manuals are broadly simpler than todays computerized and synchronized traction, braking, shifting system it's easier to understand how a vehicle would behave under a known set of conditions?

I'm basing that question/observation that on my own experiences with adapting to the behavior of nascent ABS & traction control systems in heavy Florida rains when I was younger. I can certainly remember being caught off-guard by the behavior of computerized braking/traction when attempting controlled hard stops in poor conditions because I was used to driving without those features.

** Edit: ...And for reference, I keep threatening my wife that my dream vehicle when the kids get out of the house and we might have a bit of disposable income is to get either a used manual Mazda Miata/MX-5, or an older manual beater jeep that I can take the doors and top off of and drive as a 3-season vehicle.

HAH, Me too! I drove my SIL’s old Miata and loved it.

 

[Panik]

I think the perception of manuals being “tougher” than autos comes from 2 sources

1. Hardcore OTR truckers use them. This is primarily for finding “just the right gear” and maximizing fuel economy. Maybe a little “machismo”. Manuals also get better fuel economy because of less parasitic loss.

2. 70’s-90’s automatics were weaker and had fewer gears. They were pretty bad in lighter vehicles like pickups. They needed more service and frequent replacements.

Today’s computer solenoid controlled automatics are much tougher and have more gears. Aisin, Allison & ZF have really improved the light truck automatic.

Same thing is going on with farm tractors and off road equipment. The CVT transmission is overtaking the powershift transmission.

Once you drive one, you will never go back.

Agreed, and at the same time to play a bit of devil's advocate regarding perceptions... it doesn't help things that manufacturers are still, on occasion, putting automatic-transmissions on the market that can be problematic. As example GM's transmission issues with the 2014 model year 1/2 tons.

There is some personal bias in that statement.. Had a 2014 Sierra that ate 1 transmission under warranty, another at ~150K and then another around 180K after I sold the truck to my mechanic due to AFM issues.

 

[DarkBlack]

Every automatic truck transmission made in the last 10 years or so, utilize lockup converters. Once your transmission is warmed up, the torque converter is put in lockup mode when you’re driving along. It’s incorrect to state an automatic transmission doesn’t give an engine sound and engine rpm tied to wheel speed on snowy roads.

 

[WinterDeere]

I think the perception of manuals being “tougher” than autos comes from 2 sources

1. Hardcore OTR truckers use them. This is primarily for finding “just the right gear” and maximizing fuel economy. Maybe a little “machismo”. Manuals also get better fuel economy because of less parasitic loss.

2. 70’s-90’s automatics were weaker and had fewer gears. They were pretty bad in lighter vehicles like pickups. They needed more service and frequent replacements.

Today’s computer solenoid controlled automatics are much tougher and have more gears. Aisin, Allison & ZF have really improved the light truck automatic.

Same thing is going on with farm tractors and off road equipment. The CVT transmission is overtaking the powershift transmission.

Once you drive one, you will never go back.

I agree with everything you say here, Hay Dude... except that lest statement. I want to go back.

Yeah, I know some (not most) auto's are far better than manual, in almost every way. We can disagree on the bad weather thing, that probably comes down to driver personality as much as anything, but on all other points today's best auto's will always win. Even under nearly all racing conditions, the autos win.

But I still prefer manual. I also live in a 300 year old house, probably one of the top ten most impractical domiciles in southeastern Pennsylvania, with a maintenance and heating budget that would make most heads spin. But beauty is sometimes in the eye of the beholder, and pure practicality isn't always one's preference.

 

[paulsharvey]

Two things on transmissions; 1) the number of gear is 100% correct; my 2005 Chevy 2500hd, 6.0 Auto, 4 speed, really needed an extra gear, at 75mph I think I was turning 2400 rpm cruising. If it was a 5 or 6 speed, it probably would have really increased fuel economy.
2) OTR trucks, I think the owner operators vs the mid-large trucking companies you see a big difference; owner operators seem to care more about power, speed, and do seem to prefer manuals; but companies realize that getting there 2% slower, but saving 5% on fuel is a huge win. The drivers dont always like things like autos, super singles, governors, but in the end, even if it's a 1% savings on fuel, over a couple hundred (or even a couple dozen) trucks, that's Huge. Let's say you have a fleet burning 10,000 gal per day. 1% fuel savings is $350/day. We upscale that to say, 25,000 gal per day, we have an additional $850/day. Industry seems to report around 3-4% more efficient with manuals; add about 0.5-1% for super singles; probably 5% by governoring at 65;

It's not about your grumpy 40 year experience driver that might be able to beat the economy of a auto in his manual; it's about the 80-90% of the other drivers, that the automatic does beat the manuals for.

 

[dodge man]

I pretty much agree with Hay Dude. Automatics didn’t used to be better but now they are. I have a 2010 Challenger with an automatic and 51% of the time I’m glad it’s an automatic. The other 49% of the time I wish it was a stick. Not because it’s better but because it’s more fun.

 

[Hay Dude]

I agree with everything you say here, Hay Dude... except that lest statement. I want to go back.

Yeah, I know some (not most) auto's are far better than manual, in almost every way. We can disagree on the bad weather thing, that probably comes down to driver personality as much as anything, but on all other points today's best auto's will always win. Even under nearly all racing conditions, the autos win.

But I still prefer manual. I also live in a 300 year old house, probably one of the top ten most impractical domiciles in southeastern Pennsylvania, with a maintenance and heating budget that would make most heads spin. But beauty is sometimes in the eye of the beholder, and pure practicality isn't always one's preference.

Agree 100%.
Its all in the way it makes you feel.

One big difference I just realized is I am typically working while driving whereas you may be just able to focus on driving.

 

[Hay Dude]

Two things on transmissions; 1) the number of gear is 100% correct; my 2005 Chevy 2500hd, 6.0 Auto, 4 speed, really needed an extra gear, at 75mph I think I was turning 2400 rpm cruising. If it was a 5 or 6 speed, it probably would have really increased fuel economy.
2) OTR trucks, I think the owner operators vs the mid-large trucking companies you see a big difference; owner operators seem to care more about power, speed, and do seem to prefer manuals; but companies realize that getting there 2% slower, but saving 5% on fuel is a huge win. The drivers dont always like things like autos, super singles, governors, but in the end, even if it's a 1% savings on fuel, over a couple hundred (or even a couple dozen) trucks, that's Huge. Let's say you have a fleet burning 10,000 gal per day. 1% fuel savings is $350/day. We upscale that to say, 25,000 gal per day, we have an additional $850/day. Industry seems to report around 3-4% more efficient with manuals; add about 0.5-1% for super singles; probably 5% by governoring at 65;

It's not about your grumpy 40 year experience driver that might be able to beat the economy of a auto in his manual; it's about the 80-90% of the other drivers, that the automatic does beat the manuals for.

Fleet drivers are much less plentiful for manual transmissions.
Let’s face it, truck driving as an art, has in many ways died.
Now it’s just put a jockey in the jockey box and try to make money of him/her.

 

[ning]

Every automatic truck transmission made in the last 10 years or so, utilize lockup converters. Once your transmission is warmed up, the torque converter is put in lockup mode when you’re driving along. It’s incorrect to state an automatic transmission doesn’t give an engine sound and engine rpm tied to wheel speed on snowy roads.

I was going to say this - even my '97 with the crappy E4OD locks up. I know the instant the rear breaks, though honestly it's most often because I can detect the slight rotation of the truck. The revs will jump a bit and that's pretty damn obvious in the noisy-ish truck too.

I love manuals, but I wouldn't want one in a truck as long as you're able to specify which gear you want to be in (to some extent; with the E4OD I can specify 1 or 2, and that's sufficient for difficult low-speed work; locking out 4th (OD) if needed is sufficient for other purposes -- but if it was an 8 or 10 speed I'd want the "sport" up/down select too).

With modern transmissions and TCUs I doubt you could drive a manual with the same number of gears and get equal or better mileage. Can you imagine driving your F[12345]50 with an 8 or 10 speed manual? You'd probably only be in the best gear for any appreciable amount of time when at cruising speed; most other times you'd choose a gear and that would be "good enough for now" and skip a gear here or there. Kinda like how I ride my 1200cc 6-speed motorcycle when not feeling "sporty"... take off in 1st, jump 2nd and go to 3rd, jump 4th go to 5th or possibly straight to 6th, all at a casual pace (sport mode: 1st 2nd 3rd oh **** 100mph back off 80 good now 6th).
And if you're pitting a 5- or 6-speed manual against a modern 10-speed automatic, you're not getting close to that mileage.

The glory days of the manual transmission are over for pure functionality, it's now an aesthetic choice.

 

[not2old]

My first cars were manual transmission because I thought it would be cheaper for me to fix myself. Wouldn't want one now. My three newest vehicles all have a manual mode built in and I find myself using them to slow for curves or a downhill.

 

[Dftodd]

I haven't had experience with that setup. But I have with the ecoboost.

You will notice an issue with towing since the V6 doesn't have the low end torque that your used too.

You have to spool the turbos up to get the pulling power.

On a side note, one issue I noticed with the fords.

The latest model pickup doesn't have a manual button to kick it into tow haul mode. At least one i can find in the 1/2 hour i drove it after our salesman alsmost smoked the tranny pull8mg a 5,000lb trailer. I sure hope the other manufacturers follow suit.

The Ford has an automatic tow haul mode if it senses trailer lights and brakes.

This poses an issue when pulling something and the lights fail.

 

[paulsharvey]

"The Ford has an automatic tow haul mode if it senses trailer lights and brakes."

My new trailer does have lights, and brakes as well, but I don't have a brake controller (Dodge should have included that in the tow package imo), but we have all towed plenty without lights, brakes, tags, or air in the trailer tires. Ford might not want to out think the redneck in us

 

[mrmikey]

(Dodge should have included that in the tow package imo)

Serious? They don't include a brake controller, glad my '19's got one then.

 

[dodge man]

My 2017 F150 came with a tow package but no brake controller, I paid to add a factory one.