Lessons from this year's snowmageddon

[5030]

Question for you/anyone...

Regarding PTO speed. I've wondered about getting a PTO generator. Do I want an IH 1066 screaming outside my window at pto speed? Not if I don't have to (it's got a straight pipe).

I use a hydraulically powered mower behind the tractor. As such, the mower "requires" a 4x "speed increaser" where it jumps the PTO speed up by 4x.

My understanding is the generator has to be at a specific RPM (or maybe a specific range, I don't really know) If the generator kicks in, pulls RPM's down on the tractor, it messes with the 60 Hz thing, I think. I understand that's not good.

With a tractor the size of the 1066, (I think it's 100 hp on the pto, or was it 125? I don't recall)

Is there a way to get a smaller generator than the 1066 would handle (I know you want to match your loads) So if I needed "X" KW and that would use a 75 HP machine (and I'm making up these numbers so please, nobody get all 60 Hz on me lol) Anyway, if generator "X" is good size and it requires 75 HP, if I have 100 HP, would that give me some wiggle room on the wondering of the RPM speed? (would it be more able to maintain a steady state)

Now, bring in the speed increaser.... if I've got the 100HP available AND it will allow me to go 4x on the PTO speed AND my needs are covered in theory by say, the 75 HP machine....

Could a setup like that work? Asking for trouble? Should I just rub some sticks together?

The more you increase the pto speed with an increaser, the less available power you have to spin the genny.

Most PTO genny's, like a Winco for instance are 2 pole and must spin at 3600 rpm to deliver 60hz power. a 4 pole is 1800 rpm. Your 1066 was in it's prime 125 pto. Probably less today because it's old.

 

[5030]

Why I like an inverter genny. Don't matter what the armature sped is, excitation is done electronically, why they cost more than an ordinary 3600 rpm screamer. Inverters can produce 60 hz current from idle all the way up to governed rpm.

A regular genny is totally dependent on armature speed to produce the correct hertz, the inverter isn't.

My Generac with the diesel motor is a 4 pole, not a 2 pole so it turns at 1800 rpm, not 3600 rpm to make 60 Hertz.

 

[coobie]

Why I like an inverter genny. Don't matter what the armature sped is, excitation is done electronically, why they cost more than an ordinary 3600 rpm screamer. Inverters can produce 60 hz current from idle all the way up to governed rpm.

A regular genny is totally dependent on armature speed to produce the correct hertz, the inverter isn't.

My Generac with the diesel motor is a 4 pole, not a 2 pole so it turns at 1800 rpm, not 3600 rpm to make 60 Hertz.

PICS of your diesel Generac generator love to see your set up.

 

[Larry Caldwell]

Question for you/anyone...

Regarding PTO speed. I've wondered about getting a PTO generator. Do I want an IH 1066 screaming outside my window at pto speed? Not if I don't have to (it's got a straight pipe).

I use a hydraulically powered mower behind the tractor. As such, the mower "requires" a 4x "speed increaser" where it jumps the PTO speed up by 4x.

My understanding is the generator has to be at a specific RPM (or maybe a specific range, I don't really know) If the generator kicks in, pulls RPM's down on the tractor, it messes with the 60 Hz thing, I think. I understand that's not good.

With a tractor the size of the 1066, (I think it's 100 hp on the pto, or was it 125? I don't recall)

Is there a way to get a smaller generator than the 1066 would handle (I know you want to match your loads) So if I needed "X" KW and that would use a 75 HP machine (and I'm making up these numbers so please, nobody get all 60 Hz on me lol) Anyway, if generator "X" is good size and it requires 75 HP, if I have 100 HP, would that give me some wiggle room on the wondering of the RPM speed? (would it be more able to maintain a steady state)

Now, bring in the speed increaser.... if I've got the 100HP available AND it will allow me to go 4x on the PTO speed AND my needs are covered in theory by say, the 75 HP machine....

Could a setup like that work? Asking for trouble? Should I just rub some sticks together?

With 100 hp to play with, I doubt the tractor would even notice load variations. A PTO generator is going to need 540 RPM on the drive shaft. How you get there is your choice. A household generator will probably put out about 50 amps at 240 volts. That's 12 kw. Add a little headroom for continuous operation and call it 15 kw. At 746 watts per hp, that's 16 hp. If you get a 30 kw generator, you would still only be using about 35 hp.

The tractor would be fine with a 4x PTO speed increaser, but keep the ignorant away from the throttle. If they open it up, 2100 RPM on the generator might cause the windings to fly apart.

 

[RickB]

Rated PTO speed for your 1066 is either 2400 or 2600 depending on build date. So using the 4x speed increaser would require an input RPM of either 600 or 650 ERPM. Both are below the factory low idle setting for your tractor.
The 4x speed increaser is not suitable for use with a generator requiring 540 rpm input speed. It's simple math, we don't even get to the point of asking whether the tractor will develop sufficient HP at the required input speed.

 

[RalphVa]

Question for you/anyone...

Regarding PTO speed. I've wondered about getting a PTO generator. Do I want an IH 1066 screaming outside my window at pto speed? Not if I don't have to (it's got a straight pipe).

I use a hydraulically powered mower behind the tractor. As such, the mower "requires" a 4x "speed increaser" where it jumps the PTO speed up by 4x.

My understanding is the generator has to be at a specific RPM (or maybe a specific range, I don't really know) If the generator kicks in, pulls RPM's down on the tractor, it messes with the 60 Hz thing, I think. I understand that's not good.

With a tractor the size of the 1066, (I think it's 100 hp on the pto, or was it 125? I don't recall)

Is there a way to get a smaller generator than the 1066 would handle (I know you want to match your loads) So if I needed "X" KW and that would use a 75 HP machine (and I'm making up these numbers so please, nobody get all 60 Hz on me lol) Anyway, if generator "X" is good size and it requires 75 HP, if I have 100 HP, would that give me some wiggle room on the wondering of the RPM speed? (would it be more able to maintain a steady state)

Now, bring in the speed increaser.... if I've got the 100HP available AND it will allow me to go 4x on the PTO speed AND my needs are covered in theory by say, the 75 HP machine....

Could a setup like that work? Asking for trouble? Should I just rub some sticks together?

Two problems with a PTO generator:

1. Not much run time on the tractor's tank.
2. Tractor of no use for clearing snow or other things while needed for generator.

Yes, the rpm needs to be exact to get the right cycles. Our electrician had to fine tune the running speed on our Isuzu.

 

[RalphVa]

Check with local farm fuel suppliers, they will deliver reduced tax diesel to your place but they may have a 100 or 200 gallon minimum.

Ken

Yeah. Checked a few years back. Think it's a 100 gallon minimum. Don't even have that size tank. Would have to put one in. Plus, I'd rather get on road diesel to be sure it is wax and water free, e.g. from a heavy use fuel station. ONE TIME I bought off road and had a wax problem with it.

 

[LouNY]

Question for you/anyone...

Regarding PTO speed. I've wondered about getting a PTO generator. Do I want an IH 1066 screaming outside my window at pto speed? Not if I don't have to (it's got a straight pipe).

I use a hydraulically powered mower behind the tractor. As such, the mower "requires" a 4x "speed increaser" where it jumps the PTO speed up by 4x.

My understanding is the generator has to be at a specific RPM (or maybe a specific range, I don't really know) If the generator kicks in, pulls RPM's down on the tractor, it messes with the 60 Hz thing, I think. I understand that's not good.

With a tractor the size of the 1066, (I think it's 100 hp on the pto, or was it 125? I don't recall)

Is there a way to get a smaller generator than the 1066 would handle (I know you want to match your loads) So if I needed "X" KW and that would use a 75 HP machine (and I'm making up these numbers so please, nobody get all 60 Hz on me lol) Anyway, if generator "X" is good size and it requires 75 HP, if I have 100 HP, would that give me some wiggle room on the wondering of the RPM speed? (would it be more able to maintain a steady state)

Now, bring in the speed increaser.... if I've got the 100HP available AND it will allow me to go 4x on the PTO speed AND my needs are covered in theory by say, the 75 HP machine....

Could a setup like that work? Asking for trouble? Should I just rub some sticks together?

A pto generator requires either 540 or 1000 rpm input to provide 60 Hz power.
Most household sized PTO generators will be 540 rpm inputs.
Your tractors governor will regulate your engine speed to keep it constant with varying loads.
With a 25 Kw generator requiring approximately 50 PTO Hp to produce the full 25 Kw,
that would be your maximum load. The load on the generator is what will determine the Hp required
if very little is running, a few lights, a TV or computer you could be requiring less then 1 Kw or 2 Hp.
When the water pump kicks on or a freezer and refrigerator or the furnace then your load has increased
maybe up to 10 Kw now you need 20 Hp but the required rpm has not changed.
A long way around to say that your tractors governor is very important to nice smooth power generation.
With a larger tractor having an excess of available power with a governor in good shape on small to mid sized
generators many times you can get by using the 1000 rpm pto with a 540 adapter on it and running your
tractor at half of the rated pto rpm.
My Branson has an economy pto selection which allows me to drop the rpm by about a 1/3 and still have
540 rpm on the pto output. My IH 574 has a 1000 rpm shaft however at half speed the governor is not as responsive
as I would like so the voltage and Hz gets a bit to much variance for my liking with large changes in load.
Depending on the weather I will shut down at times and switch to the 1000 shaft if the load will not be changing much.
On the farm the IH Magnums are stable enough to run the generators at half rpm using the 1000 rpm outputs.
The Puma 125 is a common rail and it seems to be too precise and aggressive in it's operation trying compensate
to fast to varying loads and will actually get the generator to bouncing on it's wheels.

 

[Katahdin]

I advise against using a 0W-30 oil designed for passenger car DPF engines. Your recommended oil is 10W-30, Specifications ACEA E6, E9, API CK-4, CJ-4, CI-4 Plus, SN

The Napa oil filter # should be 1334.

Zerex G-05 is a good coolant to use.

 

[LittleBill21]

Why I like an inverter genny. Don't matter what the armature sped is, excitation is done electronically, why they cost more than an ordinary 3600 rpm screamer. Inverters can produce 60 hz current from idle all the way up to governed rpm.

A regular genny is totally dependent on armature speed to produce the correct hertz, the inverter isn't.

My Generac with the diesel motor is a 4 pole, not a 2 pole so it turns at 1800 rpm, not 3600 rpm to make 60 Hertz.

@5030

Idk if you realize this since people love this "screamer comment" Inverter generators can rev up and over 4k rpm, to meet demand at their top load. they rev lower only when loads are very low.

they use a dc alternator and a inverter board to create power. and when my inverter generators are at full load ( dual 2200 units), they are almost as loud as my built in 3600 rpm onan screamer. lol

 

[LittleBill21]

@RalphVa do you have a amp meter to determine actually amperage? is the .67 out of spec for consumption? how many hours on it? why not a 50 gallon barrel and have a truck come deliver? how often do you go through this much fuel?

 

[TheMan419]

@5030

Idk if you realize this since people love this "screamer comment" Inverter generators can rev up and over 4k rpm, to meet demand at their top load. they rev lower only when loads are very low.

they use a dc alternator and a inverter board to create power. and when my inverter generators are at full load ( dual 2200 units), they are almost as loud as my built in 3600 rpm onan screamer. lol

I sure don't get the "screamer" comments either. I have a 3600 rpm generator. It is situated such that I don't relaly hear it running when the power is out. Also it is a sweet sweet sound when the power is out because it measn I have power.

 

[JethroB]

I’ve only used a generator once at home. It was after Hurricane Michael passed in 2018 west of me and I lost power for four days. It was October so the weather was decent the first 3 days then the heat and humidity returned. A friend had loaned me his spare 3600 rpm Craftsman ‘screamer’ with a 25 ft heavy cord. I was very grateful to have it but it sure was nice to shut off at bedtime.

 

[hosspuller]

We were out of power for 5.5 days... The longest outage in 24 years. Our power line from road was down. Power was restored at the road, but the storm took out a lot of customers, so we were among the last to be restored. Used a Honda 3000I to power TV, computer, internet, lights, refrigerator & freezer. Most of the time the Honda was part load, so the hum wasn't noticeable.
Originally bought the Honda for camping at horse events. Noise is critical there. The Honda is expensive but quiet.

The Honda inverter produces clean power suitable for delicate electronics like the TV. The Generac 4000 is noisy, produces dirty power but also produces 240 volts. The Honda doesn't. Need it for the well pump.

This is a "good what if " exercise for everybody on the forum. Consider what one does for cooking, heating, cooling, communication, entertainment, drinking, civil unrest, etc. Can one get out to the main road if driveway is blocked by downed trees, snow drifts, flood water etc. Power outages used to be rare. Seems the power grid is more fragile these days. And we're more dependent on electricity.

 

[Larry Caldwell]

@5030

Idk if you realize this since people love this "screamer comment" Inverter generators can rev up and over 4k rpm, to meet demand at their top load. they rev lower only when loads are very low.

they use a dc alternator and a inverter board to create power. and when my inverter generators are at full load ( dual 2200 units), they are almost as loud as my built in 3600 rpm onan screamer. lol

That's why generators are such a nuisance. Who wants to hear a generator running during or after a heavy snowfall? Even traffic noises fall silent if cars can't get down the road. One of the things I love about my home is the hours when the only sounds are the water in the creek, the wind in the trees, and the occasional bird or animal cry.

I sympathize with people in the South where the heat during an outage can be life threatening.

 

[LittleBill21]

That's why generators are such a nuisance. Who wants to hear a generator running during or after a heavy snowfall? Even traffic noises fall silent if cars can't get down the road. One of the things I love about my home is the hours when the only sounds are the water in the creek, the wind in the trees, and the occasional bird or animal cry.

I sympathize with people in the South where the heat during an outage can be life threatening.

Ironically, I find the inverters more annoying, when running 2 of them ( needed on average for me) they get "out of sync" with their tones, think of what a harley sounds like. because they rev up and down independently(loads are not perfectly shared), there is a bit of resonance, to which I actually find more irritable, tie that with potential constant rev changes (different loads coming on), I actually notice them more then my 8k, its significantly louder, but seems to be easier to tune out (if you have to listen to it).

That said I agree with Larry, my stuff gets turned off as soon as possible, or not pulled out unless a very long outage (not a easy flip over to generator)

 

[Jstpssng]

That's why generators are such a nuisance. Who wants to hear a generator running during or after a heavy snowfall? Even traffic noises fall silent if cars can't get down the road. One of the things I love about my home is the hours when the only sounds are the water in the creek, the wind in the trees, and the occasional bird or animal cry.

I sympathize with people in the South where the heat during an outage can be life threatening.

Try visiting a remote campground, the da$$ed things are everywhere, usually pointed directly at my tent because they respect other generator users. WTH would you go remote camping if all that you want to do is watch the ball game?

 

[cqaigy2]

We did pretty much as Larry said. LED lamps, one fluorescent camp lamp and propane camp stove. Also have 1000 gallons up the hill from us. One Aladdin, not used anymore because of wood stove and gobbs of wood to burn. Dual fuel, propane, gasoline generator that gets run intermittently. Worked fine for 2 1/2 weeks no power, 1 week before getting all the trees and power lines out of the way to make it into town for some soda and some snacks.

 

[RalphVa]

I advise against using a 0W-30 oil designed for passenger car DPF engines. Your recommended oil is 10W-30, Specifications ACEA E6, E9, API CK-4, CJ-4, CI-4 Plus, SN

The Napa oil filter # should be 1334.

Zerex G-05 is a good coolant to use.

M1 0w30 ESP is for gasoline and light diesel engines. Our tractors would qualify as light diesel engines. ACEA C3

 

[CADplans]

Thinking about getting a pallet and some bolt-on pallet forks (maybe get pallet forks with new tractor planned for this year). Put sides on the pallet. Use grounding straps at service station to put on each 5 gallon container on the pallet to ground to metal on the truck while fueling in bed of the truck. Use pallet forks to lift out of back of truck and carry to fence where generator is. Use 12v or hand pump to transfer from containers to diesel tank. LOTS less expensive than buying anything else.

If you price cheapo 5 gallon jugs, this is not much different in price, from Amazon,,

A couple of these tanks, and forget handling any more 5 gallon jugs!!