Battery based electric vehicles of today and tomorrow.

[Gale Hawkins]

This article may appeal more to readers who are currently aware OEMs have been dropping ICE powered vehicle lines at a fast rate to stave off failure as they transition to all EV sales in the next decades.

The bit about the patents held by Oakridge TN based government offices needed for EVs to be successful indicates to me when GM fumbled the EV1 development 30 years ago the federal government directly and indirectly through universities continued evolving EV technology so we could discontinue ICE vehicles in the future.

 

[goeduck]

Putting the carriage before the horse isn't going to solve a thing..

unfortunately that has never stopped our gubbamint before.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

I spoke with an independent fuel hauling trucker last night at one of the area's Huck's gas station and asked what he is seeing supply wise. He said we're fine on gas but diesel was on the tight side.

Most of of our fuels come from MS River ports. He thinks renewables are the wave of the future but distanced future.

As far as EVs go as I see it we are 10 years out. It's more of a supply issue because the EV demand is ahead of supply.

Europe will suck up any excess supplies out of China I expect. USA EV battery factories being planned today are years away from high output rates.

 

[3930dave]

The time’s going to be when only the elite can afford to drive.

History does tend to repeat.....

Although, the first time around the actual Supply (of vehicles) was that low for real, this time more artificially induced...

Rgds, D.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

Newly developed compound may enable sustainable, cost-effective, large-scale energy storage

Getting there one step at a time.

 

[Jstpssng]

One of the questions I've been asking is whether the electric grid will be able to power all of these electric cars. Last night I searched that question, the answer seems to be a big "Maybe."
This is just one of the articles I read. Some of the others are too dependent on politics to give a definite answer.

Will Electric Cars Overload the Power Grid? Or Fix It?

Will electric cars overload the power grid? This is a question that’s been raised recently, and one of people’s biggest concerns when it comes to electric vehicles (EVs).

evgeeks.com

 

[Frankenkubota]

Trash handling here in Norway starts at home, I have four thrash containers, ordinary thrash, organic, paper and one for glass/metall.

We pay a fee when we buy tires, oil, batteries and all kinds of electrical and electronic devices witch makes recycling easy, everybody that sells these products are mandated take old in return, general stores have recycling points for small batteries, lightbulbs and small electronic waste.
This is by law but it is not done by the government.

On new cars I pay ca 300$ in a wrecking fee, this is the same sum that I will get payed to recycle an old car so you don't see much old wrecks, the same solutions are newly been put boats, campers and trailers.

We have a lot of recycling centers where one can deliver thrash.

But it's not enough, it's to cheap to let consumers take the bill for bad products and packaging choices.

And of course export of thrash is forbidden.

yea but......

That's Norway.

The amount of waste an average american family generates is hard to believe. I'd like to see a save your trash week where you pile everything up in your backyard for a week. You would be shocked!

I have lived in 2 communities that required similar separation of garbage.

Both local governments were caught dumping the separated stuff in the general land fill.

In one town they said they do it because it makes people feel better about themselves. Brave New World?

In the other they said it was much cheaper just to dump it.

Reality.

Here we import finished products and export waste.

So much BS out there

 

[Jstpssng]

yea but......

That's Norway.

The amount of waste an average american family generates is hard to believe. I'd like to see a save your trash week where you pile everything up in your backyard for a week. You would be shocked!

I have lived in 2 communities that required similar separation of garbage.

Both local governments were caught dumping the separated stuff in the general land fill.

In one town they said they do it because it makes people feel better about themselves. Brave New World?

In the other they said it was much cheaper just to dump it.

Reality.

Here we import finished products and export waste.

So much BS out there

 

[Hay Dude]

yea but......

That's Norway.

The amount of waste an average american family generates is hard to believe. I'd like to see a save your trash week where you pile everything up in your backyard for a week. You would be shocked!

I have lived in 2 communities that required similar separation of garbage.

Both local governments were caught dumping the separated stuff in the general land fill.

In one town they said they do it because it makes people feel better about themselves. Brave New World?

In the other they said it was much cheaper just to dump it.

Reality.

Here we import finished products and export waste.

So much BS out there

Philadelphia sends all its recycled paper trash to a small adjacent town down the river (Chester) and burns it in a huge incinerator.

Our suburban trash collector makes us put plastics and paper in separate bins, then on collection day, appears to toss it all in the same trash truck.

When I go to the county landfill to dump construction waste, I see the trash trucks back up nearby and watch them dump. Trucks appear to have plastic, aluminum, paper and electronics all commingled together and dump right into the same spot.

 

[3930dave]

This article may appeal more to readers who are currently aware OEMs have been dropping ICE powered vehicle lines at a fast rate to stave off failure as they transition to all EV sales in the next decades.

Fast moving transitions..... not something the Auto industry is particularly adept at. Pure ("traditional")Tech-sector companies regularly Zoom, Crash, Burn because they didn't manage their Nu Tek AND their cash-flow competently. It's not easy, by any stretch.

Auto has the historical advantage over pure-Tech in that it is a somewhat protected industry..... bailouts were common news, long before EV was A Thing....... so I won't be surprised to see more bailouts unless they are deemed Evil Enough To Fail.....

Ford had been in $ trouble a while back, and chopped traditional car production going back to 2018 or so. Even w/o Covid disruption to production, ramping down ICE production while sllloooowwwlllllyyyyy ramping up EVs is a huge financial and logistical risk.

Everyone, including Automotive companies, is still used to Big Oil Just Being There. You build a traditional ICE vehicle, and the lubricants and fuel to run it are Just There. What I mean is How To Power It and Keep it Running, is somebody (Big Oil) else's Problem.

Elon has moved EVs to where they are by applying applying eng logic writ large....... he looked at the TOTAL solution needed, Designed and Built It, so They Will Come. I saw what he was doing with the SuperCharger network from the Get Go, but what really highlighted this reality was the few vids I watched (I think I posted at least one here) recently showing Mach E roadtrips in the USA.

3'rd Party Charging for the Mach E was often an expensive, flakey, and slow process. Throwing E-fueling Over The Wall (traditional Auto ICE/Big Oil dynamic) is not performing the way modern first-world consumers expect/demand.

I don't view Musk as the messiah that some do, but I recognize that his Own The Whole Problem approach is a large part of what has moved Tesla to the forefront of this game.

Long Sunday morning ramble...... basically to say that the ICE industry still has a long way to go, just in regard to changing their mindsets.

This ^, is also part of why I've said producing and marketing EVs reminds me a lot of cell-phones. It's much more of a tech-sector play, than anything the Olde Auto Industry has ever seen.....

Borrowing McQuaig's book-title....... Tech only has The Quick, and The Dead.

Rgds, D.

 

[Agvg]

In Norway the average is 450kg waste pr person pr year, did not find numbers for the US, and it's recycled, some of the plastic will be burned for energy as that is the most valuable use of unclean plastic waste. We pay good money for this service so it's not easy to fool people as many is watching how public spendings are done. It's also controlled by the central government.

 

[Frankenkubota]

I read in an econ book years and years ago that said whenever presented with a paridyme change, companies with the established "old school" culture will not survive.

Think of IBM, ATT, GE, .......

they been around for years but it took a "new" way of thinking to achieve.......

Google, Apple, Amazon, blah blah blah

Can't teach old dogs new tricks plus....the old dogs got way too much to lose to be innovative.

Same thing for public education but.....we all know why it survives!

 

[3930dave]

yea but......

I have lived in 2 communities that required similar separation of garbage.

Both local governments were caught dumping the separated stuff in the general land fill.

In one town they said they do it because it makes people feel better about themselves. Brave New World?

In the other they said it was much cheaper just to dump it.

Reality.

So, I'd be one of only a very few consumers over here wanting to know the Recycling Story on EVs before buying one ?

(JK, rhetorical. Totally agree, here, and I knew that ^ already).

GreenWashing often refers to the front-end Marketing, but you've hit on the back-end faux Consumer Guilt Play, over Here.

Rgds, D.

 

[3930dave]

In Norway the average is 450kg waste pr person pr year, did not find numbers for the US, and it's recycled, some of the plastic will be burned for energy as that is the most valuable use of unclean plastic waste. We pay good money for this service so it's not easy to fool people as many is watching how public spendings are done. It's also controlled by the central government.

Depending on the Euro country, at the top, Who is Sleeping with Who ? at best, gets a shoulder-shrug.

No system is perfect, but often social issues are more prioritized over your way, than that ^ type of Noise/Smokescreen.

Contrast/compare..... closer to thread topic..... I've been meaning to spend some time looking at how EVs are doing in Germany, but won't today if I'm going to get any chores done here......

Rgds, D.

 

[Frankenkubota]

In Norway the average is 450kg waste pr person pr year, did not find numbers for the US, and it's recycled, some of the plastic will be burned for energy as that is the most valuable use of unclean plastic waste. We pay good money for this service so it's not easy to fool people as many is watching how public spendings are done. It's also controlled by the central government.

I've never been to Norway but i've been close.

I wish i could live a while longer to see what happens to the scandinavian social welfare system as time goes by.

I watch a pbs show called rick steve's, it's a travel show mostly about europe. He goes everywhere ive been so it's fun. He is a great believer in the scandinavian approach to just about everything plus.......has a good looking cousin in Norway. He's from Seattle? Clueless when it comes to human nature.

i was always under the impression that the scandinavian countries had a very cohesive and homogeneous population. Like Japan. The US truly is a melting pot. Different people, different values.

With the EU and open boarders I guess you must be seeing an influx of "non scandinavia" folks with different values?

It will be interesting to see how the cultures blend and the affect these changes will have on the social welfare system.

 

[Agvg]

So fare in Norway the immigration has issued, not particularly unexpected but if you look at the oldest immigration groups from Pakistan it seems to work well, the younger generation seems to adapt and a lot of them takes higher education, lawyer, doctors and engineering is very popular and as always a few falls in to antisocial behaviour. Norway are not much of a melting pot except you have to melt down an become quite close to the native population. One problem we have is very few jobs for unskilled labor, that hurt integration of new immigrants and refugees as work is the best way to learn.

And there are friction around religion, here religion is a very private thing if you belive it's not expected that it shows in cloths and behaviour, that is very strange for a lot of foreigners.

And the welfare state is very tough, unless you are disabled or have bad healt its not much you get.

 

[Agvg]

If we are talkin EU immigration then Poland is the most visible group, not by look but you meet them everywhere in all kinds of jobs, other Scandinavians is not considered immigration as we have had open borders and a common work market sins maybe right after ww2.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

https://www.pv-magazine.com/2021/11/12/solar-covered-parking-lots-offer-multiple-benefits/

This is a concept that could work out.

 

[Jstpssng]

^^^^
As I mentioned a couple of days ago, these make a lot more sense than an industrial scale wind complex on what was once farm or wildlands. (A farm is someplace producing produce or livestock, electricity is neither of the above.)

 

[airbiscuit]

I can imagine all those large farm outbuildings being covered with solar panels.