Battery based electric vehicles of today and tomorrow.

[Gale Hawkins]

Locally the hotels are starting to do this and they are basically provided by Tesla and they had two destination Chargers and they also put in one of the the old standard J1776 or whatever like my leaf and some of the early EVs used.

There is no charge if you're staying in the hotel and they really don't have an option to charge unless you are in the hotel and but again I understanding Tesla covers the cost in this location and the hotels have to foot the electric bill.

Since we are an EV free zone seldom are they used but that will change over time.

When I first got our Nissan Leaf I did charge on one of the Destination Chargers for 15 or 20 minutes just to test the adapter and it worked fine. They're just 240 volt home chargers.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

Does anyone know any evidence that the USA is trying to keep BYD from selling EVs in the USA? That is the Chinese EV corporation that Warren Buffett has been invested in for many years.

 

[Oaktree]

In Vancouver, every car space in new hotels must have an EV charger

It would be interesting to see the the results of that mandate.

Let's see if it stands up to the inevitable court challenge. IMHO just another case of government overstepping.

 

[goeduck]

Fast chargers in a hotel would be a bad thing, it would encourage people to sneak into hotel lots while running errands or whatever. Then the hotels would have to police their lots. When I know I need to make a call while driving, I often pull into hotel lots during the day to be legal (they almost always have open spots then). If I had an EV and the hotel had fast chargers.......

As has been mentioned, who needs a fast charger if you are staying the night and paying for the room?

 

[3930dave]

Let's see if it stands up to the inevitable court challenge. IMHO just another case of government overstepping.

BC….. different world. ICE cars are evil…. haven’t you heard…..

Gasoline is about $1.60 - $1.70/L, most of it taxes. Right in Vancouver, there are virtually no gas stations anymore.

You can have a (dope) smoke-in in the middle of an intersection, with enough smoke you’d have to close the road anyway. No Harm/Foul…..

But…. Question any allegedly “green” initiative and you’re gonna be in big trouble……

It’s a beautiful Province, but I wouldn’t live in the lower-mainland, even if I could afford to.

Rgds, D.

 

[3930dave]

If I had an EV and the hotel had fast chargers.......

With all the stupid "Smart" tech out there, it would be trivial to interlock the EV charger with a room-rental transaction.

Even if electricity is cheap locally, the incentive for business would be to keep the charger available for renting customers.

If I had an EV, and booked a room there planning to recharge, I would not be impressed with Joe Schmo sleeping in his charging EV, because he was too cheap/broke to rent a room.

Rgds, D.

 

[3930dave]

Does anyone know any evidence that the USA is trying to keep BYD from selling EVs in the USA? That is the Chinese EV corporation that Warren Buffett has been invested in for many years.

I haven't gone chasing that story, and probably won't....... but I wouldn't be surprised to see today's version of the Chicken Tax slid into place....

Rgds, D.

 

[Steppenwolfe]

Eventually it can go back to the politicians that forced electric vehicles on people.

Electric is the future; no forcing needed.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

In some countries McDonald's has free Chargers for to get more customers.

All we have to do is watch what happens in Western Europe to see the trends that will be soon in the United states.

I think we're pushing the envelope too fast in the United states. Just this week Tesla had another $1,000 price increase announced on certain models because of the EV demand is just so overwhelming and there's very few makers and no makers of the quality of Tesla.

 

[3930dave]

Grid uptime. 2 articles, one more general, one mostly technical.

The US has more power outages than any other developed country. Here’s why.

An assessment of threats to the American power grid - Energy, Sustainability and Society

I hadn't heard of the 1921 Railroad storm before. It is estimated to be 10x the 1989 storm that took down Quebec, and destroyed that large xformer in New Jersey.

I do like EVs, for certain applications. I also know a bit about the magic that keeps the grid running. I'd suggest that anyone who is considering owning a non-hybrid EV as a sole vehicle read and understand the risks discussed in the second article.

Under widespread relatively short-term power outages, one of my priorities is being able to retain mobility for critical needs - medical transport, food, water, medications, evacuations..... I have a plan B with ICE - stock extra fuel. Even under totally normal conditions, I travel remote parts of Canada with 40L of extra fuel for ICE.

You can have a backup plan for EV transport, but after the grid is down is not the time to start thinking about it......

Complexity. I may sound like a Luddite at times, but it is precisely because I do understand what some of the failure points are, that I have concerns. In my case, this is not Fear of the UnKnown, but rather the knowns.....

There is a great paragraph in the second linked article, that relates to what I bang on about....

"The ability to operate a system in the absence of computer-driven actions is fast disappearing. The electric power industry spends over $1.4 billion dollars annually to replace electromechanical systems and devices that involve manual operation with new SCADA equipment [60]. With modest increases in efficiency come exponential increases in vulnerability. The extent to which reduced labor costs (and perhaps reduced energy costs) are passed on to the public is uncertain."

Rgds, D.

 

[3930dave]

All we have to do is watch what happens in Western Europe to see the trends that will be soon in the United states.

I agree that Western EU bears watching.

There are enough differences though (Tax policy, and fuel cost being two obvious ones), that I don't think uptake in the US will be as rapid.

Densities and geography are part of what dictate different priorities (or, at least should), between here and across the pond....

Rgds, D.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

If David Adair is for real fossil fuel is ancient history.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

I agree that Western EU bears watching.

There are enough differences though (Tax policy, and fuel cost being two obvious ones), that I don't think uptake in the US will be as rapid.

Densities and geography are part of what dictate different priorities (or, at least should), between here and across the pond....

Rgds, D.

It has been nearly 50 years since I lived in Western Europe and from my observation over time we run more or less 20 years behind Western Europe.

 

[goeduck]

In some countries McDonald's has free Chargers for to get more customers.

In the drive through?

 

[goeduck]

With all the stupid "Smart" tech out there, it would be trivial to interlock the EV charger with a room-rental transaction.
.

with all the "smart" tech out there it would be trivial to defeat the room-rental requirement.

 

[3930dave]

with all the "smart" tech out there it would be trivial to defeat the room-rental requirement.

In my version of the real world, people that can drive $100k EVs can afford to "fuel" it.

Is what it Is though...... if you're motivated enough, you can crack anything.....

I've seen a surveillance video of 2 guys wirelessly cracking a Tesla in the owner's driveway in the UK.... didn't take long at all......

What did crack me up though...... the only thing that seemed to slow them at all, was unplugging the charge cord, they almost had to drive off with it attached.....

Rgds, D.

 

[Grumpycat]

How can a car MFG get carbon credits when to charge said Vehicle it almost always requires fossil fuels?

Because in spite of what the lazy media and lazy EV haters say, they are not carbon credits.

CARB states dock points for elements of conventional ICE vehicles which our superiors in the bureaucracy do not like. Subaru for example jumps through the stipulated hoops for their ICE vehicles to qualify as PZEV, Partial Zero Emission Vehicle, so as to minimize the Clean Vehicle Credits needed to sell in CARB states.

FFV Flex Fuel Vehicle also reduces the number of credits required to sell the vehicle.

CARB thinks battery swap EV is still a good idea and gives extra credits to manufacturers selling such in CARB states. Tesla took them up on this for several years. Then forced to actually field a swap station which produced even more credits but not enough to keep it in operation so they lost all battery swap credits from new vehicles after that.

As for the lame “fossil fuel electricity” argument, coal-fired electricity in a Model 3 is equivalent to 50 MPG gasoline. Plus unlike the gasoline vehicle an EV can effortlessly use any electric power source, vs requiring a very precise formulation of gasoline. For $10,000 you can buy a PV system and never again pay to fuel your EV. No moving parts. No byproducts. No scheduled maintenance.

 

[Jchonline]

For $10,000 you can buy a PV system and never again pay to fuel your EV. No moving parts. No byproducts. No scheduled maintenance.

Show me some math and a implementation plan for this please. You must know way more about PV systems than I do!

I would like to see exactly what type of system you ”think” you can put in for $10k (please include array, inverter, and storage if you expect to charge at night).

 

[Gale Hawkins]

In the drive through?

Yes
It is a pain however because cables are only 20 ft long so every 40 ft you have to disconnect and connect to the next one up the line.

 

[Jchonline]

Grid uptime. 2 articles, one more general, one mostly technical.

The US has more power outages than any other developed country. Here’s why.

An assessment of threats to the American power grid - Energy, Sustainability and Society

I hadn't heard of the 1921 Railroad storm before. It is estimated to be 10x the 1989 storm that took down Quebec, and destroyed that large xformer in New Jersey.

I do like EVs, for certain applications. I also know a bit about the magic that keeps the grid running. I'd suggest that anyone who is considering owning a non-hybrid EV as a sole vehicle read and understand the risks discussed in the second article.

Under widespread relatively short-term power outages, one of my priorities is being able to retain mobility for critical needs - medical transport, food, water, medications, evacuations..... I have a plan B with ICE - stock extra fuel. Even under totally normal conditions, I travel remote parts of Canada with 40L of extra fuel for ICE.

You can have a backup plan for EV transport, but after the grid is down is not the time to start thinking about it......

Complexity. I may sound like a Luddite at times, but it is precisely because I do understand what some of the failure points are, that I have concerns. In my case, this is not Fear of the UnKnown, but rather the knowns.....

There is a great paragraph in the second linked article, that relates to what I bang on about....

"The ability to operate a system in the absence of computer-driven actions is fast disappearing. The electric power industry spends over $1.4 billion dollars annually to replace electromechanical systems and devices that involve manual operation with new SCADA equipment [60]. With modest increases in efficiency come exponential increases in vulnerability. The extent to which reduced labor costs (and perhaps reduced energy costs) are passed on to the public is uncertain."

Rgds, D.

You aren’t considering off grid applications. You can prep for sustaining a EV the same as a ICE. You would just need to build an off grid charging system with a PV array, inverter. You could use solar to charge the EV directly.

However, it would be more costly than storing say 100L of fuel…but after that fuel runs out and if there is no electricity will you be able to get more fuel from the gas station?

Personally if you really wanted something to sustain in a long term grid down scenario….a EV with off grid solar is the way to go.

The key here is you would be charging fairly slowly and you can only charge it when the full sun is out, and you probably can’t use the array for anything else. So yes it is expensive, but in a SHTF or long term power outage…this is the best protection I can think of. The next item of business would be keeping it from thieves.