Renting a Cat 953D - Stupid Idea?

[Liquidsilver]

I have an area behind my pond that was left a mess by a friend with a backhoe when he fixed a leak in it. It's been a weedy mess ever since, and the area behind it has a pretty sharp gully that's about 100 feet long and 40 feet deep. I've smoothed it out with my FEL but it's still really steep, uneven and there are a couple of mature trees in the middle of the mess. Every summer, I get tall thorns and unsightly weeds because I can't mow it.

I also have some messy woody areas around a larger, 6 acre lake that I'd like to fix, grade and plant with fescue. I'd like it all smoothed out so I can mow it and not be dodging rocks and gullies as I'm mowing.

I'm pretty sure that a local operator I've used before could do all this for about $3000 - $6000 with his 953s. He does good work and I trust him. Then I would spend another $1000 to seed the fresh grades. This is Ozark hard rocky soil with huge planted rocks and there are some full sized oak trees that I want taken out. Despite the giant rocks, I was very happy with this operators work as he corrected and graded my large dam, and it's a beautiful thing... though it cost me $16,000 plus the seeding.

But here's the thing... I think it would be fun to rent a machine and do this job myself. I'm pretty good at operating things, I can fly two types of helicopters and almost every kind of motorcycle, but I have zero experience with earth moving, other than some basic grading with my FEL. I'm not sure if the equipment rental places would rent me a big loader... but it looks like it would cost $2500 - $3000 for a week.

My quandry... would I be able to figure out the operation of the machine and good techniques... or would I make a big mess and need to hire the local operator after I made the mess?

Can anybody give me any insight here? Thanks.

 

[fruitcakesa]

I have a friend who is an experienced heavy equipment operator and always defer to him when it comes to specific projects that require machinery that I don't own and have little or no experience on.
Having seen the kind of mess a newby can make and the resulting additional expense that came from having to hire someone to fix it, I would say, unless you are determined to "do it yourself", get your local guy to do it.
It will get done faster and better.

 

[countrybumpkin]

First thing I’d do is get a firm quote from him, then you’ll have a better idea of time and cost of renting and doing yourself. You have to realize a skilled operator can work circles around a untrained or novice. That being said I’m sure you would be able to get it done but do you have the time to if your renting a machine, say you get started and then it starts raining for a couple days, he walks away and does other things not costing you money, renting your still paying for the lost time due to the weather. One thing you might look into is leasing a machine from a dealer instead of a rental yard, that may allow you a longer window of time to complete the project.

 

[Industrial Toys]

I ALWAYS bring in BIG IRON to do the heavy lifting. I would never consider renting for larger equipment. The way I see it, the operator is FREE when you hire a contractor. Worst thing, I hate is paying float charges actually. Especially for a day or two job.

 

[EddieWalker]

A track loader is designed for picking up material and moving it in bad conditions. It's not designed for grading. It can be used for grading, but it's one of those things that has a learning curve, and once you have it figured out, it will take longer to get nice results then a small to medium dozer with a six way blade.

D5 lowtrack bulldozer would be my first choice if I was renting Cat, or a Deere 700

 

[Jstpssng]

There is a learning curve involved, but if you expect to be doing that type of work again it might be worth your time to do it. (Plus it's fun.) Another member recently asked a similar question,then ended up bringing in a loader or something, which a friend helped him learn to use. Then he went on to rent a dozer, if I remember correctly.

For your purposes something like this "Bladerunner" would be handy; a midsized ex with bucket for digging and a 6 way blade for moving the material around. I don't know if you can find one nearby for rent though.

 

[edgarrian]

Id suggest using an excavator. If you don't have experience on one it will take you a day or two to get familiar with the controls. IF you rent something like a 312 or 315 for a week you could get a lot done on a 40hr rental. Pile up the the crap you move, dig a hole, then burn it, and cover it. You can grade it out pretty good with the excavator but you certainly have to use ur tractor to pretty it up.

 

[Jstpssng]

Another consideration if you get an excavator with a thumb; I've seen some pretty good leveling jobs done with a heavy I-beam like what is found under a bridge. You still would need to do some finish work with your tractor... and would have to come up with that piece of bridge steel.

The pros of hiring somebody is that he hopefully knows what he's doing so all that you do is write him a check.
The cons of hiring somebody is that all you are doing is writing a check, not getting a chance to learn/run a different piece of equipment.

 

[Liquidsilver]

Thanks for the thoughts. I only mention the big track loaders because that's what he did the dam with... and his grading results were really terrific.

 

[BrokenTrack]

Operating heavy equipment is not rocket science, and the machines are getting easier and easier to use. I will just flat out say, you would be fine as an operator.

Just as an example, and please do not get caught up on the machine type, but I was sitting in a gravel pit, pulling my teeth out of the front windshield on a John Deere 744G loader with spade nose bucket since the pit wall was so hard, yet had an excavator sitting in the pit with me.

But I had never run an excavator before...

So I jumped on it, and within an hour it was like I had been born on it. The controls are just intuitive. Add in any type of equipment here, with the exception of a grader maybe...

But renting REALLY makes sense. There are some ways to really get your money's worth, like renting machines with tracks and all weather cabs, so if you run into rain, you can still work. It is all about getting seat time.

As an example, I can rent a 34,000 pound class excavator for $6500 a month: or 28 working days, or 160 hours. No payments, no maintenance costs, no wrenching to do, no repair costs; just run the thing for 160 straight hours. That is WELL worth it. I can do an awful lot of work with a 34,000 pound machine in 160 hours.

Edited to say: My mantra has always been, "Do as much for myself as I can." It comes out better because I know what I want it to look like, and it is fun.

 

[Rustyiron]

That machine is not that hard to operate, visibility is very close to a SS. I've never even flew in a heli but I'd say that qualifies you. A few hours of making a mess and learning to fix the mess you made will "learn ya". Start with grubbing out the brush, teeth in the dirt at about a 45* angle will get you familiar with things, and on your way back for another pass, learn to "back drag", it's the new guy's friend when it comes to grading. That machine will "return to dig" with the right lever position, and iirc that position is bucket flat or neutral, not really digging or the teeth up towards the sky either. (but it's been about 12 years since I've been on a 953) and learn to just "bump" the lever from that starting point for either more/less aggressive dig. Then after a few hours you may develop a feel for how the machine is sitting in terms of level, and go from there. Finish grading, particularly fine grading can be done but if you have minimal slopes and are trying to move water in a certain direction, that is where you will have troubles. Go for it and have fun, you certainly will. I've known operators that on the previous series (955- front motor and no visibility) could drop his bucket teeth an inch away from a foundation or sidewalk - all day long, and grade things close enough so that you just had to run a rake over it to plant grass.

 

[hosspuller]

Safety is number one.. It's all fun until someone gets hurt. Is the slope dangerous ? Do you think the machine could roll over ? If so Hire the job out. Otherwise, rent the machine and have at it. It's fun and (as said before) you know what result you want. As a helicopter pilot you have a good sense of level, you'll do fine with simultaneous controls. Practice on a level patch of ground getting a feel for the machine and controls. Just remember, you'll take twice or three times the effort and time an accomplished operator would. I rented a skid steer for a week to see if it was a good fit for the farm and teach myself. It was a blast and I accomplished a few jobs.

Just a reminder : Why you should not remove a tree with a giant bulldozer - YouTube

 

[Liquidsilver]

Yah, that guy probably did some expensive damage to that dozer. ^^ And I think I could manage the slope. I'd just work it straight up and down like I would with my 4x4 tractor. The videos online make the work look pretty straight forward.

When you take out a new type of helicopter, you have a co-pilot showing you the ropes. This would be 'solo' right off the bat.

And even though the land is so rocky, I've heard my operator say that he needs it to be bone dry to be effective with the machines. I wonder if I'd need to wait for the dry season anyway.

 

[Rustyiron]

That guy cut 3 sides of the roots, the wrong 3 sides. Kinda like felling a tree (with a saw) and making your face cut on the side you don't want it falling:laughing:
I wouldn't suggest it until you really know ANY machine, but side sloping a tracked machine... they slide before they'll just tip over. If you slide far enough fast enough it's the sudden stop at the bottom of your slope that will send you over. Usually while pushing across slope you will gradually pivot your back end down hill while the front end is "hooked" into the dirt, and eventually be facing 30* or so up hill. Well at least with a track loader or dozer pushing not simply traveling across slope.
Some Cat branches do have what they call a "rental store" if your looking.

 

[EddieWalker]

I would not rent an excavator to clean up an steep area. The smaller the dozer, the easier it is to get a nice finish, but with less power, the longer it will take to get anything done.

 

[fried1765]

I have an area behind my pond that was left a mess by a friend with a backhoe when he fixed a leak in it. It's been a weedy mess ever since, and the area behind it has a pretty sharp gully that's about 100 feet long and 40 feet deep. I've smoothed it out with my FEL but it's still really steep, uneven and there are a couple of mature trees in the middle of the mess. Every summer, I get tall thorns and unsightly weeds because I can't mow it.

I also have some messy woody areas around a larger, 6 acre lake that I'd like to fix, grade and plant with fescue. I'd like it all smoothed out so I can mow it and not be dodging rocks and gullies as I'm mowing.

I'm pretty sure that a local operator I've used before could do all this for about $3000 - $6000 with his 953s. He does good work and I trust him. Then I would spend another $1000 to seed the fresh grades. This is Ozark hard rocky soil with huge planted rocks and there are some full sized oak trees that I want taken out. Despite the giant rocks, I was very happy with this operators work as he corrected and graded my large dam, and it's a beautiful thing... though it cost me $16,000 plus the seeding.

But here's the thing... I think it would be fun to rent a machine and do this job myself. I'm pretty good at operating things, I can fly two types of helicopters and almost every kind of motorcycle, but I have zero experience with earth moving, other than some basic grading with my FEL. I'm not sure if the equipment rental places would rent me a big loader... but it looks like it would cost $2500 - $3000 for a week.

My quandry... would I be able to figure out the operation of the machine and good techniques... or would I make a big mess and need to hire the local operator after I made the mess?

Can anybody give me any insight here? Thanks.

I flew a 747-400 across the world, for thousands of hours, have made carrier landings, and have over 30,000 total hours of flight time.
I have a Kubota L48 TLB, and two other tractors.
I love my tractors!
I MIGHT be able to do the work you describe, with a rental machine, but I would be NOWHERE NEAR as precise and efficient as a professional operator.
I am also very certain I could not fly a helicopter, by just stepping into it.
Hire a pro!
Sadly, you will not have the fun, but you may actually save money, and the end result will likely be a nice job.

 

[CADplans]

I wanted to re-do my driveway,, heck, I have most of the equipment that would have been needed,,
but, I hired a guy that is G O O D !!

He did it in a couple days, I would have been there all summer,,

The main reason I hired him was the bumper sticker on his truck,,,

 

[ddbackhoe]

I have an area behind my pond that was left a mess by a friend with a backhoe when he fixed a leak in it. It's been a weedy mess ever since, and the area behind it has a pretty sharp gully that's about 100 feet long and 40 feet deep. I've smoothed it out with my FEL but it's still really steep, uneven and there are a couple of mature trees in the middle of the mess. Every summer, I get tall thorns and unsightly weeds because I can't mow it.

I also have some messy woody areas around a larger, 6 acre lake that I'd like to fix, grade and plant with fescue. I'd like it all smoothed out so I can mow it and not be dodging rocks and gullies as I'm mowing.

I'm pretty sure that a local operator I've used before could do all this for about $3000 - $6000 with his 953s. He does good work and I trust him. Then I would spend another $1000 to seed the fresh grades. This is Ozark hard rocky soil with huge planted rocks and there are some full sized oak trees that I want taken out. Despite the giant rocks, I was very happy with this operators work as he corrected and graded my large dam, and it's a beautiful thing... though it cost me $16,000 plus the seeding.

But here's the thing... I think it would be fun to rent a machine and do this job myself. I'm pretty good at operating things, I can fly two types of helicopters and almost every kind of motorcycle, but I have zero experience with earth moving, other than some basic grading with my FEL. I'm not sure if the equipment rental places would rent me a big loader... but it looks like it would cost $2500 - $3000 for a week.

My quandry... would I be able to figure out the operation of the machine and good techniques... or would I make a big mess and need to hire the local operator after I made the mess?

Can anybody give me any insight here? Thanks.

What is the tradeoff between a week without pay (or a week vacation pay) plus rental vs. hiring the job out? If the job is not done in a week now what?

 

[MHarryE]

If you’re looking for the fun part of doing it yourself, rent. We had a guy with a 953 clean up my father-in-laws truck. He never threw anything away. I worked 2 weeks with my mini-excavator digging old machinery, cars, appliances, etc., and loading them on trailers we could haul to the scrap yard. Once that was done, we had the guy with the 953 come in because I didn’t have time but the local Cat dealer would have dropped off and picked up. No qualms from them that my brother-in-law and I had never driven one. The guy we hired suffered a major engine failure on his old machine so a week job ended up taking 2 months. I know we would have made it look better in the end but we would have gouged some holes and had to repair them along the way. I bought a CTL in January and learning curve was less than a half hour. The fun factor has been enormous.

 

[mikester]

If you like operating equipment go for it, you will likely want to buy one when you are done. If you are taking down mature old oaks you will want a bigger machine like a 963 or 973. The heavier the better. I had a 955 and it struggled with really big old trees, at 15 tons the machine is not heavy enough.

Push over your trees first from higher up, then grab the roots and push all the way out. Watch out for falling dead limbs. Use common sense...whatever that is. Also watch out for really soft stuff soils, avoid turning in place or spinning your tracks when you get in them. Get a machine with the deep grousers.