how to build your own custom backhoe subframe

[Reg]

It's been over a year since anyone has posted on this thread but hopefully some people are still around. I'm considering matching up a Bradco 609 or 611 with my Kioti DK45S, I'm hoping someone has some pictures and ideas for a subframe. The DK45S was only made a few years starting around 2005, I'd really like to see some photos of the tractor with a subframe whether it's DIY or from one of the manufacturers.

I called Bradco to see if I could get a subframe from them and they do make (or did make) a subframe for my machine but it's made for the KL1590 Loader and I have the KL451 Loader. Additionally, the Bradco Rep. said that procuring the subframe would be expensive, around $4K-$5K. He sent me the part numbers I would need and drawings of the subframe for the KL1590:
108550 TR Half Kit
108565 BH Half Kit

Excellent thread btw, thanks for all the info DFkrug.

View attachment 603835View attachment 603834

I don't remember the details of who makes/made what for whom, but Amerequip was a big OEM producer for MANY brand names a couple of decades ago.
Bradco may have been one of them, I *KNOW* that John Deere was and probably still is.

Point is it may be worth checking into Amerequip for hoes and sub frames.

 

[dfkrug]

Additionally, the Bradco Rep. said that procuring the subframe would be expensive, around $4K-$5K.

Yeah, custom-made out of unobtanium. That price is how the rep says, "no".

Bradco hoes and subframes are very robust and well-made. They are usually the OEM hoes for Bobcat skidsteers. You can pick them up used for a few $K around here. If you found one, a custom-made frame is your likely next step, whether DIY or from a welding shop.

The drawings show a 2-part subframe with hooks to aid in mounting. Thanks for posting.

 

[ThisJustin]

Lol!


I need to get rid of some blue people so I can afford the subframe for my tractor.

I'm gonna call around and see if I can find that Bradco subframe somewhere. If not, those drawings are a pretty good start. I'll take some measurements to see if those drawings will match up with my loader and if so, it might be as simple as having someone produce the subframe from those drawings.

I'm all about DIY stuff and the sense of accomplishment but I have enough irons in the fire at the moment so I'm gonna do what I can to simplify getting this done.

 

[samgibbs3rd]

I'm wondering if its feasible to try to fab my own subframe for my Mahindra 1526. I have a 3pt backhoe BH5600 (BH56 PTO 3 Point Backhoe Tractor Excavator Attachment w/ Pump 15" Bu SDI Factory Direct Wholesale). I really want a project so i'm wondering if I can fab my own subframe. Any helpful tips out there?? I've spent the last few days reading through this awesome thread and seems like the ladder style would be best possibly? It already caused the PTO shaft to snap somehow when my family was using it while I was at work. That's why all the fluids drained and currently its sitting. Pics attached of the underside of my mahindra and view of underside from back right tire. Also pics of backhoe where 3pt mounts. I'd even be up for a quick call if anyone has advice Thanks. Plan to pay it forward. Trying to start a small little weekend tractor business to do some grading, digging, trenching, etc. Havent been able to use my tractor in 2 months bc of this PTO repair.

 

[electrycmonk]

Since I made my last few subframes, I have learned something that would effect the next one
I make.

Recall that there is a trade-off that I discuss at length about using pins vs. bolts/nuts to connect
a 4-point subframe to the tractor. Pins are easier to install/remove, but they are not tight, so
clearances will only increase with use.

When I made the subframe for my Kioti, I used 1" fine-thread bolts and nylock nuts. The holes
were precision-drilled with very tight alignment.

Recently, I did a 400-hr service on my tractor, which required removal of the subframe to access
one of my hyd filters under the tractor. Removing these bolts was harder than I expected
because the slight unavoidable flex of the subframe caused "threads" to be worn into the 1/2"
plate. That meant that these large bolts would not slide out easily after the nuts were removed.

In the future, I would only use bolts that were threaded only where the nuts required them. The
rest of the bolts would be smooth. This means buying extra-long bolts, and cutting/welding
new heads on them to achieve exactly the correct length.

Dude. I have a timely question. I found a Woods BH7500 subframe that will come with the adapter plate for under the tractors motor/front axle area.

the model #is mounting kit #52999

I seriously thinking of getting it and then modifying it to fit my 7260 cub cadet.

as a reference to show its design i found a website with break down diagrams. You have likely known of it (I'll safely assume)
store.germanbliss.com/woods-bh7500-backhoe-backhoe-attachment-sub-frame-mounting-kit-52999assembly-parts

I'd like to believe that my Mcgyver sense would be further along Mod'ing a setup then procuring raw material and starting from scratch?

Taking into serious consideration this new lesson you have posted regarding bolts with long threaded shafts.....

Its several hours away from me - on way drive but, it wouldn't be the sole item for the drive, I'm seriously looking at a used dump bed setup with complete PTO system that would bolt up to my F350's ZF6 tranny. So, in theory those two items are about an hour apart at the outside.....

patiently awaiting your reply. as well as anyone else's wisdom here.

 

[electrycmonk]

I'm wondering if its feasible to try to fab my own subframe for my Mahindra 1526. I have a 3pt backhoe BH5600 (BH56 PTO 3 Point Backhoe Tractor Excavator Attachment w/ Pump 15" Bu SDI Factory Direct Wholesale). I really want a project so i'm wondering if I can fab my own subframe. Any helpful tips out there?? I've spent the last few days reading through this awesome thread and seems like the ladder style would be best possibly? It already caused the PTO shaft to snap somehow when my family was using it while I was at work. That's why all the fluids drained and currently its sitting. Pics attached of the underside of my mahindra and view of underside from back right tire. Also pics of backhoe where 3pt mounts. I'd even be up for a quick call if anyone has advice Thanks. Plan to pay it forward. Trying to start a small little weekend tractor business to do some grading, digging, trenching, etc. Havent been able to use my tractor in 2 months bc of this PTO repair.

I would suggest reading all the OP posts in this thread; they have a stock pile of wisdom regarding the plan to "cut your teeth" on such a ground up project from scratch. Granted others have added in wounderful info along the way.

cheers.

 

[dfkrug]

I found a Woods BH7500 subframe that will come with the adapter plate for under the tractors motor/front axle area.

the model #is mounting kit #52999

I guess my Qs would be: do you have a Woods 7500 hoe? What tractor is the 52999 subframe supposed to fit?

If the subframe fits your hoe or your tractor, then you only have to modify half of it. Sometimes the mods you need are more work than just starting with new (or salvaged) steel.

 

[electrycmonk]

I guess my Qs would be: do you have a Woods 7500 hoe? What tractor is the 52999 sub-frame supposed to fit?

If the sub-frame fits your hoe or your tractor, then you only have to modify half of it. Sometimes the mods you need are more work than just starting with new (or salvaged) steel.

Dude, I'm sorry I totally forgot to add relevant reference data. It was in my head but, didn't make it to the keyboard.

Here's the sub-frame link, made easier now that I'm on the PC and not my phone:
Woods BH75 Backhoe Backhoe Attachment: Sub-Frame Mounting Kit (52999) Assembly Assembly Parts and Diagram

so here is the data I have so far. From this forum:
https://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/attachments/70099-woods-backhoe-3.html
Post #25 the owner says :
[edited down]... Mine is woods #52999 supposed to be for either 6500s or 7500s used on Kubota B2710/2910/7800. The BH itself mounts to two plates at the back of the sub-frame and to the tractor via a heavy duty top-link. The sub-frame itself mounts to the 3ph lift arm pins and tapers to about 1' wide at the front and fits into a mounting bracket under the engine.

I went to tractor Data for specs and pic's of those Kubota models.
TractorData.com Kubota B271 tractor information
TractorData.com Kubota B291 tractor information
TractorData.com Kubota B78 tractor information

My cub cadet tractordata link:
http://www.tractordata.com/farm-tractors/003/9/5/3951-cub-cadet-7260.html

and as I already have pictures uploaded for other threads in TBN....
will these help Or should I add any specific pics from different angles?

 

[dfkrug]

Your Cub Cadet is a DaeDong CUT, correct? Equiv to Kioti DK35, first gen?

Anyway, those B-series Kubotas are much lighter duty tractors. I would do a custom subframe that wrapped around the rear axle housings, and avoid using the 3-pt lift arm pivots. You can also mount the hoe much closer to the tractor than what the Woods subframe allows.

 

[DK35vince]

Your Cub Cadet is a DaeDong CUT, correct? Equiv to Kioti DK35, first gen?

No, I don't think it is..
I believe the 7260 was a Mitsubishi built machine.
The 8354 was the Daedong 35 HP model.

 

[electrycmonk]

Your Cub Cadet is a DaeDong CUT, correct? Equiv to Kioti DK35, first gen?

Anyway, those B-series Kubotas are much lighter duty tractors. I would do a custom subframe that wrapped around the rear axle housings, and avoid using the 3-pt lift arm pivots. You can also mount the hoe much closer to the tractor than what the Woods subframe allows.

DK35Vince said what everything I have run across. The Mitzi platform not Daedong.

So, you wouldn't recommend using this setup a a starting point to modify for the Cub?

I don't have a "shop" or even garage yet to use as a building site. So that's why I asked specifically about going at this from a Mcgyver POV and modifying it.

I will admit to not liking the fact they designed it to mount to the 3 point lower bolt spots on those smaller Kubota models.

I just don't have a functional work bench - driveway only. And very little of it currently too.
Yes I have a metal chop saw, MIG & Stock welder units. Even have oxy-Ac.however I am quite rusty and without a realistic bench & vice I'm hesitant to go full Monty and start from scratch?

I may just stay 3-point till I finally get a shop built.... Later this year or next?

Night night y'all. Tha ks for the fast replies.

 

[dfkrug]

So that's why I asked specifically about going at this from a Mcgyver POV and modifying it.

You might think it will be easier to modify an existing subframe, rather than starting from scratch. But that may still amount to a lot of cutting, drilling, and welding. Perhaps more than starting with new steel. Hard to say without having the subframe under the tractor, and a design worked out.

I have modified the hoe-side subframes that I got with my Woods 7500 clones, and also started from scratch. The latter was easier, and the results, better.

(Thanks, Vince, for the clarification on CC tractors.)

 

[electrycmonk]

You might think it will be easier to modify an existing subframe, rather than starting from scratch. But that may still amount to a lot of cutting, drilling, and welding. Perhaps more than starting with new steel. Hard to say without having the subframe under the tractor, and a design worked out.

I have modified the hoe-side subframes that I got with my Woods 7500 clones, and also started from scratch. The latter was easier, and the results, better.

(Thanks, Vince, for the clarification on CC tractors.)

So, all things being equal - in a way..... If I were to go see the subframe and offer the seller "x" with the total transparency from the gwt-go.... How low would you think is a realistic off knowing it was to get cut, spliced; morphed & welded onto?

The current "asking price is, I believe still about $750-800. I'm preparing to drive up that ways in the coming week or so for some other stuff that's forsake about an hour away from the subframe seller.

 

[dfkrug]

How low would you think is a realistic off knowing it was to get cut, spliced; morphed & welded onto?

0-$50. And if you buy it, be prepared to scrap it and start over with new steel.

 

[chatwithtom]

I am new this forum Thanks to Bob R. for moving over here from the CTOA forum. Sunday my top link broke on my 3-point attached LW6 Backhoe on my Jinma 354 Tractor. This sent the backhoe falling backwards and me falling onto the controls. this put both the dipper and boom in the downward position forcing the backhoe back up and crushing into the tractor. I somehow managed to stand up at the time as I looked down and watched the seat fold in half as it crushed against the tractor. No more 3 point hitch for this backhoe.

THis is what I am considering. see diagram. I would appreciate comments. I have a plasma cutter and a couple of stick and mig welders so I think I can do this safely.

The point is that it is almost a straight line i.e. no bends necessary for a ladder type subframe.
1. I am planning on 2x3x1/4 steel rectangular tub but I might up that to 2x4x1/4 tube. I need opinions.
2. should I just drill out 3/4 holes for the cat 1 pins our or should I attempt to sleave them?
3. how thick should I make the plates that attach to the Backhoe and on and low arm hitch points on tractor. I am currently planning on doubling up 1/4 plate steel.
4. are we confident that the lower arm support pins will support this BH? It seams that the swing arms held all the weight previously and these lower arm pins only had upward and outward forces. There really isn't any room for an over the axle type bracket.

Lastly None of this will avoid a future broken top link sending me to a possible worse demise. While it is not shown in the diagram I actually can configure the Backhoe with two top links. both the Backhoe seat bracket and the tractor have 3 mounting points for top links. while there is some play in the tractor mount because its has this silly drag control flex point, it should still avoid a single top link failure causing catastrophy.


Thoughts?

Thanks,
Tom W.

 

[dfkrug]

Lastly None of this will avoid a future broken top link sending me to a possible worse demise.

Why not go with a rigid connection between the hoe and subframe? You can weld them together, with plenty of bracing, AND use the toplink holes as well. You have already seen what can happen if you crush or collapse a regular-duty toplink. Even with 3-pt hoes, the toplink is enhanced, plus triangulated with a very strong brace to minimize this hazard. Permanently attaching subframe to hoe is perfectly OK.

As for steel thicknesses, it is hard to say. You can do a LOT of welding with 1/4" steel and it may be strong enough. You can do less welding with 1/2" plates. It depends on the design. If you use tubing, then weldments that attach to them should wrap around them.

 

[chatwithtom]

Why not go with a rigid connection between the hoe and subframe?

Thanks dfkrug, I was afraid of adding too much torque component to the subframe. Hence the lower connections with pins and the upper with a couple of top links. As I had it there would only be torque on the frame based on the weight of the BH and some of the digging pulling forces would be split between all the 3 point attach points of tractor. By NOT using the tractor top link connection. all pulling forces would be transferred as torque to the sub frame and extra force on the lower 3-point tractor pins.

None the less, I will investigate. If it works out I will move to 2x4x1/4 rectungular tubing and build the triangulated brace.

Thanks again.

 

[dfkrug]

I was afraid of adding too much torque component to the subframe.

Transferring bending moments to the subframe is exactly what you want.

If you are planning to hang your subframe from the inboard 3-pt arm pivots, then you should also consider a more secure and rigid mount to the axle and rear end housings. There are often existing threaded holes there, plus the ROPS mounting can be used.

I have not seen the Jinma tractors up close, but I hear they are built fairly stout in the rear axle dept.

 

[ericm979]

Wow, close call there!


The factory Branson subframe is similar to what you're considering. It's got two long sections of tubing that go up to a frame tube across the bottom of the tractor between the loader mounts. There's a couple toggle latches there that get flipped up to grab the tube. At the rear, there are two ears that hook over the 3pt arm bolts (after removing the arms and putting the bolts back in). The BH itself is a model that can also be used as a 3pt BH. The subframe has braces that trangulate the BH so it can't pivot on the subframe. I use a heavy duty top link on advice from the dealer, but its more for taking out play and flex than fully taking all the force. The tractor's rear axle is sturdy and the 3pt arm bolts go into a weldment that is bolted on the axle.

getting the subframe to line up so you can insert bolts through the 3pt mounts seems like it could be a lot of work.

 

[dfkrug]

I use a heavy duty top link on advice from the dealer, but its more for taking out play and flex than fully taking all the force.

That is good advice from the dealer. Many Kioti dealers have done the opposite: tell the user not to use the toplink hole on the hoe. Since Kiotis mostly use the old-fashioned undermount ladder-style subframes with triangulation braces, there is flex. Using the toplink connection reduces that flex. Those who choose not to use a toplink eventually experience metal fatigue at the braces, even after welding them.