Any downsides to getting a CDL?

[Jcoon]

You won’t go un-noticed, all we do is notice things, it is the job.

Best thing to do is just do it legally and safely, you do not want to put other people at danger.

 

[4570Man]

I think ultimately, a truck and trailer rated for a full sized backhoe is gonna be CDL A territory. Don't matter if it's a dually one ton or a semi.

12-14k backhoe on a 16k + trailer behind a dually. Even that's over the 26k.

The ONLY difference is if it's behind a dually pickup, you are more likely to go un-noticed and pass right by most LEO's.

But if towing on a semi and lowboy...you look the part of a commercial hauler

It’s actually a 16.5 k backhoe on a 22k trailer. And the semi is no doubt the safer way. It’s really a stupid law that forces people to a less capable tow vehicle.

 

[Jcoon]

It’s really a stupid law that forces people to a less capable tow vehicle.

Why do you feel this way?

You think it’s stupid to force people that are moving extreme amounts of weight down the road to be safe and know how to control there rig?

This “stupid law” actually forces people to use a MORE capable tow vehicle, because without these laws and regulations, you could use a ford ranger or s-10 to tow your 16,000 pound backhoe..

 

[RickB]

The stupid part is all the personal use and RV exemptions.

 

[4570Man]

Why do you feel this way?

You think it’s stupid to force people that are moving extreme amounts of weight down the road to be safe and know how to control there rig?

This “stupid law” actually forces people to use a MORE capable tow vehicle, because without these laws and regulations, you could use a ford ranger or s-10 to tow your 16,000 pound backhoe..

You could tow it for a personal use with a dually and be fine. Maybe not legally but enforcement is pretty lax here and people do it all the time. I have less problems with personal exemptions than RV exemptions. Those drivers usually are the least qualified with the worst loads. And people push 1 tons to the max to avoid CDL where a heavier truck would be a lot better.

 

[LD1]

In your case, a 22k trailer can only be towed with a 4k truck to keep it under CDL....legally speaking.

In the eyes of the law, there is no difference towing your load with a 3500 or with a semi. As I said, the only difference is the pickup gets overlooked more often.

The first stupid part....imo....is that it goes off of gvwr and not gvw. Say a guy has a 14k trailer to haul around his 8k machine behind a 15 year old dually with an 11,200 gvwr. All is well. Guy goes and buys a new dually of exact same make and model...just 15 years newer and now has a 14k gvw on truck. Now all of the sudden a CDL is needed. Where the SAME load behind old 3/4ton, or modern half ton (less safe) is perfectly legal. Or pushing the limits of a 12k trailer to make it legal.

Second stupid part IMO, is thinking that upholding a guy in a pickup and 20' trailer needs to be held to the same licensing standards as a guy in a 80,000# 53' trailer behind a semi.

 

[Jcoon]

Actually LD1 you are completely wrong!

It goes by gross weight rating, register weight rating, or actual weight over the scales! Whatever is the highest.

Here in NY, if you are in an RV your exempt with the RV exemption from a CDL, NOT ONE OF US agree with this law, we all think they should be held to the same standards due to the weight!

And even if it’s personal use, all licensing laws apply to you.

4570man, I do not understand your statement about people pushing 1 tons to the max to avoid CDL laws???

Once your truck weighs over 26,001 pounds, you need a class B, once your combination is over 26,001 pounds and the trailer weighs over 10,001 pounds, you need a class A. Only way around this is with a RV.

As far as your second stupid part, like we tell everyone that says this line to us at least once a week, did your mom ever tell you life was fair?

 

[newbury]

In your case, a 22k trailer can only be towed with a 4k truck to keep it under CDL....legally speaking.

In the eyes of the law, there is no difference towing your load with a 3500 or with a semi. As I said, the only difference is the pickup gets overlooked more often.

The first stupid part....imo....is that it goes off of gvwr and not gvw. Say a guy has a 14k trailer to haul around his 8k machine behind a 15 year old dually with an 11,200 gvwr. All is well. Guy goes and buys a new dually of exact same make and model...just 15 years newer and now has a 14k gvw on truck. Now all of the sudden a CDL is needed. Where the SAME load behind old 3/4ton, or modern half ton (less safe) is perfectly legal. Or pushing the limits of a 12k trailer to make it legal.<snip>

From my readings the guy was breaking the law in the first place. There have been several threads on here about that it is illegal to tow an EMPTY 14K trailer behind a truck with a 11,200 gvwr.

Actually LD1 you are completely wrong!

It goes by gross weight rating, register weight rating, or actual weight over the scales! Whatever is the highest.

<snip>

So if I've a truck with a tow rating GVWR of 7,000 lbs is it illegal to tow an empty trailer weighing only 2,000 but it has a GVWR of 10,000?

 

[mikester]

From my readings the guy was breaking the law in the first place. There have been several threads on here about that it is illegal to tow an EMPTY 14K trailer behind a truck with a 11,200 gvwr.



So if I've a truck with a tow rating GVWR of 7,000 lbs is it illegal to tow an empty trailer weighing only 2,000 but it has a GVWR of 10,000?

It all depends on your local laws. Here you have to have a CDL if you tow anything over 4,600kgs and/or operating a vehicle weighing more than 11,000kgs. Doesn’t matter if it’s full or empty.

 

[Jcoon]

From my readings the guy was breaking the law in the first place. There have been several threads on here about that it is illegal to tow an EMPTY 14K trailer behind a truck with a 11,200 gvwr.



So if I've a truck with a tow rating GVWR of 7,000 lbs is it illegal to tow an empty trailer weighing only 2,000 but it has a GVWR of 10,000?

A tow rating GVWR of 7,000?

Do you mean GCVWR? Gross combined vehicle weight rating?

 

[prof fate]

I知 thinking of getting a CDL and buying a single axle semi because theyæ±*e cheap and way more capable than a ton truck. I can also see myself owning a real dump truck in the future. I値l probably have get a dot physical every year. Am I missing anything else?

Higher fees, more involved for renewal - must bring birth certificate for example. Fees in PA vary by class and endorsements - B (trailer max 10k lbs), A (tractor trailer), passenger, school bus, hasmat, liquid/tanker..perhaps more.

Won't affect your personal car insurance.

DUI - alcohol limits are HALF a non-CDL license

Physical every 2 years, perhaps annually depending on your health and doctor. Mine is $65 as my regular dr does it. Walmart and other quickie med places do them, $85 I'm told.

You should be able to drive up to 26k vehicle on your regular license..and perhaps a larger trailer than a class B allows if you go that route. I drive a bus so have a class B.

I did my training through the local school bus company = got paid to be trained and they paid the test fee, physical, etc. Can't see spending 4-6k for what I learned!

 

[RickB]

Higher fees, more involved for renewal - must bring birth certificate for example. Fees in PA vary by class and endorsements - B (trailer max 10k lbs), A (tractor trailer), passenger, school bus, hasmat, liquid/tanker..perhaps more.

Won't affect your personal car insurance.

DUI - alcohol limits are HALF a non-CDL license

Physical every 2 years, perhaps annually depending on your health and doctor. Mine is $65 as my regular dr does it. Walmart and other quickie med places do them, $85 I'm told.

You should be able to drive up to 26k vehicle on your regular license..and perhaps a larger trailer than a class B allows if you go that route. I drive a bus so have a class B.

I did my training through the local school bus company = got paid to be trained and they paid the test fee, physical, etc. Can't see spending 4-6k for what I learned!

The first and only DOT physical I got that wasn’t doubled up with a standard annual checkup set me back $200.

 

[prof fate]

No.

GVWR is the TRUCKS total carrying capacity. Has very little to nothing to do with trailer towing ability. And I've never seen a law about how much trailer you can/should tow (other than CDL stuff).

Trailer sellers shade the truth (ok, lie) all the time - and most folks haven't a clue about towing capacity.

What you need to know is your tow vehicls GCWR - gross COMBINED weight rating.

You can get an F350 that is 27k lbs...the typical F150 is more like 14,000, SUV's (expedition say) is more like 12,500.

From that deduct the ACTUAL weight of the truck - in my silverdo's case it was 5700 lbs empty, 14,400 GCWR - so in REALITY I could tow 8700 lbs - NOT the 9600 lbs the book said!
The truck has a GVWR of 7000 - so total payload is only 1300 - my windstar had a higher payload capicity!

Not add 750lb toung weight to the truck and i'm left with 550 lbs of payload - people, cargo, etc, in the truck. WAY easy to be over loaded (4 door truck can hold 6 people..with a bumper pull trailer the bed is empty...you see camper folks with bikes, grilles, firewood in there, 4 or 5 people and a dog up front... or a cap on the back taking up evem more payload).

I now have an F350, haven't had it on the scales, but it's GVWR is 10,500. It's a 2 door, so 5700lbs is a guess - I can load it with over 2 TONS of payload! I've pulled the same trailer - NO comparison in how it rides/handles and stops compared to the lighter truck. Similar engines too. A diesel just makes things so much nicer yet.

Haven't done a fifth wheel but the truck is equipped.

From my readings the guy was breaking the law in the first place. There have been several threads on here about that it is illegal to tow an EMPTY 14K trailer behind a truck with a 11,200 gvwr.



So if I've a truck with a tow rating GVWR of 7,000 lbs is it illegal to tow an empty trailer weighing only 2,000 but it has a GVWR of 10,000?

 

[farm boy00]

If I were going to get the license I’d just bite the bullet and go to the school. That way it’s in their best interest to get you out of there with a CDL license in hand. I know the pre check is a real biatch.
I don’t have a CDL, but I do have a dot number. I just got it recently. I only haul my own property, my truck is registered over 10k, and I pull a trailer over 10k, but my registered GCWR is 26k. So no CDL. I was told that all I need is the dot # and a UCR registration which is like 60-70 bucks a year. That’s it, since I’m a private carrier. So far so good.

Sent you a pm about the dot #

 

[4570Man]

No.

GVWR is the TRUCKS total carrying capacity. Has very little to nothing to do with trailer towing ability. And I've never seen a law about how much trailer you can/should tow (other than CDL stuff).

Trailer sellers shade the truth (ok, lie) all the time - and most folks haven't a clue about towing capacity.

What you need to know is your tow vehicls GCWR - gross COMBINED weight rating.

You can get an F350 that is 27k lbs...the typical F150 is more like 14,000, SUV's (expedition say) is more like 12,500.

From that deduct the ACTUAL weight of the truck - in my silverdo's case it was 5700 lbs empty, 14,400 GCWR - so in REALITY I could tow 8700 lbs - NOT the 9600 lbs the book said!
The truck has a GVWR of 7000 - so total payload is only 1300 - my windstar had a higher payload capicity!

Not add 750lb toung weight to the truck and i'm left with 550 lbs of payload - people, cargo, etc, in the truck. WAY easy to be over loaded (4 door truck can hold 6 people..with a bumper pull trailer the bed is empty...you see camper folks with bikes, grilles, firewood in there, 4 or 5 people and a dog up front... or a cap on the back taking up evem more payload).

I now have an F350, haven't had it on the scales, but it's GVWR is 10,500. It's a 2 door, so 5700lbs is a guess - I can load it with over 2 TONS of payload! I've pulled the same trailer - NO comparison in how it rides/handles and stops compared to the lighter truck. Similar engines too. A diesel just makes things so much nicer yet.

Haven't done a fifth wheel but the truck is equipped.

Your truck is heavier than that. You might get a ton of payload. My dump truck scales at 7k and it’s a 2wd regular cab 5 speed transmission.

 

[prof fate]

dump truck..gotta weight more than a simple 8' bed single cab. At some point i'll get it on a scale and see. But even at 7k empty..that's 3500 lb payload left over.

it's why folks that try to do 5th wheels with 1/2 ton trucks are fools - 20% of that trailer is payload on the truck and none are equipped to handle it.

the silverado was 5.5 bed, with tonneau cover and 4 doors - so more interior.

When the calculate towing capacity they figure base stripped version, 150lb driver and 1/2 tank of gas. Few trucks are really equipped that way, and the only 150lb men I know are teens or over 80. LOL

 

[bdog]

If you're only hauling your own stuff, could you just get a non-CDL Class A or B, like the folks that drive RV's do? I just started to research this myself as I have a 3500 Crew/Chassis with a GVWR of 12,300. If I hauled a 14K gooseneck, I'd be over the 26,000 combined rating.

Not all states offer a non commercial Class A/B. Texas does I think but not all states do. They make you get a CDL. Not sure about TN.

 

[bdog]

The ONLY difference is if it's behind a dually pickup, you are more likely to go un-noticed and pass right by most LEO's.

But if towing on a semi and lowboy...you look the part of a commercial hauler

I disagree with this big time. Around here the DOT stops every pickup and gooseneck they can because it is like shooting fish in barrel as the vast majority of them are running illegal. I made a trip from Texas to Missouri and back. On the trip I saw 5 separate DOT with people pulled over on the side of the road inspecting them. 4 of 5 were pickups with goosenecks.

 

[newbury]

A tow rating GVWR of 7,000?

Do you mean GCVWR? Gross combined vehicle weight rating?

I meant if my truck is rated to tow 7,000 lbs.

 

[Jcoon]

I meant if my truck is rated to tow 7,000 lbs.

Well then your trailer can’t weigh over 7,000 pounds, easy as that.