New truck #@$%@#&

[3930dave]

I bought an 02 Dmax dually with a lot of frills on it. Now it has 130k on it and my wife dropped many hints I should just buy a new one, just because. We have the money and a monster camper to pull which my truck pulls with no problem. I did go down and priced a replacement of the equivalent and found it to be 60K+. I paid 44K for mine originally and eventually spent money on injectors and cab corners. Stored in an air conditioned dry garage.

I have 2 people that were hounding me to buy it because it still is a very nice truck and am considering it, but I find I really like driving it. Because if this thing lasted 15 years and looks and drives so good, I imagine a new one would last till they plant me. On the other side, I would think a new truck would depreciate in 1-2 years more than the whole value of my truck, and that is why I seem to be keeping it still. It is nice riding and I don't think I would ever buy a stripped down truck. I need many of the bells and whistles to make life comfortable.

Nice to have choices like that to make !

Even with a large bank account, I'd be driving the wheels off that '02. Surprised you only have 2 people chasing that truck..... any pre-07diesel in reasonable shape usually gets huge interest, and for good reason.

If you're not aware of the "challenges" of owning a modern diesel truck, read up before you sell the 02 - otherwise you may really regret letting it go.

Rgds, D.

 

[DieselBound]

I've never bought a new vehicle (other than my Kioti), and don't plan on it. Initial depreciation, licensing and insurance costs, not to mention repair costs (I do most work on all my equipment). My old 1993 F250 was recently retired (blown head gasket- a real pig, but it worked up until the bitter end), replaced by a "new" 1994 Dodge 2500 w/Cummins and 5spd (194kmiles and was taken really good care of). I don't do spark plugs, hence another diesel.

Deer Dude likes his 02 Dmax and I'd have to say keep it! If something works for you why get rid of it? Yeah, there can be increased maintenance, though costs can be lots less than with newer vehicles. I've got several (three) 2000 VW Golf TDIs, and every time I drive my car it makes me smile (nothing else I'd rather drive, other than my tractors)- it does everything I need it to do: operational costs are low (I average over 50mpg with mine- other two are right on the threshold). I strive to want what I have...

To the OP: if your old truck was great then that ought to tell you that old trucks CAN be great. I'd look for an older truck that meets your requirements, one that's in great shape (well maintained); maybe put a few bucks into it to make it perfect and then drive on...

 

[djefferis]

djefferis what I hear from some involved with auto financing is that many buyers are only interested in the amount of the monthly payment and not really concerned with the selling price.

Sales tax adds no value to a truck but the more you pay in sales tax in my state the more you pay in tax on that vehicle each year. The taxes saved can go a long way in reconditioning a current truck or a solid used one. Cost of collision insurance can be an on going concern. What city drivers pay for insurance is more around here compared to rural farm areas.

In my experience (indirectly involved in the sales process professionally) - payment is the driver of sales - but you will be amazed at the stupidity of some people when it comes to "price" - IE - Truck is a priced at 28,800 - now with that price, I am going to charge you a doc prep fee to deliver your title of $800, I am going to make you finance using the finance program from the maker at a interest rate of 1% above what you can get at your local CU and at a 6 year term and I am going to practically force you to buy some protection plans that you will never use and are a huge money maker for me (all of these cost of course are financed - so your not only paying for them now - but over the next 6 years) - yet IF I tried to sell you the same truck at 30k - allow you to use your own finance and didn't push the extras - while you'd have a lower monthly payment - you'd still be complaining how the guy down the street is selling the truck for 28,800 and saying if I dont match - your going to him.

Taxes are very much a regional consideration - most states, you pay sales tax at the point of purchase - and a flat registration. Some you pay at purchase and a use tax each year based on value - and a few zero sales tax or yearly valuation tax. Again, in the majority of states where a flat percentage is paid up front - you can deduct the value of a trade off a NEW purchase only - so trade in a 10k vehicle on a 40k - pay tax on the 30k difference only.

Insurance again is VERY different - trucks cost more than cars in general (heavier, more likely to cause damage in a collision and typically higher risk of injury to occupants) - rates will vary greatly by carrier - where one company is 40% less for a rural area - another may be equal and a company with a focus on metro areas may actually be less in the city. Alot has to do with the overall experience and market a company is trying to attract. A truck in a city is much more likely to be vandalized, to be involved in a minor accident and to be used in a business application (in general) - whereas one in a rural setting will be involved in less, but more severe accidents in general - and while they have less frequent vandalism rates, the comprehensive (other than collision) claims rates are much higher (animal collisions likely the reason here - but theft is also hire by many measures). On taxes and insurance - there are no "one size fits all" answers - the difference between a no-fault insurance state and a non no-fault state alone could cause a pricing difference of 100% or more easily depending on which side of the state line you live on.

 

[4570Man]

I see those trucks for sale with over 300000 miles pretty often and 400000 isn’t uncommon. I’d hold onto it as long as you can to avoid the emissions crap.

 

[Groo]

I am the family "buyer". About the last true work truck availiable was probably the one I found for a family member;
2009 F350 SWR V10 standard cab 4x4 with a bench seat. I think 09 might have been the last year for a bench seat. I love bench seats. Yes, its got integral brake controller, CD and AC, but it also has a vinyl floor and crank windows. I managed to find an X plan number, and it was when the 2010s were out so there was a significant rebate. I think it was about $25k + tax when it was all said and done. About the only thing I wish it had that is doesn't are skid plates and a snow plow prep package. It had its bed removed and a flat bed with sides dump bed installed.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

In my experience (indirectly involved in the sales process professionally) - payment is the driver of sales - but you will be amazed at the stupidity of some people when it comes to "price" - IE - Truck is a priced at 28,800 - now with that price, I am going to charge you a doc prep fee to deliver your title of $800, I am going to make you finance using the finance program from the maker at a interest rate of 1% above what you can get at your local CU and at a 6 year term and I am going to practically force you to buy some protection plans that you will never use and are a huge money maker for me (all of these cost of course are financed - so your not only paying for them now - but over the next 6 years) - yet IF I tried to sell you the same truck at 30k - allow you to use your own finance and didn't push the extras - while you'd have a lower monthly payment - you'd still be complaining how the guy down the street is selling the truck for 28,800 and saying if I dont match - your going to him.

Taxes are very much a regional consideration - most states, you pay sales tax at the point of purchase - and a flat registration. Some you pay at purchase and a use tax each year based on value - and a few zero sales tax or yearly valuation tax. Again, in the majority of states where a flat percentage is paid up front - you can deduct the value of a trade off a NEW purchase only - so trade in a 10k vehicle on a 40k - pay tax on the 30k difference only.

Insurance again is VERY different - trucks cost more than cars in general (heavier, more likely to cause damage in a collision and typically higher risk of injury to occupants) - rates will vary greatly by carrier - where one company is 40% less for a rural area - another may be equal and a company with a focus on metro areas may actually be less in the city. Alot has to do with the overall experience and market a company is trying to attract. A truck in a city is much more likely to be vandalized, to be involved in a minor accident and to be used in a business application (in general) - whereas one in a rural setting will be involved in less, but more severe accidents in general - and while they have less frequent vandalism rates, the comprehensive (other than collision) claims rates are much higher (animal collisions likely the reason here - but theft is also hire by many measures). On taxes and insurance - there are no "one size fits all" answers - the difference between a no-fault insurance state and a non no-fault state alone could cause a pricing difference of 100% or more easily depending on which side of the state line you live on.

While the doc free was lower than most at $399 and they told me it was twice as much across the street at the Ford dealership but it still did not make me feel better. That fee was 5% of the purchase price in my case and the taxes was 6% of the selling price. He asked if I wanted to buy a repair policy. I said how much and he said $1400 for some short period of time. I asked him if he thought I was interested in paying 20% of the selling price for that policy and he said NO but I have to get you to sign you refused the coverage.

I told him I knew he had a job to do so it was nothing personal but it was 5 PM and I had not eaten since about 6 AM and before him I had been dealing with people that kept moving the goal post.

What I had going for me it was a beater truck with no driver AC, major cracks in the windshield, side swiped on the right side, cab corners rusted out and they had had it on cargurus over two months. It was a Ford at a Chevy/Cadillac dealership and they had to find a cash buyer because no lender would loan money for an 8 year old beater it that shape and the car auction would have been a worse crap shot then dealing with me. The sales manager was out that Monday but he and I had shot the breeze for a good while on Saturday about our military experiences in Europe, etc. He told me he was going to have his form Ford tech check it out on Monday because he was out on Saturday.

The tech was awesome and actually sold me on getting the truck when he took me on a test drive to show me the banging rear end was already much improved and should be better with time since he serviced it. I had told them I wanted to see inside it when he drained it and they did walk me back to the shop and have the tech talk to me about it and other questions that I had since it was on the lift. We did the test drive after he got it resealed and refilled.

The guy that was coaching the sales lady (it was like a team) near the end of the second day asked if I was serious about the truck. I just looked at him in my worn out state of mind and asked him why he thought I had been then there two days in a row with my cash offer in hand.

In hindsight it is kind of comical but not so much that day for either party I am sure.

I did not mess with anyone but told the general manager up front and in front of the sales people that typically I bought older stuff about ready to go to the auction barn for what they could expect to get there or a bit more and after the deal they would not hear me crying about the deal. If they did not want to deal that way just say so and I would be on my way. I guess Mondays are slow car sales wise because until very late in the day the lookers were in short supply.

I hope this F150 gets me to old tractor shows for the next 20 years. There were a few men at the May show that were around 90.

 

[buickanddeere]

Wife痴 crew cab truck was ordered without the Center Console . Not unusual to have enough passengers , tools, equipment , groceries , dogs etc to require seating three in the front .

 

[Gale Hawkins]

Hats off to the advertising department of all the manufacturers convincing people they need an $80,000 truck to go to the mall.

I agree and the prices just keep going up. I understand the newer technology do add new costs but it the beginning or along the way they have to be paid for by someone and as a used buyer I appreciate the new buyers that make my purchases possible.

View attachment 2010 Ford F150 window price.jpg

This is the actual window sticker stuck inside the owner's manual of the 2010 Ford F150 we just bought. The base 2010 F150 was around $22,000 and this one was $45,140.00 you can see. Today the same truck I expect would run about 20%+ more. Even after a new windshield, body damage repair (including cleaning up and painting the frame and bed while the bed is off frame) and a new set of wheels we are going to have 20% of the sticker price in the truck. At 205K miles this is by far not a risk free deal but I have put about 1500 miles on it and have no current drive train concerns.

At 67 I have to think about hobby costs like this truck because the purchase price is just ONE of many ongoing associated cost of truck ownership. Now I want a bumper pull trailer with two 7K axles for example.

This venture is also one way I train the kids about used vehicle purchases who turn 21 this year. The son checked it out on his back by going under it when it was still on the dealer's lot taking several photos with my cell phone and both of them have been under it since we got it home. I do not want them to have fear of used vehicles.

 

[ArlyA]

This past fall, we ordered* a plain Tacoma with the smaller 4 banger engine and manual tranny. For fancy we got the extended cab which they call access, which was to haul the dogs. Its not perfect but have liked it so far. Cost us about $25000 and sure gets good fuel mileage.

* came from another dealer.

 

[dfkrug]

This past fall, we ordered* a plain Tacoma with the smaller 4 banger engine and manual tranny. For fancy we got the extended cab which they call access, for the dogs. Its not perfect but have liked it so far. Cost us about $25000.

* came from another dealer.

Did the dealer transfer the truck from another dealer, or did you place a factory order? If the latter, did you get to specify everything, including color, or did they force you into packages? Prob was built in TX.

Dealers do NOT want to sell strippo trucks, and Toyota now forces all buyers into four doors. There is no longer even a 2-door option on Toyota Tacos.

An old guy friend of mine has purchased 3 Toyota strippos in the past 35y, and 2 of the 3 (2WDs) were sold after 10y of ownership and 150K+ miles at nearly 80% of new cost. The 3rd ('86 4x4) is rusting outside on one of his properties.

 

[ultrarunner]

I had some time at Toyota this morning and the technology that is standard is amazing...

Recently rented a Corolla in Seattle... good little car with lane assist, radar cruise, backup and all the electronics...

Dealer said out the door with tax and license just under 20K... I realize this is a lot of money but they do hold their value, are traditionally economical and get good mileage...

I enjoyed the rental...

My uncle bought a stripped down Tacoma in 2016??? 4 cylinder with regular cab... he has driven it cross country and said no complaints...

Some say boring... I say reliable with top resale... when Mom's old Corolla was stolen she got 50% of what she paid 14 years prior...

10 year old Range Rover would be about 5%...

 

[ArlyA]

We didn't buy a new Tacoma after seeing used ones for more than we paid for this new, plain model. Of course they had options X,Z,C,T,R in them. Seems ours a SR model. Two items we have missed is cruise control and interment wipers. In the county, I found myself cursing in the 70's in 55 speed zone road, it rides so darn quiet. So we put a factor cruise in it for 300 some dollars and its the exactly the same as toy sells. This stupid thing gets better fuel mileage that our Hondu Element does!! (both are 4wd or AWD)

 

[Ritothebull]

After having a bunch of computer issues on my wife's car and then selling it back to VW (part of the TDI scandal), I convinced her that the new cars and trucks are a lousy investment and we would be better off getting her a classic car that I can repair myself, she said she wants a 68 mustang like she had in college.:thumbsup:

 

[ArlyA]

I think you should get her that 68 musttang. I drove a 68 ford torino and don't miss it one bit. I like AWD, air conditioning and comfortable seats, not to mention far less maintenance.

After having a bunch of computer issues on my wife's car and then selling it back to VW (part of the TDI scandal), I convinced her that the new cars and trucks are a lousy investment and we would be better off getting her a classic car that I can repair myself, she said she wants a 68 mustang like she had in college.:thumbsup:

 

[Jstpssng]

After having a bunch of computer issues on my wife's car and then selling it back to VW (part of the TDI scandal), I convinced her that the new cars and trucks are a lousy investment and we would be better off getting her a classic car that I can repair myself, she said she wants a 68 mustang like she had in college.:thumbsup:

A common misconception is that newer cars are less dependable, computers ruin them, etc; yet that's one reason why they can go 300k miles or more with proper maintenance. 30 or even 20 years ago, 100k miles was a high mileage vehicle; now the drive train warrantee lasts that long and you don't even need to change the spark plugs until then. To say nothing about changing and setting points, the occasional valve seal/guide replacement, et.al. I remember my father rebuilding the front end on his one year old '75 Power Wagon at 12k miles because the bearings wore out and the dealer said there was nothing they could do for him; not long after that he was driving a '78 F150. Just after he bought the Dodge he also bought my sister a used '73 Torino; everyone commented on what good shape the body was in on that 3 year old car because it wasn't rusted out. As an older friend is very fond of saying "they sure don't make them like they used to... Thank God!"

Then again there's nothing bad to be said about a '68 Mustang, if that's what she wants.

 

[downsizingnow48]

My wife wanted a second car to keep at our vacation place. I tried to talk her into a classic car of some kind. Because I can fix it. Then I thought, the cars I owned in the 60s and 70s, could hardly go 1000 miles before something needed to be fixed or adjusted. And then I thought, I really do not want to be fixing cars any more. So I got her a new Subaru instead.

My 2012 F150 is at 115k with nothing other than tires, brakes, oil changes. Spark plugs at 100k. Still runs and looks like new. Those cars of the 60s and 70s would be ready for the scrapyard at 70k.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

My wife wanted a second car to keep at our vacation place. I tried to talk her into a classic car of some kind. Because I can fix it. Then I thought, the cars I owned in the 60s and 70s, could hardly go 1000 miles before something needed to be fixed or adjusted. And then I thought, I really do not want to be fixing cars any more. So I got her a new Subaru instead.

My 2012 F150 is at 115k with nothing other than tires, brakes, oil changes. Spark plugs at 100k. Still runs and looks like new. Those cars of the 60s and 70s would be ready for the scrapyard at 70k.

Thanks for the update on the 2012 F-150.Sounds positive since we've just picked up the 2010 F-150 with 205K miles that rides and handles so well.

 

[ultrarunner]

I've been fortunate with my 85 service truck... Water Pump and Starter... that's about it except for pads and shoes...

One of our nurses has 380k on her 88 Accord bought new when she got her first RN job... Several fuel and water pumps

Brother has over 300k on his 300d Mercedes

 

[Gale Hawkins]

Another factor that I have experienced is trucks averaging 25,,000 miles annually are just have more life left in them at the same number of miles as say one driven like 12,500 miles each year..

A 30 year low mileage Ford F100 turned out to be the most expensive trucks I have owned.

 

[4570Man]

Another factor that I have experienced is trucks averaging 25,,000 miles annually are just have more life left in them at the same number of miles as say one driven like 12,500 miles each year..

A 30 year low mileage Ford F100 turned out to be the most expensive trucks I have owned.

Same experience here. Age is worse than mileage. And 0 miles a year is by far the worst.