smoke alarm help - false alarms

[thatguy]

About 4 mths ago I installed all new photo-electric smoke alarms in my house - but elected to NOT hook them up so they all go off if one goes off. Our house is small enough that you can here anywhere anyway. The previous ionization alarms were always giving us false alarms, and all 6 alarms going off at the same time drove our animals crazy..

We run the ceiling fan in our bedroom every night since they were installed so it is pushing the air down (summer position) without any issues.

Yesterday I reversed the fan to the winter position so it pushes upward. Last night I turned the ceiling fan on around 9pm.. at 130 we get a false alarm (1 alarm sounded) and then stopped.. There is an alarm in the bedroom and then one right outside the bedroom door in a foyer - wasnt sure which one went off. Checked all the detectors and no fire found and now detector had a light blinking showing it was the one that went off..

Went back to bed.. At 530 2 alarms sound and then it stops. This time I woke up quick enough to verify it was the alarm in the bedroom that went off based on seeing a red blinking light with each alarm sounding. Check everything no fire. Thinking the alarm was bad I started to take it down but i could feel the wind that the fan was putting off along the ceiling and wondered if that was what set it off twice last night.


Would a ceiling fan pushing air upward set off a photo-electric smoke alarm? Unless it was pushing up animal fur I didnt think they should go off..

thoughts

Brian

 

[Mendonsy]

I suspect that just a small amount of dust in the air would set one off.

 

[DuckSlayer1017]

Why does it seem like you get the most false alarms in the middle of the night. Whenever it happens it takes me a long time to get back to sleep because of the adrenaline from being woken up by the alarm.

Well the wife using the broiler sets off the smoke alarms a lot too.

 

[F3506]

Be sure to check the batteries as well. Read the manual. I had some (non photo) smoke alarms that only seemed to like Rayovac batteries. And the manual even said to use Rayovac batteries to avoid problems. Energizer and Duracell always caused false alarms, and always at night. But to be fair, the Rayovac's only died at night to keep it consistent.

I've got the 10 year lithium ones now.

 

[rustyshakelford]

They have 3 wires on the pigtail. Which one did you leave unhooked. The power and ground, power the detector during normal operation and the battery is for power outages. White/black are for power and orange is what connects them all. I would strongly encourage you to interlink them. They literally save lives. They are seatbelt of your home.

Fans shouldn't be an issue unless there is an above normal amount of dust or other contaminants especially with 4 month old detectors. Also, the first time you kick your heater on be prepared for an unusual smell to most and possibly a slight haze.

Check your ac filters. Change if dirty, get a can of compressed air and blow out the detectors. Check their date of manufacture. Max 8-10 year life expectancy

Brett

 

[Slowpoke Slim]

It isn't the air current that's the problem, it's what is being carried on the air current. Dust. Most of the lower grade detectors can't tell the difference between a particle of dust and a particle of smoke. When you switched direction on your ceiling fan, did you notice any dust on the fan blades? You could try thoroughly cleaning the fan blades and fan itself and give that a go. Or, you could just return the fan to it's original directional setting (or both).

Photo electric sensors are better than the older ion detectors. But the more basic single optic detector units are still quite prone to false readings. I'm not even sure if dual optical sensor detectors are available for stand alone residential use, but I am a commercial fire alarm tech, and that is the type of detector we install in commercial buildings. The dual detector, twin mirror units are much more reliable. You can still get false alarms, and a dirty commercial setting would still be a problem, but the improvement is significant. Also in a commercial system, you can program different sensitivity settings into individual detectors that may be in different environments.

Also, there is a new standard coming out for smoke detectors, which is even tighter on allowable false readings parameters. We have several commercial detector models that will become obsolete when the new UL standard "hits the streets".

 

[Redlands Okie]

Minor amounts of dust can sure set them off. When reversing the ceiling fans did you clean off the blades. The blades sure do accumulate dust on them and loose it when reversed. Of course they then start collecting dust on the other side. The change of air flow could be moving dust around else where that the down flow previously did not. And as others said good battery makes a difference although one would think a new detector would have good battery.

 

[thatguy]

Thanks for all the feedback.. My wife just cleaned the fan blades last weekend - BUT with 4 furry kids running around it could accumulate quickly...

when i installed them i used brand new 10yr lithium batteries and I checked the exp dates on all before buying them. They all had at least 9 years before expiring.. i bought First Alert BRK 7010B- they had good reviews, but it really seemed like a crap shoot..

So far, these photo-electric have not been set off with cooking like the ionization ones did.. We have even been doing a lot of pan grilling stuff lately and that used to set the old detectors off every time.

When i was researching new detectors i was shocked at how many reviews of 'false alarms' ppl complained about.. I know one article said that with hardwired detectors a change in voltage could set them off and stated that at night the power company may have a larger swing in voltage. So that is why a lot of the false alarms at night, they said..

Brian

 

[oosik]

In a couple weeks when I turn the overhead paddle fan on in the living room - I can expect a couple of days of false alarms from the dust it will stir up. Then everything settles down and is OK for the remainder of the winter. I've tried dusting first - same 'ol results.

 

[kthompson]

Maybe the dust being stirred is built up very slowly in the detector itself and the upward air flow is moving it? Could also be reason happening at night is heat is coming on then as outside temps drop pushing more dust into the air for the fans to stir. But I have noticed it seems our batteries only go out at night.

 

[4570Man]

Mine in the attic gave off multiple false alarms. I'm not sure if it was the cold or dust. Probably dust. Non of the other ones have ever given problems. The one closest to the wood stove and kitchen stove gets set off a couple times a year but that's not really a false alarm.

 

[rustyshakelford]

Mine in the attic gave off multiple false alarms. I'm not sure if it was the cold or dust. Probably dust. Non of the other ones have ever given problems. The one closest to the wood stove and kitchen stove gets set off a couple times a year but that's not really a false alarm.

Attic detectors are or should generally be rate of rise detectors. Basically when it gets hot quickly it'll go off. Traditionally attics are dusty, breezy and prone to false alarms. The ROR detectors work well in those conditions. A bunch of restaurant kitchens have them due to their ability to work in that enviroment

Brett

 

[jmc]

Vacuuming the detectors seemed to help with mine.

 

[bigtiller]

It isn't the air current that's the problem, it's what is being carried on the air current. Dust. Most of the lower grade detectors can't tell the difference between a particle of dust and a particle of smoke. When you switched direction on your ceiling fan, did you notice any dust on the fan blades? You could try thoroughly cleaning the fan blades and fan itself and give that a go. Or, you could just return the fan to it's original directional setting (or both).

Photo electric sensors are better than the older ion detectors. But the more basic single optic detector units are still quite prone to false readings. I'm not even sure if dual optical sensor detectors are available for stand alone residential use, but I am a commercial fire alarm tech, and that is the type of detector we install in commercial buildings. The dual detector, twin mirror units are much more reliable. You can still get false alarms, and a dirty commercial setting would still be a problem, but the improvement is significant. Also in a commercial system, you can program different sensitivity settings into individual detectors that may be in different environments.

Also, there is a new standard coming out for smoke detectors, which is even tighter on allowable false readings parameters. We have several commercial detector models that will become obsolete when the new UL standard "hits the streets".

Do you know when the new standards will come out or how we could tell the difference?

 

[QRTRHRS]

We bought a house back in May that had two of the four wired detectors missing. That and the seller had burned wood for heat LOL or is it crying out loud?

Anyway, I bought four Kidde FireX smoke and carbon monoxide units (KN-COPE-IC) and am happy with the way they "talk" to each other. The instructions even state to remove the units if you are going to make dust.

These units also tell you when they should be replaced. I never knew detectors had a ten year life?

 

[JosePerry]

Have you read the rules and guidelines before installing the device?
It is very important to install the smoke detectors in a proper way which will be good to maximize the function of the device. You should also consult an electrician to ensure this system is working the way they should to protect you. Like, last month I was also dealing with same issue I got many false alarms in the middle of the night. Then, I had searched in the local directory and called up electricians in Bala Cynwyd PA, where the team had came to my home and listened to all my concerns and then they had found that the installation place of the smoke detector was not done properly.
I think you should also consult an electrician for these tasks who will definitely ensure the exact issue.

 

[Slowpoke Slim]

Do you know when the new standards will come out or how we could tell the difference?

Bigtiller,

I'm sorry, I'm traveling a lot for work, didn't see your post. I believe the new standard comes out next December (2018). I know they pushed up it's official date from 2020, but pretty sure it's next Dec. I'll double check today by making a few phone calls. I know detectors made after the date must comply with the new detection standards, and they are tighter for both detection and false alarm rejection parameters. Which is why the new series detectors are more $ (lol). Ours have an entirely different detector sensor design to meet the standard.

4570man,

Environment plays a big role in false alarms. For an attic detector, I would strongly recommend a thermal only detector, with no smoke sensor component. A standard rate of rise heat detector should work fine in a residential attic location.

And yes, national fire code (NFPA) says you must replace your detectors every 10 years. Whether they need it or not, given you any problems or not, replace them. But for residential applications, most folks are lucky they remember to replace the battery every year (lol). It's even difficult to get commercial customers to understand they have to replace their detectors every 10 years. "But, they're working". Is usually what I hear. Of course, some of our systems literally have 100's of them (hospitals, hotels, schools, etc). So, it's an expense to be sure, but life safety equipment is different than just ordering a new flat screen TV for over the bar at the hotel. It's hard to get some managers to see the difference.

 

[Slowpoke Slim]

Do you know when the new standards will come out or how we could tell the difference?

The folks I needed to ask the official standard release date question to where all off today (Veteran's Day).

Will try again Monday.

Still going with my guess that it's Dec. 2018, but will get a confirmation.

 

[Rustyiron]

When will they come out with a S/D that tell's you when your food is "medium" rather than well done?:laughing: