Turn wheel when tipping over?

[gwstang]

OK, all this talk about tipping over makes me wonder. If on a steep hill crossing horizontally lets say for arguments sake that the top of the hill is to the left of the tractor. If the tractor were to start tipping over to the right, which way would you turn the steering wheel to possibly avoid the almost tipping over problem. This is assuming that the tractor is just feeling tipsy, not already turning over. Just wondering in case I ever get that deep into this situation. My spidey senses usually warn me and my cheeks start pinching the seat wayyyyy before I ever get to that point.

 

[Sodo]

Hard to say because no actual hillside will be perfectly uniform slope. A minor bump on either rear wheel changes everything. You need to get your center of gravity further within the triangle created by the two rear wheels and the front axle pivot. If the CofG gets out of this triangle a rear wheel lifts and when its up against the axle stops - your triangle moves downhill a little (in your favor) and and the tipping stops. Once. This was your warning. Kinda cool how that works, but you only get one warning.

Clear as mud?

Or push the FEL onto the ground and make a larger triangle, maybe even a rectangle.

 

[Yamaha2112]

Generally, my intuition (when seated) states if you feel you are about to tip right, turn right. Teetering left, turn left.
Seems counterintuitive, but the physics appear to make sense. I've definitely felt more stability in hairy off camber situations by doing so.

DISCLAIMER: This may not be technically correct information. Just my experience.
Avoid these types of situations at all costs.

 

[gwstang]

"Or push the FEL onto the ground and make a larger triangle, maybe even a rectangle. "


Interesting...but the tractor will still be stuck tipping on the hill as soon as the bucket is raised again. What to do then? Turn downhill and pray my guardian angel is working overtime?

 

[Yamaha2112]

Just noticed you have another tractor. Float the bucket (on ground like Sodo suggested) and tow her out with the other one. I've actually done this, and it worked fine.

 

[gwstang]

Generally, my intuition (when seated) states if you feel you are about to tip right, turn right. Teetering left, turn left.
Seems counterintuitive, but the physics appear to make sense. I've definitely felt more stability in hairy off camber situations by doing so.

I would agree with this, right or wrong I don't know, as I still have an old Ford 8N and have been in this situation or close to it several times. The strange thing is the new L2501 Kubota doesn't feel as stable to me on a slight hill side as the old Ford does. Maybe because I only have 35 hours on the Kubota so it doesn't feel as comfortable as the Ford does that I have hundreds and hundreds of hours on? I realize the new Kubota is 1000X safer with the ROPS/Seatbelt than the old 8N. Could be I am just too chicken to get the "new" machine dirty on the wrong end up. :laughing:

 

[Yamaha2112]

Being chicken is definitely a good thing from what you're saying. :thumbsup:

 

[ultrarunner]

Don't forget to swing the hoe to the high side and put down a stabilizer on the low side... works if you have time... at least it saved me once...

Another time I was on a not so steep area and the grass covered a deep chuckhole... turned the wheel quick down hill and stayed upright... it was quite a ride though... kind of like Mr. Toad's wild ride to the bottom.

 

[gwstang]

Just noticed you have another tractor. Float the bucket (on ground like Sodo suggested) and tow her out with the other one. I've actually done this, and it worked fine.

Thanks, I was considering such (if it ever were to happen). But, what do people do that only have one tractor? Leave it on the hill and get a cable wench to jack it out with or at least get it straightened to go up or down vertically on the hill? Of course in this scenario, I am thinking of being down in the woods in a rough environment where only a tractor could go (I have such an area because the EF4 tornado tore up much of my poor 71 acres four years ago and it is a big mess way back on the backside and it is quite hilly back there. Some steep down below the pond where two creeks come together. It is pretty wild down in there. I would like to open up some trails down in there like it use to be. Probably a bad idea anyway. **** deer know just where to go and hide when the season opens. I use to be able to get a couple of 8 points every year or two (have seen bigger, just not where I could shoot). Just scalds my arse that I can't hunt like I use too. There is another mile or so of woods behind my property so we had lots of deer for many years. I am slowly reclaiming much of it but there are those hills to navigate and I could easily get into a bad situation down in there. Last year (before I got the Kubota), I was bush hogging the main trail that I had opened up using the old 8N and at the end of the trail I would stop about 60' or so and turn around. Well, the brakes on the N didn't do so good a job that time and I just about went over a rather high embankment into the creek. Scared the *%^* out of me. Nothing like standing up on the brake and it ain't braking too good. I had forgotten to adjust the brakes a little tighter from the last time I used it. I did finally get 'er stopped with plenty of room to spare. I then drug a large log to the end of the trail to be sure I had a stop way back from the bank. I sure as heck didn't tell SWMBO about it.

 

[Sodo]

"Or push the FEL onto the ground and make a larger triangle, maybe even a rectangle. "


Interesting...but the tractor will still be stuck tipping on the hill as soon as the bucket is raised again. What to do then? Turn downhill and pray my guardian angel is working overtime?

Lots of things can be done (before asking the SWMBO to be the counterweight).

Stop and think about how you can get some counterweight. Go get some heavy weight, sandbags and put them in the uphill end of the FEL. Ratchet-strap a heavy log to the bucket that's hanging WAY off on the uphill side. Lift the bucket a little and see how stable it is.

Get a plank to drive up on (on the lowside) & back out. Attach a cable & chain & a come-along to the top of the ROPS from a nearby tree so if it starts to tip it can only go a little bit.

 

[gwstang]

Don't forget to swing the hoe to the high side and put down a stabilizer on the low side... works if you have time... at least it saved me once...

Another time I was on a not so steep area and the grass covered a deep chuckhole... turned the wheel quick down hill and stayed upright... it was quite a ride though... kind of like Mr. Toad's wild ride to the bottom.

I don't have a hoe. That would be a nice addition though. That was a quick thinking save on your tractor to react without even having to think about it. I am guessing there is no time to think when the unavoidable happens quick.

 

[Yamaha2112]

If I had only one tractor, I would put on some Depends and poop my pants while slowly steering it down the hill to get it so I could back into straight line to back up the hill.

 

[Sodo]

I would put on some Depends and poop my pants while slowly steering it down the hill

Speaking of Depends, can't always depend on being able to turn downhill. Could be a tree, could be steep, loose or have a chuckhole. If there's poop to deposit, rather than on the seat, do it in the uphill half of the FEL.

 

[Yamaha2112]

Speaking of Depends, can't always depend on being able to turn downhill. Could be a tree, could be steep, loose or have a chuckhole. If there's poop to deposit, rather than on the seat, do it in the uphill half of the FEL.

Poop = Weight/ Stuck Tractor * 1/2 Pitch + cos(θ) - ^ .1+ Poop

 

[gwstang]

Stop and think about how you can get some counterweight. Go get some heavy weight, sandbags and put them in the uphill side of the FEL. Get a plank to drive up on (on the lowside) & back out. Lots of things can be done. Attach a cable & chain & a come-along to the top of the ROPS from a nearby tree.

Hadn't thought about this stuff. Great info there! :thumbsup:

A couple of years ago a fellow that borders one side of my property (he had all his trees clear cut and stripped after the tornado and had a logging road that borders that side, of course neither of us had any trees left that were very large after the event but I was not going to strip my land like he did) was trying to drive his big Chevy dually up one of the logging trails and it was a steep hill with a sharp turn to the left. Yep, he slid off the trail to the right and was tipping to the right with the right wheels completely off the slippery muddy trail. I saw him when I checking out more of the damage way down in there and told him I would get the 8N and pull him back down hill and he could get straightened out and maybe back out of the bottom. He said no that he would get it out. A buddy of his showed up with a couple of come alongs and stood there scratching his head. Yep, no trees left to attach too. I don't know how they ever got it out (stayed there for about two weeks) but maybe a tow truck with a very long cable came to pull it out from the top of the hill. I didn't know the fellow as he didn't live there and his aunt owned that property. Still don't know why he refused my help? I would have to crawl back through the mess to get back to my house (take about 30 min of navigation) and then drive the N about a 1/2 mile down a paved road and then go down his logging road to get to him. Maybe I looked like some kind of wild man after crawling through the mess of tree trunks scattered all along the backside....lol. Interesting how he set all of his free standing stands up to aim directly toward my property line. Maybe because he doesn't have any cover left for the deer so he just shoots all of mine on the back 40. I know he has been all over back there as I have found evidence of his "visits" when he hunts. Just about to put a stop to that this year..lol

 

[Yamaha2112]

Hmm. Now I'm thinking maybe a chain(s) to a nearby tree with either bucket, 3 pt hitch drawbar, or both in some combination (not to get out, but to prevent further tipping) to get out of a bind.

I really like the log/bucket idea, but how would you get the log on in an unexpected situation?

Definitely something I'm going to try in a controlled environment.

EDIT: Just saw you already posted chain combinations, Sodo. Read it too fast.

 

[dragoneggs]

Yes, drop the FEL and shut the dang thang off and get off and think about it. There is absolutely no hurry. As they say... slow and low. And I say when that isn't working, off and thought. I have gotten myself in a pickle more than too many times (one?) where I have been traversing a slope and it seemed whatever I did it got worse (could of used Depends!) Like I said, stop, collect your wits, and think about your approach, I mean escape. Your FEL bucket and BH if you have one are your best friends at this point. Oh, and wear your dang seatbelt with your ROPS. I haven't gone over and hope I never do but strap yourself in... safest bet.

 

[Yamaha2112]

Yes, drop the FEL and shut the dang thang off and get off and think about it. There is absolutely no hurry. As they say... slow and low. And I say when that isn't working, off and thought. I have gotten myself in a pickle more than too many times (one?) where I have been traversing a slope and it seemed whatever I did it got worse (could of used Depends!) Like I said, stop, collect your wits, and think about your approach, I mean escape. Your FEL bucket and BH if you have one are your best friends at this point. Oh, and wear your dang seatbelt with your ROPS. I haven't gone over and hope I never do but strap yourself in... safest bet.

This is so true. Just by shutting off the engine and getting into a non-rushed meditative state can work wonders.

 

[My Hoe]

OK, all this talk about tipping over makes me wonder. If on a steep hill crossing horizontally lets say for arguments sake that the top of the hill is to the left of the tractor. If the tractor were to start tipping over to the right, which way would you turn the steering wheel to possibly avoid the almost tipping over problem. This is assuming that the tractor is just feeling tipsy, not already turning over. Just wondering in case I ever get that deep into this situation. My spidey senses usually warn me and my cheeks start pinching the seat wayyyyy before I ever get to that point.

To the OP's original question:

Lots of (VERY valid) exceptions to what I'm about to say were raised in this thread, e.g., if there's a large wood chuck hole on the LOW side, or a rock, etc..., on the HIGH side, things might require a different solution. And the whole "take a TIME OUT and THINK" approach (if time allows) is certainly worth it's weight in gold.

But, in the OP's original hypothetical, with all other things being equal (meaning, a uniform terrain, hilltop to the left, low side to the right) and the machine starts to feel "light" on the UPHILL side:

TURN DOWNHILL.

I know this from garden tractors, ATV's, snowmobiles, etc....

And if you think about the converse, possible reaction (i.e., turning uphill) it may help. Specifically, if LEFT is UPHILL, and you were to turn LEFT, an ATV's Center of Gravity would shift to the RIGHT, RAISING the "inside" (i.e., the UPHILL) wheels, in a LEFT turn. This is the OPPOSITE of what you want, if the DOWNHILL side is to your RIGHT.

You want the uphill wheels to get HEAVIER, not lighter.

So, with the hilltop on the LEFT, and you're feeling "tippy, TURN DOWNHILL, which would be to the RIGHT.

Now, I didn't say "ALWAYS turn down hill"--even though I wanted to) because, as someone mentioned, if there's a washout/diversion ditch/huge woodchuck den, etc..., you could turn downhill and fall into a HOLE, leaving you even worse off than you were before.

But, given evenly sloping terrain, with no holes/rocks/logs, etc..., and the UPHILL side gets "light," TURN DOWNHILL. In the OP's scenario, with the UP-side on the LEFT, turn DOWNHILL, to the RIGHT.

You asked a good question. I hope that helps.

My Hoe

 

[NoTrespassing]

This discussion is bringing back a memory I'd rather forget. While working on the road on top of our dam one day, I got too close to the edge and the dirt started to give way ever so slightly under my front wheel. The weeds were disguising the edge and I thought I had a few more inches than I did. The back of the dam is very steep and if you start to go, there would be no stopping it. I couldn't turn the steering wheel at all to back away from the edge for fear of that front wheel have nothing under it at all. I was glad to have hst that day and very very carefully backed straight up along the edge of the dam until I was safe again. My stomach gets queasy even now.

I really want to get down to the back side of the dam one of these days to recover about 2 tandems of gravel and stone that have washed down off the road over the years. Problem is I will have to make a "road" as I go and the overgrowth hides the holes and ruts. Maybe one of these days I'll get brave or stupid enough to try it.

Kevin