Loader Need help getting this thing started

[shdybrady]

I have a yanmar 1810 and it wont start. I have been having this problem off and on for awhile now. In the past I could always charge the battery or jump the battery off and it would work. Now I cant even do that. I can jump across the starter solenoid and the starter will engage. My dash lights wont come either. They only way I can get it started is to pull it with my truck and put it in gear. If I shut it off it wont start back up. I am thinking its a grounding issue, alternator or the voltage regulator. Any tips for diagnosing it?

 

[normde2001]

Get yourself a volt/ohm meter and learn to use it, for starters.

 

[shdybrady]

I am an electrician got that covered

 

[normde2001]

So...how many volts in your battery? Is your battery grounded? How many volts getting to the starter with key in "start" pos?

 

[FleetMan]

This may sound extremely basic and maybe insulting depending on your spirits at the moment but a year or so back I had a very similar and frustrating problem with my 1820D. The problem turned out to be corrosion on the battery posts which insulated them from the battery cable terminal end connectors. I did all my voltage checking on the battery posts and everything would always show good and I just could not understand the "nothing" when I tried to start it normally. I must have wiggled one of the connectors when attempting yet another jump start and that finally led me to the corroded battery posts and the root cause of my "no start" problem. Hopefully, yours turns out to be something simple too.

 

[tman1020]

I also had battery corrosion on a 1702. To the point it loosened connections and would not start. I missed it at first but after a while of head scratching and starting over my diagnosis I found it. Felt tight at first and didn't look that bad until I really inspected. Good luck.

 

[clemsonfor]

BAttery corrosion is irrelevant if your jumping directly to the starter. Your grounding the thing out on the frame and putting power to the solonoid termanal that needs 12v to start the tractor. It will start this way even without a battery. I think you may have a short in wireing and or blown fuses which is the reason your key wont work.

You probably have a bad battery and why it wont jump wireing directly to the starter with jumper cables is beyond me unless its totally burnt/locked up (the starter that is).

 

[shdybrady]

Alright it took me a bit to get out there and work on this thing. I knew the batter was dead because I have been having this problem for awhile and it has sat. I hooked my positive via jumper cable to my truck battery. I grounded it to the frame. Went to go start it and it turns over one revolution and nothing. So she is trying to turn over.

Checked with my multi better and I am getting 12v to the starter solenoid. Turn the key and only getting 2-3 volts on the wire coming from the switch and the post going to the starter. Opened up the dash and checked the feed to the switch and I get 12 volts there as well until I turn the key and it drops to roughly around 3-4.

Being the switch is trying to turn the engine over when connected to a battery I am assuming it is functional. So my suspects are the starter solenoid but most likely the voltage regulator. It seems to me the voltage regulator isn't sending enough power to fully turn it over. Is there any other testing I should do or is it pretty conclusive?

 

[shdybrady]

UPDATE: I went out and tested the other wires in the pigtail coming off the voltage regulator. I have 12 volts on everything except the black which I am assuming is a ground. Correct me if I am wrong but that tells me I have 12V through the generator to the voltage regulator and through the voltage regulator. So the voltage regulator seems to be operational. Being I am getting 12v to the switch only 2-4v leaving the switch and only 2-4v at the starter solenoid. It seems the switch may actually be the problem. Can a switch only allow partial voltage through? I figured it would be an all or nothing kind of deal.

 

[R Barger]

Jump from the hot post coming into your starter to the small terminal on your solenid. If it starts I'd be looking at the ignition switch or a bad neutral safety switch.

 

[zzvyb6]

Get yourself a volt/ohm meter and learn to use it, for starters.

You can use it for starters, headlights, trailer lights, battery condition, finding that one bad Christmas tree bulb and even using the probes for digging out slivers.:laughing:

 

[shdybrady]

When you say jump across the hot post and the small terminal, are you referring to the small terminal going to the ignition switch? I did just across the two large post on the solenoid and the starter will engage. I will try doing that as soon as the rain lets up

 

[shdybrady]

Went out with the multi meter and wrote down everything. Here is the list

Starting system pathway

Battery 12.4->Hot post on starter 12.4->White red at voltage regulator 12.4 off/11.9 on->White red at switch 12.1 off/12.1 on->Black white at switch .08 off/11.9 on ->Black white at starter 0 off/1.9-3.4 on->Starter 2nd post 0 off/ 1.9-3.4 off

Obviously between the black and white wire at the switch to the starter I am loosing power. I will be testing the safety switch here shortly.

Voltage readings on other wires at voltage regulator
The 2 blues to generator 1.1 off/ 6.4 on
Yellow to the horn 0 off/ 11.8 on
Yellow/green to battery discharge lamp 0 off/ 11 on
Black to generator 0 off/ 0 on ( I am assuming the tractor needs to be running for me to be getting a reading on this wire)

Voltage readings of other wires at the switch
White/black to fuse box 12.3 off/11.9 on
Double black 0 off/ 12.3 on
Black 0 off/ 12.3 on

 

[shdybrady]

The key is still trying to turn the tractor over when connected to my truck. I jumped across the two post on the starter and the starter does engage. When I try to jump across the hot post on the start to the black/white wire coming from the key switch it does the same thing as if I was turning the key it self

 

[shdybrady]

Alright went out and tested the safety switch. I am getting 12v on one wire which I am assuming is coming from the key switch. The other wire gets 0v until I turn the key then it gets 2-3v. That's where I am loosing my voltage. I unplugged it from the safety switch and still doesn't crank. Pushed my lead through the jacket of the cable leading to the starter and still getting 2-3v. Obviously there is something wrong with the wire and the switch may be fine. The wire must be shorted somewhere or just horrible deteriorated. So tomorrow I am going to run a new wire from the starter to the wire coming from the key switch and temporarily bypass the safety switch and see if she cranks.

 

[clemsonfor]

If a starter is bad won't it draw the volts down real low like that?

But Yea I would jump it at the starter to rule out all the other. But I suspect a switch or faulty wireing.

 

[shdybrady]

I will splice the cables together at the safety switch and disconnect and test. If i am still getting 2-3v I will disconnect the black and white wire at the starter and see if I get a full12v there. If I do that will let me know my problem lies in the starter or the solenoid

 

[shdybrady]

alright this morning I went out and bypassed the clutch safety switch and ran a new wire. Still getting 2-3V.Disconnected the wire from the 2nd post on the solenoid that goes to the starter and tested it. Was getting 11v there. So that tells me the starter has a drain on the battery that causes it to drop to 2-3 v. I am going to check the wire that comes out the starter and see if that is grounding to the case of the start it self. After that it must be something internal. I am going to have it bench tested to confirm. For anyone who sees the post in the future, before bypassing the clutch safety switch like I did, just disconnect the wire at the 2nd post and see if that gets 11-12v there. By doing this you are testing everything from the battery to solenoid. If you get 12v you know that your problem is the starter. I worked from the battery and followed the charge to the starter. You would be better off starting at the starter and working your way backwards. The first time you find 12v you know you have found your problem.

 

[shdybrady]

Does anyone know of a replacement for the starter instead of going through hoye tractor? Nothing against him just trying to see if there is a cheaper option or a faster one.

 

[normde2001]

You do realize the VR only functions with the engine running , do you not? Also, you need 12.5-6 volts to start, not 12.