Buying Advice Need a tractor to move my docks!

[legrandice]

Here are my requirements:

Need to lift 1000lb dock sections off a trailer and move them around.

To move the tractor around I have a smaller trailer:
Weight capacity of 3000lbs so I would like to be around 2500 or so for the tractor and loader
5' by 10' rough dimensions

I am currently looking at a Mahindra 26XL hst lift capacity of 1402 with the loader

Are there any other options that would have equal lift capacity at the pins?

Thanks in advance for any feedback.

 

[hosspuller]

What are the dimensions of the "docks" Remember the lift at the "pins" is reduced by the moment arm of the load.... And the attachment weight.

 

[Xfaxman]

:welcome: to TractorByNet! :thumbsup:

What is the length and width of the dock sections?

1402 at the pins decreases drastically as the load gets further out.

You also have to include the weight of the bucket or forks.

Is this a one time job?

 

[boggen]

are you moving them in/out of the water?

can you simply back the trailer down into the water, and let the docks float?

how far you need to reach out to pick them up, how high you need to lift them up. is part of the equation...

more info you give the better answers you will get.

 

[tractorshopper]

The loader lift capacity for that tractor is very impressive and I can see why it is appealing to you. As others said, the further out front the load center is, the lower the weight you can lift, so if the dock sections are large/wide, you may want a forklift instead where the load is usually much closer to the machine and it's weight.

You will probably be overweight for your trailer. The weight listed for the 26XL that I could find is 1,819 lbs. That is pretty light, and I'm sure is just the tractor weight not including the loader. I'm not an expert here so take it for what it's worth, but my L3800 is listed at 2,668 lbs. That is without the loader, which I believe is about another 800 lbs, so I'm already at 3,400 lbs for the tractor and loader. Then you need to consider whether you want filled rear tires for all that loader work and additional ballast for all that loader work. The only way I can comfortably get the maximum work out of my loader is by having rear wheels filled (~400 lbs) and having my box blade attached (550 lbs). That puts my total tractor working weight about 4,300 or 4,400 lbs. I have a 16' trailer and my tractor with loader and box blade takes about the whole platform and to center with proper tongue weight, the loader actually rests on the tongue forward of the platform a couple feet. I can hardly tow it with the bush hog on because it's further out and off the back and I would be looking at 20' trailer if I had it to do again. The trailer is rated at 7,500 lbs and weighs about 1,500 lbs by itself, putting my total trailer load at nearly 6,000 lbs of the 7,500 it's rated for.

Just wanted to give you an idea of things to consider as you choose the right tool for what you're doing and then consider safely trailering what you end up choosing.

 

[legrandice]

:welcome: to TractorByNet! :thumbsup:

What is the length and width of the dock sections?

1402 at the pins decreases drastically as the load gets further out.

You also have to include the weight of the bucket or forks.

Is this a one time job?

I should have provided more information in the original request.

The dock sections are 20' by 4'. They are not 1000lbs, but are pretty heavy. I don't have an exact figure.

My current tractor is an ingersoll 6018 with home made forks inside the bucket. I am able to lift the sections with this tractor, but can't move them. My current practice is to lift them and drive the trailer underneath. This way I don't need to move the tractor. I borrow a 20' by 8' deck over snowmobile trailer that I load 2 dock sections on at one time. I then back that down the ramp and into the water. I want a tractor that can lift the sections up and move them around.

I need to have at least 80" of lift height
With the forks on I need to reach 24", but that should be as close to the pins as possible.
lift capacity highest as possible
total tractor weight around 2500lbs

We put in and remove the docks each year so they are not damaged by the ice.

I will try to find some pictures when I am back on my computer.

 

[Poopdeck Pappy]

Unless those docks are quite a bit less than 1,000 pounds, I don't think you're gonna find a 2500 pound tractor/loader that will do the job.

Your limitation is the trailer, which seems to be the tail wagging the dog in my opinion. My advice is to buy a tractor/loader that will do the job without being at the extreme edge of its capacity, and then buy a trailer with sufficient size and capacity to handle the tractor.

 

[boggen]

ya down to slim pickings. trying to get just enough tractor to do this or that. and then compounded with the trailer.

i would say get tractor that meets your needs, and then sell off current trailer for a trailer that meets new tractor needs as far as weight. but then the question is due you have enough truck to pull both larger trailer and tractor on the road?

you say moving the docks, i am going to assume on uneven ground (dirt / rock / gravel) were you will hit ruts, or tires will sink. that alone going to push for a bigger tractor so you do not roll / tip the tractor over. bigger tractor = more overall weight, more lifting power, mower counter balance weight, hopefully wider tractor, to help stabilize the tractor when moving.

bigger issues come up when floating dock gets a leak or like in one of the pontoons, and needing to lift the extra weight of water in the pontoons if need be.

=============
at moment backing up trailer underneath the docks (when docks held up by tractor), might be the best way of doing things. once you start trying to drive with a 20' x 4' dock. or anything that big, it is going to want to "swing" and rotate on you. and the need for a second person holding onto some rope to control the dock as you move with tractor. that extra swinging / rotating / and even some bouncing is going to put some stress on the dock frame work, causing nails / screws to want to come loose, resulting in possible damage to the dock over time. even metal frame work is going to take some stress and possibly warp / twist on you.

 

[LD1]

Just because the loader says it can lift 1400#, doesnt mean it can if the tractor isnt up to the task. And at 2600#, it ISNT. You need substantial weight hanging off the 3PH and fluid in the tires. Which will push you over the 3000# mark.

To my knowledge, I dont know of any tractor with a trim weight of 3000# that will lift 1000# to max height. The weights just arent in the right place to do it safely and move around.

That max you are looking at, (assuming you meant 28xl) is gonna be 2600# with the loader. And to lift 1000lbs to near max height safely, I would want no less than loaded tires and 600-700 lbs hanging off the 3PH. Thats gonna put you in the 360-3800# range.

My tractor with loader weigh in the 3600# range. And I wouldnt even attempt loading that without loaded tires and my 700# blade. Puts me over 4500#

So depending on how far off your guess of the dock weights are, I am afraid that the machine you want just doesnt exist. But its hard to size a machine without knowing exactaly how much you want to lift either. A few hundred pounds makes a huge difference.

 

[LD1]

I would also question towing a Max28w/loader on a 3k trailer as well. Being 3k, I am assuming a single axle landscape trailer with a mesh gate. Not what I would choose. You are looking at spending $10-$15k on a tractor, dont be foolish on the trailer.

 

[boggen]

custom made cheap mini trailer...perhaps boat trailer or i should say, dolly with caster wheels.

two, 2x6's 20 foot long, some cross members below that. to attach caster wheels to. ((guessing a larger rubber caster wheels)) some eye bolts or like for tie down or lifting points.

let the dolly go down into the water, float a dock on to it. pull it up and out. and then turn tractor around for use of 3pt hitch forks. (lift both dolly and dock) up as a single unit. if need be set down were needed, and push it about with FEL or edge end of a fork. you would need a dolly for each dock.

===========
running gear = the metal frame work and wheels, that are under hay wagons. add a couple extra frame work out each side. (no deck) might be an option, 2 docks per unit. over winter. (just leave docks on the running gear.)

 

[legrandice]

WOW! I never expected this level of feedback. I appreceiate all of the information. Let me add some pictures to the mix. I am able to lift and move all of the dock sections with the ingersoll 6018. Not the smartest thing to do..but it can be done. I have a lot of counterweight on the back and use the bucket to hold the dock so it does not move while moving. I lift all of them from the top using a 4x4 spreader and lifting straps. I am very aware that i am lifting way above what my tractor is capable of, no people are around the sections while in the air. The ground is very level field. It drains very well and is solid.

I have about 5 different sections that I lift. The largest has:
4 2x10x20
40 2x6x8
2 2x10x12
3 float tanks (50lbs each)
hardware: 40lbs

I have sorted this out to be around 1000lbs. The wood is all PT but dried in the sun for a summer.


medium weight section being lifted onto horses


lightest section being moved


sections on trailer

 

[legrandice]

In reading all of the replies I have gone back to the drawing board. There are a lot of factors at work here.

I am going to try and borrow a scale and get an actual weight on the heavy dock sections (not pictured).

I am also going to see what the upgrade cost on a trailer is.

The launch ramp we use is VERY steep. I need to lift the sections on and off the trailer pictured and launch them that way. I have 14 dock sections.

I have used my 6018 to lift an move the sections, so either it can lift WAY more than listed...or the sections are lighter.

Perhaps I will bring a dock section to the tractor dealer and see how it really works.

I agree that a 2300lb tractor should not be able to lift 1000lb docks.

research...research..research...then spending money!!

 

[legrandice]

My current trailer is a Worthington aluminum 6x10 3500lb axle. Weight of trailer is 450lbs. It has wood sides and is a tilt trailer.

 

[legrandice]

View attachment 391090
custom made cheap mini trailer...perhaps boat trailer or i should say, dolly with caster wheels.

two, 2x6's 20 foot long, some cross members below that. to attach caster wheels to. ((guessing a larger rubber caster wheels)) some eye bolts or like for tie down or lifting points.

let the dolly go down into the water, float a dock on to it. pull it up and out. and then turn tractor around for use of 3pt hitch forks. (lift both dolly and dock) up as a single unit. if need be set down were needed, and push it about with FEL or edge end of a fork. you would need a dolly for each dock.

===========
running gear = the metal frame work and wheels, that are under hay wagons. add a couple extra frame work out each side. (no deck) might be an option, 2 docks per unit. over winter. (just leave docks on the running gear.)

I like the idea, but our launch ramp is very steep and I fear that this design would be hard to control going down the ramp. We have to move the docks about 500 yards down a road to the ramp. I also have 14 dock sections.

 

[s219]

Have you thought about building wheels into the dock sections? (either on one end, or all 4 corners). Could be permanent or removable (so you could potentially share a set of wheels for all dock sections). I used to see that done a lot back up North. That way you can either tow them or just have to elevate one end to move around.

You really want to have a tandem axle trailer with brakes to tow most tractors of size (including the little Mahindra). And you want the deck to be long enough that you can move the tractor forward/rearward until you get the proper tongue weight.

Without brakes or tandem axles, you'd end up having an unbalanced, unstable, unstoppable rig if towing a tractor on your current trailer.

An earlier post said it best -- don't let the trailer dictate the tractor.

 

[boggen]

have similar type of dock and a raft. i leave them in in the water year round. i put a gallon of RV anti freeze into each 50 gallon drum, and a couple gallons of water. (what ever got me around 0 to 10F degrees. ) and got me about 3 to 4 gallons of fluid in each drum. (helps stabilize the dock and raft when in the water). the lumber that makes up the dock and raft, seat roughly 1 to 3 inches up off the water. (on raft i have fold down latter, that side has more weight so that one side sets a tad closer to the water). i don't have a problem with the drums freezing solid and being crushed. they just set there. granted i am on a private lake.

i could see issue if on a river. and having bigger waves from speed boats and like lifting the docks, and possibly causing the straps to come un done. then again. the strap i had to hold the 50 gallon drums, only lasted long enough, so i could flip them over, after initially making them, and slide them into the water.

temps here get -10F for up to a week in coldest part of winter. but norm more like 0 F degrees. and have not had problems for yikes 4 plus years now? maybe more *i forget when i made them it has been a few years all i remember*

 

[DuckSlayer1017]

Have you thought about building wheels into the dock sections? (either on one end, or all 4 corners). Could be permanent or removable (so you could potentially share a set of wheels for all dock sections). I used to see that done a lot back up North. That way you can either tow them or just have to elevate one end to move around.

You really want to have a tandem axle trailer with brakes to tow most tractors of size (including the little Mahindra). And you want the deck to be long enough that you can move the tractor forward/rearward until you get the proper tongue weight.

Without brakes or tandem axles, you'd end up having an unbalanced, unstable, unstoppable rig if towing a tractor on your current trailer.

An earlier post said it best -- don't let the trailer dictate the tractor.

S219 has a good idea. If you didn't want to leave wheels on all the time you could get two axles made up with wheels. Roll them into the water, float the dock over the axles and roll it out. Kinda the same idea as the running gear but may be easier.

 

[boggen]

google "atv log skidder" then click on images. there are a huge amount of different styles out there.
Northern Industrial Tools ATV Log Skid Arch and Holder | Log Skidding| Northern Tool + Equipment

one end = set of wheels and a tounge to connect to back of truck or tractor.
other end = set of wheels. that you roll over the log. to other end of it, and then chain/lift the log up. and off you go, with entire log off the ground.

it looks like you have plenty of metal end tabs on the pictures posted. so you can connect each section together while in water. figure something out, to use same metal braces / tabs for some wheels.

as long as the wheels do not spin like caster wheels in above doing. it should pull just like a hay wagon or like.

 

[legrandice]

The ice where we are moves around quite a bit. That along with the spring floods where the water rises 10-15 feet would crush my docks. Everyone in our section of the river takes them out.

have similar type of dock and a raft. i leave them in in the water year round. i put a gallon of RV anti freeze into each 50 gallon drum, and a couple gallons of water. (what ever got me around 0 to 10F degrees. ) and got me about 3 to 4 gallons of fluid in each drum. (helps stabilize the dock and raft when in the water). the lumber that makes up the dock and raft, seat roughly 1 to 3 inches up off the water. (on raft i have fold down latter, that side has more weight so that one side sets a tad closer to the water). i don't have a problem with the drums freezing solid and being crushed. they just set there. granted i am on a private lake.

i could see issue if on a river. and having bigger waves from speed boats and like lifting the docks, and possibly causing the straps to come un done. then again. the strap i had to hold the 50 gallon drums, only lasted long enough, so i could flip them over, after initially making them, and slide them into the water.

temps here get -10F for up to a week in coldest part of winter. but norm more like 0 F degrees. and have not had problems for yikes 4 plus years now? maybe more *i forget when i made them it has been a few years all i remember*