Making a Tractor Road - I've got questions

[TonyF]

You can probably get away without the pipe. No sense making it more complicated than it has to be.

 

[newbury]

The spot you can see (except that it is dry in the pic) is 7-10 feet I think. The issue I have is not so much the bumps, but the tire rut nearest the pond (and it is only 12-18 inches from steep drop into the pond) is like 6 inches lower that the other tire rut, and in 2wd (which is my default state) the tractor goes sideways slightly in the muck and clay. I would HATE to drop the tractor into the pond...

I also need the tractor road to be passable for my riding mowers.

My reference to "a few bumps" was a preface to suggesting you build a "corduroy road" out of slabs from your logs. I think your riding mowers could handle it easily AND you've got a good source for more planks.

 

[MossflowerWoods]

Here are the pics I could not post yesterday...

Shots 1-4 show the spot alongside the pond. First two are looking from the barn back up the hill, the 2nd specifically was an attempt to capture the entire section of tractor road I am working on. Shot 3 shows how close the pond is to the road (the pond is currently about 1 foot below). shot 4 shows the NOT LEVEL cross section of the road bed where the side near the barn is more firm and higher ground.

Shots 5-6 show a smaller spot up the road, near the head? of the pond, here the pond is a good 3-4 feet below.

Shots 7-8 show where the bend is that this tractor road forks off of the existing tractor road. I have a serious mud bog there right in the corner, but I can swing wide and largely miss it and drive on fairly stable ground.

This is all of the pics of my road issues thus far.

Thanks in advance,
David

 

[MossflowerWoods]

You can probably get away without the pipe. No sense making it more complicated than it has to be.

I really like this idea. I rarely actually have water flowing, what I have is a long slow seeping which takes forever to dry out.

I do not have a backhoe, but I suspect my bucket will do for my little tractor roads. I need to find a source of geotextile fabric it seems, and get some rock...

Very interesting.

Thanks,
David

 

[MossflowerWoods]

But then you mentioned the short difference to the drop off to the pond and what sounds like a slope.

You might want to stack some rocks on down slope side of this hole to act as a retaining wall for the gravel. ...with rocks/rip rap acting as a retaining wall the gravel will not move.

Given the margin for error with the pond I would be looking to at least level out that spot.

Instead of the pipe to drain the water... Check out the following document.

Later,
Dan

Dan,

The doc was interesting and gave me some ideas. I have another water/road problem I've not brought up yet that maybe those ideas might help...

There is very limited space alongside the pond and the road to place rip-rap, but I like the idea.

I also am VERY interested in ideas for how to level this section while I am doing this. because the idea I am MOST scared of is winter with snow/ice and the tractor sliding sideways... and SPLASH... I'm not even sure how deep the pond is there... I do not want to test it with my DK50... The "slope" makes me worry...

I do have an alternative route I can (and will on occassion) take, but it tears up the visible yard areas. I really need this to be an effective road. maybe even eventually one my pickup with a trailer of hay can use.

Thanks,
David

 

[sfloggie]

Dave,
A friend of mine in Arcadia, OK had this same problem. Your road is your ditch and the water naturally flows down and across the road to the ditch.

I think you need a ditch on both sides coming down the hill. The ditch on the right (uphill side) should continue down the road. We did these with a tilted box blade on my friends road.

Then you need the rock for the crown and so the ditches can do their job. That was a close one at the pond as you were inches from going in!

Jim

 

[MossflowerWoods]

That was a close one at the pond as you were inches from going in!

Jim

Jim,

I think is was actually not a close as it looks, but in 2wd it was a bit of what I refer to as a "pucker factor 15" moment... (on a scale of 1-10 )

Ice or snow would make this section impassable I feel... Too risky as is...

The "ditches" idea I am looking into, I heard a "Potato Plow" makes a good ditch. I will NEVER be ale to afford all the gravel this place COULD consume. That is part of why I made sure the tractor was 4x4... It is part of why eventually every vehicle on the property will be 4x4 (but that is another thread, not going there on this one).

Be well sir.
David

 

[Ken45101]

Jim,

I think is was actually not a close as it looks, but in 2wd it was a bit of what I refer to as a "pucker factor 15" moment... (on a scale of 1-10 )

Ice or snow would make this section impassable I feel... Too risky as is...

I would pile up the rip rap on the pond size several inches above the road level to give you a comfortable passage. Even if some of it goes into the pond.

Heck, you can even use local rocks for the fill. If you don't have enough rocks in your place, you are welcome to all you need from here

(Which is funny, I saw a Craig's list add for someone locally selling rocks from the creek at $1 each! That would make us millionaires if I could find a buyer :laughing

Ken

 

[MossflowerWoods]

If you don't have enough rocks in your place, you are welcome to all you need from here

Ken

PM me your address, I'll be right over!

:laughing:

David

 

[studor]

I have a similar situation in a couple of places. On one I used the corduroy approach since it is back in the bush and I did not want to incur any expense in maintaining what is a tractor - ATV path. It has held up well but I do not use it in the winter so no problem with snow removal or slipping sideways.
The other site I trenched on the upside and dug a trench across the middle that I filled with stone and then gravel. I dug the trench with an old rear bucket attachment I bought at an auction for fifteen bucks. After a year or so I put some gravel on the road surface and I use that spot for all types of vehicles, winter included. I think the secret is to get the water to run off as fast as possible because once it sinks into the clay it takes forever for it to dry out. The problem spots above only have evidence of water flow in the spring melt -- the rest of the year it is just a slow seep.
I fixed those spots only after getiing the tractor stuck up to the starter -- probably better to fix them before that

 

[Egon]

Try some culverts!:thumbsup:

 

[rambler]

Couple options.

When it's wet out, just don't use the tractor - farming is a sunny day sort of thing.

Get the field road to grass over - if you don't drive on it every day, a good established sod can carry a lot of weight.

Build up the field road - crowned - so it is higher than the ground surrounding it.

Put drainage across it so water on the uphill side can get to the downhill side in the low areas.

Cover roadbed with a good grass if this is more seldom used, or cover with some gravel if it is often used.

You can get all fancy, or keep it pretty home-spun simple, but basically some combination of this will be your answer.

--->Paul

 

[TripleR]

In looking at your pictures, it appears you may need to use a combination of approaches if you don't want to go with a lot of rock. One thing I would do first is move the road away from the pond if at all possible. We have one that close to our pond, but it is solid and it makes me nervous. We can't move it without a lot of expense as it has a culvert and was built too narrow by the people who put the pond in. We are going to rent an excavator some day and fix it, but there are LOTS of projects ahead of it.

Rerouting in some areas may also be an option.

With the cost of rock and good culverts, finding a cheap way to fix your roads is going to be hard.

We had a RR abandoned on our property and were able to get a lot of rock free.

Not thinking ahead, my father in law had tons of rip rap buried when he had someone come in and remove one of the bridges. I sure would like to have that now.

 

[dmccarty]

Dan,

The doc was interesting and gave me some ideas. I have another water/road problem I've not brought up yet that maybe those ideas might help...

There is very limited space alongside the pond and the road to place rip-rap, but I like the idea.

I also am VERY interested in ideas for how to level this section while I am doing this. because the idea I am MOST scared of is winter with snow/ice and the tractor sliding sideways... and SPLASH... I'm not even sure how deep the pond is there... I do not want to test it with my DK50... The "slope" makes me worry...

I do have an alternative route I can (and will on occassion) take, but it tears up the visible yard areas. I really need this to be an effective road. maybe even eventually one my pickup with a trailer of hay can use.

Thanks,
David

From the photos, it seems you have water running down the road as well as across the road, downhill from an outbuilding and towards the pond.

The water on the road can be handled by crowning the road, water bars, and/or ditching. We have problems on one section of our driveway because the driveway only has a couple of inches of gravel and as a result the driveway is at grade level or maybe a bit above grade. We need to add another inch or two of ABC to keep the water off the driveway.

I suspect you might have to add either gravel or dirt to be able to crown part of the tractor trail because of the location of the outbuilding and pond. Water bars might work too.

I used rip rap to hold the gravel in place over the culvert we have at the start of the driveway. The ABC does not move much anyway but the rip rap makes sure it does not move. I could have used rocks found on our place but time was more important than saving a couple hundred dollars. Some day I want to cover the rip rap with rocks from the property to just make it look more natural.

The section of the road near the pond, which makes me nervous too, I think could be leveled with rocks or rip rap on the pond side and ABC/gravel/dirt uphill from the rocks/rip rap. I think the rip rap on our low section would keep the tractor tractor from sliding off the driveway. The rip rap is not stacked very high above the gravel. May be single or double layer that might be 12 inches tall. It seems like you need a culvert there but it still is hard to tell from the photos. There are design rules on how big of a culvert one needs based on the area drained.

You might be able to get away with that French Blankety Thing previously mentioned.

Later,
Dan

 

[MossflowerWoods]

When it's wet out, just don't use the tractor - farming is a sunny day sort of thing.
--->Paul

Paul!

Say it is not so!

David

 

[MossflowerWoods]

In looking at your pictures, it appears you may need to use a combination of approaches if you don't want to go with a lot of rock. One thing I would do first is move the road away from the pond if at all possible.

Rerouting in some areas may also be an option.

With the cost of rock and good culverts, finding a cheap way to fix your roads is going to be hard.

RRR,

I will look at that idea of moving the road over away from the pond. There are only a few feet between the road an the outbuilding, and there are a couple trees there also I would need to grind stumps etc...

I do not want to weaken the foundation of the "barn" though... I suspect I can get a foot, or maybe 18" max.

My biggest concern is without rending an excavator, I'm not sure I will have good enough footing to dig it up with the tractor, because the only ground to work from is the current road.

I will look at this when I get home tonight.

Thanks for the thought!

Be well,

David

 

[TripleR]

RRR,

I will look at that idea of moving the road over away from the pond. There are only a few feet between the road an the outbuilding, and there are a couple trees there also I would need to grind stumps etc...

I do not want to weaken the foundation of the "barn" though... I suspect I can get a foot, or maybe 18" max.

My biggest concern is without rending an excavator, I'm not sure I will have good enough footing to dig it up with the tractor, because the only ground to work from is the current road.

I will look at this when I get home tonight.

Thanks for the thought!

Be well,

David

That sure is a problem. When my father in law first bought this farm in the late 80's, our road was very similar in one place. We got by for quite a while as we had more projects, getting ponds dug, building roads on another farm etc., but one day, I put my truck over the edge due to the mud. It was about a 20' drop off into a dry creek. I was going real slow and the truck hung on the lip.

I had to SLOWLY climb out of the high side window dragging my old bag phone with me so I could find a place with a signal to call for help.

My brother was able to hook up and pull my truck out, but it was a toss up as to whether it was going to go the other way.

We couldn't move the road very much either, so we leveled it out and put a lot of crushed rock on it.

We put all of our culverts in with a FEL, but for a small area like that an excavator sure would be nice.

I am sure some of the members with more expertise can come up with something that will work for you.

 

[displacedPA]

Moss,

I think there are some good suggestions on here. I would maybe add rip rap (rail road size rock) first then gravel on top. Like others have said I think you may need several methods on your roads.

 

[MossflowerWoods]

Moss,

I think there are some good suggestions on here. I would maybe add rip rap (rail road size rock) first then gravel on top. Like others have said I think you may need several methods on your roads.

Would you just put the rip rap down on the dirt and add the gravel on top? Won't that all just sink into the clay?

Not sure I am following you here, sorry.

I would LOVE an easy fix...

David

 

[MossflowerWoods]

You could always just build a corduroy road. It doesn't sound like your bog road is that long.

How big of logs do I need to use, and how long might it last? I'm thinking about using a corduroy road solution for the turn off bog spot and I'm wondering how big the "logs" need to be... Might actually be more work cutting and limbing the logs than digging and using gravel.

David