Can I run my FM in 2nd PTO at low RPM's...YM2000

[larhan31031]

I never exceed 1500 RPM's on my YM2000 and I have been wandering if I can use my 5' finishing mower in 2nd PTO at or below those engine RPM's to get close to the 540 needed.I know most people run these beasts at 2200 RPM's,but I just dont like reving anything close to redline...

 

[284 International]

Believe it or not, on these machines you will do more damage and cause more wear by operating at lower RPM with the same load as you will if you operate it at the recommended PTO speed. Lugging the engine is hard on bearings, and higher engine speeds circulate more cooling air, coolant, and keep the implement running where it is intended.

That isn't to say the higher PTO speeds are useless or harmful when properly used, but go ahead and run the engine at 22-2400 RPM. You're not going to hurt anything except everybody's ears.

 

[California]

I sometimes do that for powering the backhoe. It is labelled 800 rpm maximum and I can maintain below 540 at about 1200 tach rpm. It's nicer to work with a gentle purr. But that only needs about 5 horsepower.

IMHO you could do that only if the finish mower doesn't put a noticeable load on the engine. If it needs some horsepower to run it, then like 284 said stay at the intended rpm so it works without strain. The tractor is designed for it, they just didn't consider how hard that racket is on the operator. So put on good hearing protection. You won't feel a thing and you can be sure you are doing the best thing for the tractor.

 

[winston1]

I am probably wrong but I do run mine in 2nd pto at about 15-1600 rpm with my mowers when cutting is not heavy. I do pay attention to the load I am putting on the engine. I can tell you this much, my Woods RD60 finish mower with the high lift blades will just about load it. I have flattened the lift on a set of blades and it is amazing how much it lessens the load. I'm not saying the blades will cut as clean as the high lift although I can tell very little difference. I am not recommending everybody go out and do this. Just sharing what I have experienced. Another tidbit, in dusty conditions the low lift blades are great. And noise level is much less.

I got way off your subject matter but just trying to shed a little light on why I am able to run in 2nd pto range. Definitely don't want to lug your tractor.

 

[larhan31031]

Yeah 284 these boogers are loud enough at 1200,and the neighbors already hear me when I fire it up,so I gotta keep the noise down,and I mainly use it for light stuff around my yard so I never needed that much power to start with but I could'nt say no to a good deal.I figured that around 1200rpms in 2nd Pto was around 540rpms since I tried it briefly yesterday,and it sounded about right,and without straining the motor at all(mainly maintaining thin grass),but I wanted to make shure about it before using it continuously.Thanks Yall...

 

[clemsonfor]

When i use the 6ft bushhog FM i could never run it at 1500rpm, the slightes thick clump or taller stuff will stall it out or pull the rpms down way low which is not good for a deisel engine. I do only cut a few times a year in the yard at the farm property so its not my weekly or biweekly yard cutting. I will usually bushhog the fields at around 2000-2200rpms, anything less and you just cant produce the power to turn the blades through the thick stuff, not everything but if i change rpm just for thick stuff it will be constant. Fields will be ankle tall one spot and waist deep another.

I think you may have a serious carbon problem never exceding 1500 honestly.

I think the manual calls 1200 a fast idle but i cant remember now?

 

[California]

The manual for these (YM240) doesn't use English the same way we do. I think it says 'fast idle' is 2600. And minimum idle somewhere down around 600~700.

They specify working rpm (I assume they mean significant load) 1800 to 2400. I take that to mean don't let it attain full load, where it can lose rpm, below 1800.

But I don't see anything wrong with driving around unloaded etc as low as 1200 rpm so long as it runs effortlessly.

 

[clemsonfor]

The manual for these (YM240) doesn't use English the same way we do. I think it says 'fast idle' is 2600. And minimum idle somewhere down around 600~700.

They specify working rpm (I assume they mean significant load) 1800 to 2400. I take that to mean don't let it attain full load, where it can lose rpm, below 1800.

But I don't see anything wrong with driving around unloaded etc as low as 1200 rpm so long as it runs effortlessly.

Id agree with the last state ment as well as the middle. You dont want to be bushhogging at 2200rpm and then get in thick stuff and run it down to 1400 rpm, this is supposedly really hard on the bearings and can "hammer" them out from what i have heard deisel guys say.

Anyway if your not laboring at 1200 or 1300 id say your ok. For Hydro work like your doing with a back hoe i dont think this is a problem, but if your citting grass i find it really hard to think that at 1200 your not laboring the engine, unless you cut grass every 4 days around here? If i put the tractor in say high 3 it will drop rpms at that level just going up a decent hill let alone turning a finishmower cutting grass.

This is all im saying. I really dont think running equiptment in its designed range in this case say 2000rpm that your doing anyharm to it vs running at 1200.

 

[nazbom2]

I bush hog about 1800-2000 RPM's and mostly never bogs down, maybe only occaisionaly when hit a thick patch after a long interval between mows. However, I have a question, back in the day I used to help the neighbors by bush hogging fields for them. I was bush hogging a friend's dad's old cattle fields one year and hit several areas where it would bog. I would throttle up to keep RPM's up and the tractor would really be working. Black smoke would come out of the exhaust for a moment untill I got through the thick patch. How bad is it to momentarily have that black exhaust? It wasn't a common or regular event but it sure did impress me and my friend as to how awesome the Yanmar was!

 

[clemsonfor]

I bush hog about 1800-2000 RPM's and mostly never bogs down, maybe only occaisionaly when hit a thick patch after a long interval between mows. However, I have a question, back in the day I used to help the neighbors by bush hogging fields for them. I was bush hogging a friend's dad's old cattle fields one year and hit several areas where it would bog. I would throttle up to keep RPM's up and the tractor would really be working. Black smoke would come out of the exhaust for a moment untill I got through the thick patch. How bad is it to momentarily have that black exhaust? It wasn't a common or regular event but it sure did impress me and my friend as to how awesome the Yanmar was!

Black smoke means that your really laboring and making power. Its not bad but i would not want to be blowing black smoke the entire time say an hour of two but for periods even balck for say 20 mins while pulling a plow hard is not bad, your working it.

Have you ever seen a buldozer or any kind of heavy equiptment, when they load up they blow darker smoke.

A side note as long as your rpms are kept up while the black is coming out your fine, if you drop to say 1300rpms from 2000rpms that is very bad and hard on the engine. But as long as you have more throttle to give it more fuel or your govener has more gitty up to give to it and you relitivly maintain your rpms your not hurting anything.

 

[nazbom2]

In mowing my 6 acres I would be on a long pull and in the draw part where water lays more the grass/pasture grows noticably thicker, so in one pass that would say take three minutes (super rough estimate) when I would hit the draw and the grass thickens I would notice the engine labor more. I'd throttle up to keep engine RPM's up and the black exhaust would roar out. for say 10 seconds then RPM's would increase as load decresed i'd throttle down. So I'd pass this area on my way through say 20 times while mowing. I know the diesel smokes especially when work ut thought I read that black smoke is an indicator of something such as white smoke, gray smoke etc. I used to be told when diesels smoked a large amount that the "fuel was turned up" or not efficiently burning the amount of fuel per injection pulse????

 

[kemary]

I have a YM2500 and I use the 2nd speed on the pto to finish mow all the time. I brought a hand tach home from work to test the pto speeds. 1st pto speed took 2400 engine rpm to obtain 540rpm on the pto, the 2nd speed took 1980 engine rpms to make 540 rpm on the pto so that is what I use for the finish mower only, never with the brush hog. I have put 1500 hours on this machine and probably 1000 of those hours are finish mowing, never any problems. I use a Woods Rd7200 finish mower.

 

[careyo63]

Good to know thanks. I use a JD/Woods 1060R. but always just use 1st' gear Pto. and was curiouse what the Rpm Ratio actually is. I've Ran 2nd. gear I believe it was:laughing: on the 2500 a couple of times getting use to setup of the Pto. :ashamed: Not fond of it At All. I don't think the JD. is setup anything like it?

 

[driftwood]

Running at lower RPMs under a load isnt really good for your diesel. They have a governor that will not allow you to over turn them. Thats also where the black smoke comes from when your tractor gets under a heavy load. The governor gives it more fuel to help out. As said earlier youll build up a lot of carbon in the engine, & harm the bottom end in the long run. Wally

 

[larhan31031]

My yard is mostly crab grass,and I mow it every week or so,and it does'nt strain the motor at all,theres not even a grunt except taking off during the whole session.If i'm pulling my harrow or box blade i'll crank it up a bit,but I never strained it(No black smoke,or choking),it purrs along fine.My main thing is that I dont want to use it to its full potential unless I need to,kinda like buying a car and running it at redline,I feel like its bad for it if I dont need to do it constantly...

 

[winston1]

Let common sense prevail! :thumbsup:

 

[clemsonfor]

My yard is mostly crab grass,and I mow it every week or so,and it does'nt strain the motor at all,theres not even a grunt except taking off during the whole session.If i'm pulling my harrow or box blade i'll crank it up a bit,but I never strained it(No black smoke,or choking),it purrs along fine.My main thing is that I dont want to use it to its full potential unless I need to,kinda like buying a car and running it at redline,I feel like its bad for it if I dont need to do it constantly...

This makes total sense. But a little off thinking. A gas engine is never meant to run flat out or make peak horse power all the time or even half the time. A deisel is meant to get up to operating rpms and stay there or close all day making close to full power. Yea i would not want it rolling black smoke all day everyday pumping max power out but running it at 2200-2400 rpms will not hurt it, afterall pto speed 1 takes 2400 rpms to rach 540pto. Its designed that way and meant to run that way. Think of a heavy equiptment, they dont put around on it, they ildle it up to operating speed and leave it there till they stop then idle down. I work with loggers. The throttle is on a box on the side of the loader on the newer models. They idle up and stay there till they stop even sitting not moving the engine stays at operating rpms, when they pick up a heavy load the governer (well computer in this case) will increase fuel dilivery to maintian rpms and pump pressure giving you puffs of black when it re adjusts to increase power. But they dont run them at half rpms, if it made sense to work or longevity of the equiptment they would on these pieces that cost upwards of $200k.

Not saying what your doing is gonna ruin your tractor, its probly not even hurting a thing, but my point is dont be afraid of idling it up to "working" rpms. In this case your only benefit may be an increase in ground speed, but if your already going as fast as comfortable you will just use more fuel by increasing rpms and gearing down.

 

[careyo63]

I just put some time in with the FM. I was kind of looking forward to it since it was still the first of the Yr. and the grass isn't very thick. Seeing Kemary's post of Rpm's to the Pto and what Eng.Rpm's 2nd Gear Pto should run to reach 540
As for me I LOVE the sound of the 2cyl. I don't hear very well so the noise doesn't bother me :laughing: But it's good enough to hear the motor.
My finding was I ended up still at around 1900-2000 rpms. to hit the "sweet" spot for operating it in 2nd Pto. At 1800 rpms the motor was hitting harder and you could tell there was more of a "Bog down" causing the 2cyl. to hit Compression harder and actually somewhat shake the Tractor. Throttle it up to around 19-2000 rpms. and it would smooth out. I changed Trans. gears High-Low etc. and back to 1st. Pto. several times and without a doubt it there was a noticeable difference. After about a Hr. I left it in 1st. Pto at about 2100-2200 and enjoyed the rest of the day Humming right along as usual. :thumbsup:
In all honesty though Kemary is using a Ym2500 3Cyl. which I have a good bit of seat time on one. Compared to the 2cyl Yammer Hammer with 4hp.less is probly a major factor with my results. FWIW.

 

[nazbom2]

With the discussion of operating RPM's for the correct PTO speed and Power band of the engine, what engine speed are most of you using for say bush hogging or finish mowing? I would think that bush hogging would require a tad more on the power/torque end due to the mass of the blades and the probability that what you are mowing is heavier than say with a finish mower that cuts something more uniform if done regularly. I run mine between 1800-2000 RPM's based on how thick what I am cutting is. The thicker the more RPM's.

 

[clemsonfor]

I dont finish mow much but did just replace the belt on a 6ft bush hog model my uncle had (finish mower) and i way finish mowing at about 2000rpms. I bush hog at say 1800-2200 rpms.