My Property, Looking for info and comments.

[ultrarunner]

hmm, not sure , but here where i live its the same charge as the 1" meters. guess it all depends on local. i wouldn't understand why they would charge more, your paying for what water you use, not what meter you have. guess anyway they can charge more they will

I've heard it explained as a standby charge for the ability to have a certain volume of water available.

Anything above 5/8 and 3/4 is significantly more.

Could be a California thing... we also have mandatory rationing at times and water, gas and electric all have tiered pricing. Conservation is a religion which generally translates into some of the highest rates in the country.

The funny thing is people did such a good job conserving last time it was hurting the water company's bottom line so they increased the meter fees. If I don't use one drop from my 5/8 meter, the bi-monthly charge is around $65 when it's all added up.

New homes are getting hit because in most cases they are requiring fire sprinklers which requires a larger meter and corresponding charge.

A study showed if even a percentage of home fire sprinklers were activated simultaneously, the district would be lacking in capacity... like when we had the firestorm and lost 3000 homes here or one of the big quakes.

 

[grsthegreat]

I've heard it explained as a standby charge for the ability to have a certain volume of water available.

Anything above 5/8 and 3/4 is significantly more.

Could be a California thing... we also have mandatory rationing at times and water, gas and electric all have tiered pricing. Conservation is a religion which generally translates into some of the highest rates in the country.

The funny thing is people did such a good job conserving last time it was hurting the water company's bottom line so they increased the meter fees. If I don't use one drop from my 5/8 meter, the bi-monthly charge is around $65 when it's all added up.


New homes are getting hit because in most cases they are requiring fire sprinklers which requires a larger meter and corresponding charge.

A study showed if even a percentage of home fire sprinklers were activated simultaneously, the district would be lacking in capacity... like when we had the firestorm and lost 3000 homes here or one of the big quakes.

yeiks.....another reason to get out of calif.

our water bill ... 2 inch line on 20 acres runs aprox $35/,mo

electrical, no tier system...all flat 6¢/kwh

 

[ultrarunner]

yeiks.....another reason to get out of calif.

our water bill ... 2 inch line on 20 acres runs aprox $35/,mo

electrical, no tier system...all flat 6｢/kwh

Not to get too far off topic... only to show why different options make sense depending on where you are in the country.

Residential Electricity tops out at 28.5 cents per Kilowatt here

$78 buys the first 550 Kilowatts per month at 14 cents per Kilowatt

$173 buys 850 Kilowatts per month at 20.35 cents per Kilowatt

$427 buys 1500 Kilowatts per month at 28.5 cents per watt used total with tiered pricing!!!

Residential Water

$2.15 per 100 cu-ft per day if using 172 GDP

$3.27 per 100 cu-ft for all water above 393 GDP making it very expensive for home ag or livestock

In addition I pay .41 cents pumping for each 100 cubic ft.

In addition there are many additional fees for sewer treatment, city sewer pipes (Like $24 per month) and the list continues.

I remember water bills for water and sewer being around $5 a month 30 years ago... it can easily be $400 to $500 for two months with livestock and irrigation in the summer.

When we expanded the Hospital, we found significant savings by adding a second water meter as opposed to up-sizing the existing. The cost for two smaller meters in parallel is much less than one larger meter.

 

[tommu56]

Why do you suggest concrete in bags? I was going to have the local concrete company come by when they have a little extra on the truck and pour it in a form that we make.

I started reading eddiewalker's thread a while back because it just seemed interesting. Unfortunately I have not made it through 177 pages, that is pretty much a short novel!

Thanks!

The bag routine no forms stack and pin stack and pin.
Can be done as money is available with some fore thought.

2nd I like the look if its done right like a river bed stone bridge,
good for remote areas no heavy trucks till its done.

all just my opinion.

tom

 

[boggen]

the way the concrete bag technique was explained to me was....

you hammer in some rebar into the ground a foot or so maybe more. with enough sticking up for 3 or so bags of concrete.

for the concrete bags you just stab the bags over the rebar. ya never open up the bags of concrete just stab them over the concrete and set them down.

once you get so far, you get another piece of rebar and pond it through all the bags.

get a garden hose and then wet all the bags of concrete down. by just letting the water run over the bags. and with humidity and time. the concrete will set up inside the bags and become hard.

it is kinda like sand bagging a temp / make shift dam, when there are floods.
and you just alternate rows back and forth. eventually the paper material the bags come in will either rot away or get pulled away by the wind.

another way of thinking about it, ever had a bag of concrete go bad on you while it sat in the garage and became hard? just kinda taking it to the next level with the concrete stabbing over rebar doing.

==============
you could always do 6x6 rough cut lumber, you might get lucky and get seconds that are a little rough but still usable for a retaining wall.

if you went with concrete blocks, you would most likely end up filling them with either rock or more concrete. plus you would need a footer for them.

if you went with poured concrete, and you made your own forms, you would be out of lumber, or less you had the need to use some warped up plywood with concrete in it, and some moldy 2x4's.

if ya hired a concrete company i would most likely let them use there own concrete forms. for a poured concrete retaining wall.

 

[dstig1]

I'm surprised nobody's mentioned it yet - but will the local authorities let you live in the shed at all? Read Obed's thread "At home in the woods" for the troubles he ran through with the local zoning folks and living on site in a camper during construction. You are talking a much longer stretch of time than he was. You don't want to find out the hard way, and if there is something you can do to satisfy the zoning/code folks, you would be better off knowing that before you get too far. It may be as simple as meeting the basic requirement for getting a CO with whatever you do in the shed.

You have asked a lot about costs for utilities like electric and water lines. Nobody can really give you a good answer as all of those things are very much site-dependent and vary regionally around the country by huge amounts. For example: My lot will probably require a mound septic as this part of the county has poor perc'ing soils, so that is common. Probably $20k+ for that alone. Does it have any bearing on your site? No idea. So if I told you septic would be $20k based on my experience, it would probably do you no good. It really isn't worth asking about costs like that on an internet forum. You need to find out from neighbors and friends what things should cost in your area. And then getting bids is always the final word.

I'm also surprised to see city water on a 19 ac lot. Nothing outside of the cities/suburbs themselves here have city water. Like I said, the utilities stuff is all different everywhere you go...

I'd run the electric underground if at all possible. Poles in the woods is just asking for a downed line during a storm. Read Terry Dinnerman's thread Old Goat Ranch for his work on setting up underground electric at his place. If you can do the work, you should be far ahead on costs.

Should be a fun project!

 

[grsthegreat]

we have 20 acres of mine plus using another 10 acres of the neighbors, and while we don't have city water, we do have a residential water district. we share a main well and holding tanks. kind of a modified city water system,.

we so that here cause a well has to be 700 feet deep to the aquifer. this was is alot cheaper.

 

[nrc17gto]

The bag routine no forms stack and pin stack and pin.
Can be done as money is available with some fore thought.

2nd I like the look if its done right like a river bed stone bridge,
good for remote areas no heavy trucks till its done.

all just my opinion.

tom

Cool, that is a neat concept and seems simple. Thanks for that. And thanks boggen for your description. How tight of a seal would this make? Would there be seepage that could eat away underneath my drive? I'll check the price of the concrete in bags but the local concrete company said they would sell me some that was left on the truck for about $40/yd.

Nick

 

[nrc17gto]

I'm surprised nobody's mentioned it yet - but will the local authorities let you live in the shed at all? Read Obed's thread "At home in the woods" for the troubles he ran through with the local zoning folks and living on site in a camper during construction. You are talking a much longer stretch of time than he was. You don't want to find out the hard way, and if there is something you can do to satisfy the zoning/code folks, you would be better off knowing that before you get too far. It may be as simple as meeting the basic requirement for getting a CO with whatever you do in the shed.

Thanks for this info. I will need to see what I can find out about a CO. One reason I am building this garage so big (other than future use) is to meet the restrictions of the property. That is also the reason I am putting vinyl siding on it instead of just metal.

Have most people had good luck with a well? That may be a vague question but I just wanted to see a general opinion. I just hate the thought of going through that process and the water having sulfur in it.

Thanks!

 

[ultrarunner]

Only have one well and it provides wonderful water... part of the reason I bought the property.

Living in California, it seems we are never too far from a cycle of water rationing.

I was able to pick-up 80 sacks of concrete that had hardened due to improper storage... used them under a berm and so far they are holding great.

The county used to do a lot of creek and spillway reinforcement with concrete in burlap sacks... the concrete would bind right through the burlap and very stable.

They can no longer do this because of concerns of fouling the water...

 

[boggen]

well water, it all depends on the well. someone a mile down the road could have very bad well water. while another mile down road might have good water, and next mile down road might have bad water.

i'am not saying 50% doing. i am just saying it depends on the well.

the shallower the well is. meaning say 50 to 100 feet deep, is more likely to have problems with surface water contamination. the deeper the well, less chance of surface water contamination.

if i had a choice i would most likely go with a well. so i don't have to pay monthly bill for water. some folks need to place a water softener on there well water. some put a whole house doing. and some just do for the kitchen sink and refrigerator (so ice and if fridge gives cold water) and leave showers, toilets, garden hose hook ups to plain old well water. and perhaps on a automatic dishwasher might get a water softener.

other folks in bad situations, go with different types of filters. to remove containments. some times it is costly some times it is not.

when a well is initially done. you will and should pay for getting the water tested, over the first every so months for a couple years. so you know how the well behaves. most places i have read, note you should have well tested yearly. to make sure nothing has changed in the well. some do, and for me, i don't. well i take that back. when i noticed a slight different taste i did a well test. ((a rock gave way at the top and allowed rain run off water to go into the well )) ((it is a old hand dug well brick line, nothing like the new wells that get put in))

 

[beeforty]

With your own well, you too can be a water district! :laughing::laughing: But you can pump a lot of water for very little electricity. I have a very shallow well, 29'11" but it's clean water excepting for the iron. Almost Vin Rose Blanc in a white bucket:laughing:. So I get to pull my pump when the line splits (once), when the foot valve stops holding the water from flowing back into the well after building up pressure(once), when the pump goes out (2 in 23yrs), or the air tank bladder goes bad. All said and done it still worth it no chemical taste like some city water.

 

[grsthegreat]

i had a choice between a well or association water when we built. our accessible water is about 700 feet down (other water between surface and 700' is owned thru farmers water rights). the cost of a 6" well with large holding tank, a deep water pump and a holding tank pump, complete was about $30,000 - 14 years ago.....

cost us nothing to hook into a 2" water meter with the association. we bay a minimum of $35/mo for water....up to $65 in the summer months.

it would have taken 60 years for my own well to pay off. I could have gone for a smaller well, but i didnt even bother getting a price.

also the idea of free water from a well isn't correct in some places. first the power to operate the pump on deeper wells. Second is alot of jurisdictions are making even private well holders place meters on their wells and are charging or regulating water use. All wells in Idaho have to be registered and monitoring is going into effect.

it all boils down to where you live and how scarce water is/has/is pretending to become.

 

[dstig1]

it all boils down to where you live and how scarce water is/has/is pretending to become.

Exactly. Wells are very common outside the cities here, and generally no trouble. There have been some contamination issues with some old landfills in a few spots, and there is an area in So. Minn that has contamination issues with Farm runoff due to an unusual aquifer condition, but for the most part, around here, you can count on a good well at not-crazy depths. The aquifers appears to be pretty uniform in an area if the neighbors are good, you should be too.

Again - all comes down to where you are...yet again... Notice a theme here?

 

[sandman2234]

Again - all comes down to where you are...yet again... Notice a theme here? [/QUOTE]


Mt. Juliet, TN was mentioned in his very first post on this thread...
David from jax

 

[dstig1]

Uh yeah...that's my point. I don't know bupkiss about the local conditions in Mt Juliet TN, and I doubt anyone else on here does either. So asking those type of questions won't get you very far, other than some broad generalities and things to watch for (which is helpful, of course). A well could be an excellent option for the OP, or it could be the most expensive boondoggle he's ever gotten involved in. None of us will know, as the only answer is to track that stuff down locally. Site conditions are the "most local" of any issues when it comes to construction.

 

[kebo]

Good video, but that culvert ain't doin' squat for you

It's not big enough in diameter either. I think the water flow in a very heavy rainstorm could easily exceed the flow of that pipe. There are formulas for calculating the size of pipe you would need for a heavy water flow, but I don't know where you would find them. Maybe a bridge building site??

 

[nrc17gto]

Uh yeah...that's my point. I don't know bupkiss about the local conditions in Mt Juliet TN, and I doubt anyone else on here does either. So asking those type of questions won't get you very far, other than some broad generalities and things to watch for (which is helpful, of course). A well could be an excellent option for the OP, or it could be the most expensive boondoggle he's ever gotten involved in. None of us will know, as the only answer is to track that stuff down locally. Site conditions are the "most local" of any issues when it comes to construction.

I appreciate your response and I do get it. I knew coming into posting this thread that my costs will not be the same as someone in Kansas, for example. I am looking for some good general knowledge and so far have received a lot. TractorByNet is great. I will keep posting throughout my journey (and it will be a long one) unless there is a reason I shouldn't.

Thanks!

 

[dstig1]

Cool. Hope I didn't come off like a putz there...wasn't my intention. Just trying to set expectations reasonably. You've gotten some good info here already. The more you ask, the more you learn... And make use of the local building inspector/dept. Many of them are very helpful and can be a great asset if approached nicely.

 

[ultrarunner]

Cool. Hope I didn't come off like a putz there...wasn't my intention. Just trying to set expectations reasonably. You've gotten some good info here already. The more you ask, the more you learn... And make use of the local building inspector/dept. Many of them are very helpful and can be a great asset if approached nicely.

I find a non-adversarliy approach generally works best... I say generally because one inspector was so incompetent I called his Boss... the guy didn't last the week.

Generally, if you start out saying you live here and want the work done right... everything will fall into place. The inspector can be very helpful and even make suggestions on the options available.